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Anderson Cooper 360 Degrees
Israeli Security Cabinet to Vote Friday on Ceasefire-Hostage Deal; Frustration Grows as California Wildfire Victims Try to Return to Their Homes; FAA Delays Flights Due to Falling Debris from SpaceX Starship. Tech CEOs Slated To Appear At Trump Inauguration; Biden Warns Of Looming Threats From "Tech-Industry Complex"; Giuliani Reaches Settlement With Two GA Pollworkers He Defamed; Community Brigade Led By Surfers Help Battle CA Wildfires. Aired 8-9p ET
Aired January 16, 2025 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
STEPHEN EDWARDS, LOST HOME IN MUDSLIDE: Why the water didn't get set up. There may be a lot of questions about that.
NICK WATT, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): This might never be rebuilt.
EDWARDS: They'd have to completely rebuild the hillside. Cost millions of dollars and that, you know, my poor neighbors.
WATT (voice over): Steve wants to return to the Palisades one day. But for now, he's playing a borrowed piano in someone else's home. "Bridge Over Troubled Water," makes sense.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WATT (on camera): Now, from this angle, Erin, you can really see just how close the fire came to this house. I mean, feet away. Miraculously, didn't burn, mudslide a couple of days later. Steve, as I said, wants to return. He's realistic. He knows it's going to be a few years -- Erin.
ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: Gosh, it's unbelievable. All right, Nick Watt, thank you very much.
And before we go earlier, I said Rudy Giuliani was convicted of defamation. I want to be clear. It was a civil case, which means he was found liable for defamation. Thanks for joining us. AC360 begins now.
[20:01:02]
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST, "ANDERSON COOPER: 360": Tonight on 360, breaking news after the Israel-Hamas ceasefire deal hit's a snag. When the holdup was where the, where hold up was and the effect its having on both the timetable and the hostage families.
Also, President Biden warned about the US becoming an oligarchy. We'll tell you which tech billionaires will be on the day for Trump's inaugural. Professor Scott Galloway joins us.
Also tonight, Rudy Giuliani has reached an agreement with the women he defamed to settle the $150 million judgment against him, the trial he now avoids and what he no longer has to give up.
Good evening.
Thanks for joining us. We begin tonight with breaking news on the next steps, now, potentially just hours away in the ceasefire and hostage deal. Tomorrow, the Israeli Security Cabinet will vote on it. Saturday, the full Cabinet will pave in the way for phase one of the three phased agreement to begin now.
These Cabinet votes had been delayed, with Israel blaming Hamas for going back on parts of the agreement, which Hamas denies. Now it appears they are on. And CNN's Jeremy Diamond is in Tel Aviv for us tonight.
What is the sense there about whether the Israeli Cabinet is going to sign off on this deal?
JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: Well, Anderson, earlier today, the fate of this cease fire agreement was suddenly thrust into a state of uncertainty as the Israeli Prime Minister's Office insisted that Hamas was making last minute demands and delaying a Security Cabinet vote to approve this deal.
Now, you know, hours later, everything seems to be back on track. The Security Cabinet will vote tomorrow. The full Cabinet will vote on Saturday night, and the Israeli prime minister does appear to have the numbers. But that doesn't mean that he's not dealing with a political crisis at the same time, one that risks upending his coalition government altogether as the Israeli finance minister and the National Security minister, both far right members of Netanyahu's governing coalition are threatening to leave the government altogether over this ceasefire agreement.
And clearly, the Israeli prime minister wants to maintain his coalition. He's met with Smotrich, who represents the biggest potential threat at this point to his future as prime minister several times this week to try and get things back on track.
So, the ceasefire agreement does appear to pass the Cabinet, but still some uncertainty about the fate of his governing coalition.
COOPER: And if these two more far right members do carry through on their threats and quit, what happens to the government?
DIAMOND: Well, listen, they do have the numbers to collapse this coalition government. The Israeli prime minister has an eight-seat majority with his government in the Knesset. These two lawmakers, together, they have 13 seats. So, they have the power to do so.
Smotrich has yet to decide if he wants to take it that far. So far, he has said that he is seeking assurances from the Israeli prime minister that he will go back to fighting the war in Gaza once the first phase of this agreement is complete, meaning that six week ceasefire, during which time will see 33 Israeli hostages come out.
You know, if they do indeed choose to move forward with that threat, it doesn't mean the Israeli prime minister stops being prime minister all of a sudden. He's also been offered a lifeline by the opposition leader, Yair Lapid, to come in. But that would effectively be handing the fate of the next elections to his opposition.
So, the Israeli prime minister really doesn't have a lot of great options right now. His best hope is to find some kind of agreement with Smotrich.
COOPER: And if there is an agreement and the timetable moves forward, when would the first hostage be released?
DIAMOND: Well, Sunday is the implementation date that they've been targeting right now. There is a possibility that it could slide to Monday, however, given the fact that the Israeli Supreme Court is going to need about 24 hours in order to process any opposition petitions to the release of the Palestinian prisoners who will be released in exchange for those Israeli hostages.
So, a little bit of uncertainty about the timing. But one thing that's really important to bear in mind, Anderson, is that until that ceasefire agreement goes into effect, the war in Gaza is very much still continuing.
Since this ceasefire was announced, Gaza's Civil Defense says that 83 people have been killed by Israeli airstrikes over the course of that period of time, 23 of them children. So the suffering and the killing is very much still continuing in Gaza right up until the moment that that ceasefire actually goes into effect.
[20:05:14]
So for the people of Gaza, for the hostages, there's no question, Anderson, that any delay in Gaza right up until the moment that that ceasefire actually goes into effect. So for the people of Gaza, for the hostages, there's no question, Anderson, that any delay could potentially be affecting their lives.
COOPER: Jeremy Diamond, thanks very much. Joining us now is Israel's former ambassador to the United States, Michael Oren. Ambassador, thanks very much.
Do you think this deal is going to get done?
MICHAEL OREN, FORMER ISRAELI AMBASSADOR TO THE US: I think the deal is going to get done, and I think it's going to be not easy for Netanyahu. But he'll squeeze by, he squeezed by previously you know, ministers like Smotrich, as mentioned by Jeremy Diamond, because he is the Treasury minister. He's from a religious Zionist, very right wing party. He maybe can't be bought, but he could perhaps be rented.
There are things he wants. He wants maybe more money for settlements in Judea and Samaria, in the West Bank. And there -- its politics. And, you know, Israel is not the United States. The prime minister is not the commander-in-chief. He has to get approval of an inner Cabinet and then a broader Cabinet in order to make this decision. And there's going to be a lot of horse trading going on.
But at the end of the day, the majority of Israelis want the deal as painful as conflicting as they are, because we know we're going to be releasing Palestinian terrorists from jail who have killed Israelis. You have to go to those families and say, listen, you know, this guy is going to get a hero's welcome home, but your loved ones are still on the ground and they're going to go off to be terrorists again.
We know that people who orchestrated October 7th, Yahya Sinwar was in an Israeli jail. We let him out in previous deals. So, it's very, very painful and we also don't know how many of these hostages are coming home alive.
COOPER: I mean, is there a full accounting that Israel -- has Israel ever gotten from through the Red Cross or directly?
OREN: Absolutely not.
COOPER: No.
OREN: Absolutely not.
COOPER: Which is obviously, you know, against all international regulations and the Red Cross hasn't had access to them. What -- the three phases, I'm wondering what you make of this actual plan and the chance that one of these phases may fall apart?
OREN: Well, Hamas has always violated the ceasefires. They violated the ceasefire on October 7th, 2023, there was a ceasefire. It violated the last ceasefire of November 2023.
So, the chances that Hamas would violate the ceasefire again are very, very great, especially if you have all these different factions in Gaza. And Hamas will say, we're not in control of them, they're going to start firing.
Phase one, 33 hostages, 42-day ceasefire, releasing 1,300 prisoners, terrorists from Israeli jails, additional aid for Gaza. All of that looks very good on paper. The second phase would cause for a further Israeli withdrawal from the Gaza Strip.
Right now, that first phase calls for Israeli troops to withdraw from very densely populated areas.
COOPER: It would be a complete withdrawal of Israeli troops.
OREN: Over a second and third at the end. That's it. The war is over. And then Hamas can basically say, we're going to come out of the tunnels and were going to retake the Gaza Strip.
COOPER: The talk was in the third phase. There would be a plan. I know Blinken has put forward a sort of outlines of a plan, for the reconstruction, for the rebuilding and the ruling of Gaza. I mean, there's a lot of -- what would that even look like? I mean, is Hamas, I mean, are they so degraded that they are not at power there anymore. That seems unlikely.
OREN: I don't think so. And maybe one thing missing from Jerry Diamond's report was that Hamas is still firing. They've killed something in the order of 60 soldiers over the last couple of weeks. They keep on firing rockets at Southern Israeli communities. It is still a military force, and there are entire battalions --
COOPER: So did they talk about --
OREN: -- Hamas have not been degraded at all --
COOPER: -- a reconstituted Palestinian authority in the first phase, somehow coming in, or an International force from, you know, UAE or Qatar coming in.
OREN: Well, to be fair, what the Biden administration wanted was a reconstituted Palestinian Authority. It's a very corrupt and ineffective body and have it come back into Gaza and assume some type of administrative role. Back in 2005 --
COOPER: They got beat by Hamas.
OREN: Within a matter of days, even though they had received a tremendous amount of American military training. It all went down the drain in a matter of days. The question is, is the Palestinian Authority any more capable today of assuming those responsibilities.
The Israeli government, I'm not a spokesman, but this is pretty much what they want. They would like to have local administrators, Palestine administrators, who are not affiliated with Hamas, take over the daily running of the Strip and have an international force, particularly with a large inter-Arab component from the UAE, Egypt, other countries come in and actually take care of the general reconstruction of Gaza. There's a lot to be constructed.
But security control would remain very much in the hands of Israeli Security Forces and the IDF, and they're not going to outsource that to anybody else.
Nobody knows at this point, Anderson, what's it going to be. The assumption would be on the part of the government is that phase two and phase three are a very, you know, two bridges very, very, very far.
COOPER: Yes, Ambassador Oren, I appreciate your time. Thank you.
OREN: Thank you.
COOPER: Two of the many people hanging on every new development are Adi and Yael Alexander. They're the parents of Edan Alexander, an Israeli-American soldier with the IDF who was born in Tel Aviv, raised in New Jersey.
He is 21 years old. His parents join us now.
I appreciate you coming back on the program. How, first of all, how are you both doing? How do you believe -- I mean, do you believe a deal will actually get made, that this will actually happen?
YAEL ALEXANDER, MOTHER OF HOSTAGE EDAN ALEXANDER BEING HELD IN GAZA: Hi. Good evening. The deal is going to happen. Like, we are going to see something on Sunday or Monday. We're going to start seeing releases of hostages. It's very -- it is very emotional.
Like yesterday, I was sitting watching the television, seeing the prime minister of Qatar giving the statement that the deal is on. And then President Biden and you know, and I'm crying and I'm not like it's very, it's very emotional to know that the deal is coming.
We are not sure that our son is in the list, and we don't know when we are going to see him.
COOPER: Have you gotten any word about your son?
ADI ALEXANDER, FATHER OF HOSTAGE EDAN ALEXANDER BEING HELD IN GAZA: Yes, the -- if you remember, Anderson, the Thanksgiving weekend, Hamas released this video. That was a first sign of life for us. We haven't seen our son for more than a year.
But other hostages that were released back in November of 2023, they saw Edan in n the tunnels. And, he was seen also on October 7th, being taken into those tunnels. But we saw him for the first time on Thanksgiving Saturday.
COOPER: And Edan is not expected, I assume, to be in the first group of hostages released. It's being done by age and sort of physical condition, I think if somebody is wounded. How concerned are you about, you know, the potential deal if it happens staying intact long enough so Edan will be released
A. ALEXANDER: We have to stay hopeful and just to convey the message to the negotiating teams, both Qataris and Israelis and our American team. Do not wait those 16 days in order to move to a second phase.
We have to start to negotiate immediately for the second phase five minutes from now. So, hopefully between now and 42 days from now, we will see our son getting out.
COOPER: What impact do you think the incoming administration had on getting this deal so close to being done? There's a lot of credit being given, I mean, obviously, like the Biden administration has been working on this a long time, a lot of others have.
And President Trump made forceful comments, and a lot of people have credited those comments with pressuring both Israel and Hamas and Qatar and others.
A. ALEXANDER: I feel that it had a great impact. Actually, using the January 20th as a deadline, it was a great thing that was never done before. No deadlines in a negotiation.
It dragged for so many months and the firm language from the President-elect Trump was absolutely necessary.
We have to be tough with the enemies and with the friends, including all the friends, including Israel and it worked this time.
COOPER: Yael, what do you want people to know about Edan?
Y. ALEXANDER: Edan is a beautiful kid. He's so friendly, so caring. I just, you know, I miss him so much. I dream about him a lot. Like, I dream about the moment that I'm seeing him. And I can just hug him. And just to tell him, like, how much we love him and how much we fight for him.
And you know just -- our family is so torn and, you know, it's very, very tough. Like, we want him back, like, I can feel it's coming, but we are still not there and we have to continue to push and to fight until he will be back home to Jersey and all the hostages, all the other hostages that are --
COOPER: He'll be incredibly proud of you. How far, how much you fought.
Y. ALEXANDER: I don't know if you remember, but I remember the day that we saw you in Tel Aviv.
COOPER: I remember.
Y. ALEXANDER: And we stopped the car and we jumped on you and we were like, oh, my God, we are hostage family. We came from America and this and that. And we were like, on the way to meet Blinken.
COOPER: Yes.
Y. ALEXANDER: And this is the day that we got the announcement that Edan is a hostage, like it was such crazy days in Israel.
A. ALEXANDER: And finally we're there.
Y. ALEXANDER: Yes, I'm feeling this is it.
[20:15:10]
COOPER: I remember that day very, very well.
Adi and Yael, thank you so much. I appreciate it.
Y. ALEXANDER: Thank you so much.
A. ALEXANDER: Thank you.
Y. ALEXANDER: Good evening.
COOPER: I hope you get good news quickly.
Coming up next, the Los Angeles fires and the people just want to get back into their neighborhoods and see their homes. And what's become of them.
Later, Professor Scott Galloway on the rise of the tech billionaire. It's not just Elon Musk. The others, how close they're getting to the new president, including on inauguration day.
And, breaking news in the skies over Florida. Something has apparently gone very wrong with one of Elon Musk's SpaceX rockets. It is impacting commercial air travel tonight. The very latest on that next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well, the wind and fires have died down in Southern California. The fallout from it, though, is in full force. A virtual community meeting just wrapped up on the Eaton Fire, with officials saying that 90 percent of structures in the fire zone had already now been searched for the remains of any victims -- human remains.
We showed you some of that difficult work in Altadena two nights ago with that urban search and rescue, those teams that are going inch by inch over every damaged property, searching for human remains.
Also, firefighters are out there, still continuing to deal with any hotspots they encounter. Literally going up and down mountains, searching foot by foot in the ground for underground hotspots that they put out.
[20:20:19]
Separately, law enforcement officials today allowed some residents in the Eaton and Palisades evacuation zones whose homes did not burn, to return. For those who were not so lucky, though, it's a different story.
CNN's Veronica Miracle has more.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MAYA RICHARD-CRAVEN, FAMILY UNDER EVACUATION ORDERS: Absolutely devastating to not even be able to see your own home after such a travesty.
HORST EDELAHARDT, LIVES IN ALTADENA: I've been here for 20 years. So, where else do I go?
VERONICA MIRACLE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Many Eaton fire victims are feeling frustrated tonight.
ANNEMARIE PAZMINO, HOUSE DESTROYED IN EATON FIRE: I didn't take anything for myself. I didn't take anything.
MIRACLE (voice over): Thousands of homeowners ordered to stay away from their property, not only because of downed power lines or leaking gas but because --
ROBERT LUNA, LOS ANGELES COUNTY SHERIFF: There are areas that we are holding because we believe there may be deceased victims there.
MIRACLE (voice over): And public health officials say a lot of the debris left behind is dangerous. DR. NICHOLE QUICK, CHIEF MEDICAL ADVISOR, LA COUNTY DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC HEALTH: Initially, toxicity from any of the high levels of particulate matter and ash in the air can cause respiratory irritation. But we're also concerned about some of the potential impacts from heavy metals or long-term impacts.
MIRACLE (voice over): Still, many feel unsatisfied.
MIRACLE (on camera): Do you see a lot of the hazards, though, and what they're contending with? Some of the toxic ash in the air?
EDELAHARDT: That is all, besides that -- there's nothing tough. I smell it all day. So what?
RICHARD-CRAVEN: Dirty air to us is like, but what about our homes?
MIRACLE (voice over): But officials are pleading for residents to follow their guidance until they mark areas safe.
QUICK: We know people feel very strongly, they want to get in there. First and foremost is follow the, you know, the advice on all of those agencies that are going to come in and look at the home.
MIRACLE (voice over): Days after the devastation, officials scrambling to help frustrated Angelenos receive insurance payouts.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We want them to start the claim process immediately.
MIRACLE (voice over): The county now gathering and posting photos of individual losses from the Palisades and Eaton Fires on a website for residents that need proof of destruction for their insurance providers. Insured or not, many fire survivors have nowhere to turn, and some are making personal appeals.
MIRACLE (on camera): All over Altadena, we are seeing signs like this pop up in front of peoples burned out homes. They're leaving their QR code that links directly to their GoFundMe pages so that if you're here, you can scan it and donate immediately.
MIRACLE (voice over): In the meantime, the Pazminos and many like them wait for news from their insurance companies to see what of their former life they can rebuild.
PAZMINO: These people have lost everything. It's not just us. Its everybody.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
MIRACLE (on camera): Incredibly difficult, Anderson. But all day that we've been here, we have seen utility crews making repairs, firefighters cleaning up as best as they can to make the area safe and 70 percent of the damaged homes have now been assessed.
So the evacuation zone has actually shrunk a little bit as a couple of hours ago. And so, some people have been able to come back. Of course, here in the burn zone where the worst damage is, it will be at least a week before people will be able to come back in.
And then, of course, three to six months in terms of cleanup and repair -- Anderson.
COOPER: Yes, long road ahead. I appreciate it. Thank you so much.
More breaking news tonight.
The upper part of SpaceX's giant starship rocket, which was expected to take one lap around Earth and splash back down, exploded not long after its seventh test flight launched from South Texas.
The falling debris has caused fallout, serious problems for commercial aviation. CNN's space and defense analyst, Kristin Fisher joins us now with more.
So, this was an unmanned test flight of a SpaceX rocket called Starship. I just want to show those images again. Commercial aircraft is being impacted, I understand according to the FAA. What more do we know about this?
KRISTIN FISHER, CNN SPACE AND DEFENSE ANALYST: Well, the cause is still going to be under investigation and will likely be for some time, Anderson. But I mean, just look at that. I mean, that is a massive debris field from the biggest, most powerful thing that humans have ever made that has ever flown in the sky, let alone space.
So, this is going to be a really big investigation by the FAA. You know, I should point out that half of the mission was a huge success. This rocket is two parts. The super heavy booster and then starship on top.
The super heavy booster is what returns to earth first and is caught back on the launch pad that it lifted off from by those two big chopsticks.
SpaceX successfully did that for the second time. Starship, the top half is what, typically, they haven't had any problem with, so it was definitely a bit of a surprise when about eight minutes into launch, Anderson, you started to see some of those engines on Starship flaming out.
So it likely had something to do with some kind of engine failure. But SpaceX is now going to have to investigate.
[20:25:11]
And of course, the FAA is going to be investigating too. So maybe a while before SpaceX can fly again.
COOPER: Elon Musk a short time ago posted online some video of the debris raining down and added, "success is uncertain, entertainment is guaranteed."
In terms of setbacks, I mean, I guess they anticipate a certain amount of setbacks. Is this, I mean, for the company, much of a setback. He later posted that he doesn't foresee this delaying a scheduled launch next month.
FISHER: Yes. So the "excitement guaranteed." That's something that Elon Musk likes to say before a lot of these launches. And yes, I mean, excitement did happen. I'm curious to think what a lot of the folks who have been delayed have their flights delayed at, you know, Miami or Fort Lauderdale. The FAA reporting that they've had flights delayed about an hour at those airports.
So, you know, I don't know if they think that this is excitement that's been guaranteed. But, you know, this is going to be an investigation by the FAA.
But look, you know, SpaceX, this is how they advance their technology. They like to push these boosters and rockets and spaceships to the very point of failure, because that's where they believe they learned about that rapid iterative development.
Some people are going to see this and say, you know, this is a huge failure, but SpaceX is going to say, look, we made a lot of changes to this rocket. We learned from the previous version. We learned where some of its points of failures are and so this is going to help us do what we ultimately want to do, which is land humans on the moon and Mars.
But without a doubt, it's going to take a little bit longer, most likely before they can test that Starship again.
COOPER: And I assume the debris is coming down in unpopulated areas, I mean, that's what I --
FISHER: I mean, it came down, initially it started to break up over the Caribbean, but I mean, there are -- this was supposed to splash down, where it has splashed down in most of the other test flights, Anderson, in the Indian Ocean. So, there are reports of debris streaking across the sky in Turks and Caicos.
It remains to be seen if this debris was raining down in areas outside of the hazard zone, that that was initially specified, Anderson, so that will be part of the FAA investigation.
COOPER: Yes, Kristin Fisher, thanks so much.
Coming up next, a look at the top leaders of the tech community who've decided to friend the president-elect and attend his inauguration.
The question is how much money and influence may be in it for them.
And just a week after two different judges held Rudy Giuliani in contempt, the disgraced former mayor reaches a surprise settlement agreement with the two Georgia election workers he defamed. Details ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:31:48] ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: A source tells CNN that Google's CEO will attend the president-elect's inauguration Monday. Just the latest tech executive to do so. Randi Kaye has more.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)
DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENT-ELECT OF THE UNITED STATES: Everybody wants to be my friend.
RANDI KAYE, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Everybody appears to include big tech CEOs. Suddenly, names like Zuckerberg, Bezos, and Cook are on the guest list at Mar-a-Lago and will soon be on the days for President-elect Donald Trump's inauguration.
ELON MUSK, CEO, X: President Trump must win to preserve the Constitution. He must win to preserve democracy in America.
KAYE (voice-over): Billionaire Elon Musk was the first tech giant to jump on the Trump train and is now one of his key advisers. Meta's CEO Mark Zuckerberg, who removed Trump's Facebook and Instagram accounts for two years after the January 6th riot, has gone all in on MAGA. This was him earlier last week.
MARK ZUCKERBERG, CEO, META: One of the things that I'm optimistic about with President Trump is I think he just wants America to win.
KAYE (voice-over): Large tech employers like Meta and Google have rolled back their DEI practices too, trimming the headcount of minority workers, which critics say caters to the right and Team Trump. And most recently, Zuckerberg announced Meta would be doing away with its fact-checking.
ZUCKERBERG: Fact-checkers have just been too politically biased and have destroyed more trust than they've created.
KAYE (voice-over): Trump's response?
TRUMP: I think they've come a long way, Meta, Facebook. I think they've come a long way. I watched it. The man was very impressive.
KAYE (voice-over): The New York Times is reporting that Zuckerberg is even co-hosting a party at Trump's inauguration, along with longtime Republican donor Miriam Adelson and others. Zuckerberg did nothing of the sort for President Joe Biden's inauguration or at Trump's 2017 inauguration.
Amazon founder and Washington Post owner Jeff Bezos also has a history of being at odds with Trump. Yet this was Bezos last month.
JEFF BEZOS, EXECUTIVE CHAIR, AMAZON: If we're talking about Trump, I think it's very interesting. I'm actually very optimistic this time around.
KAYE (voice-over): That's from a guy who once suggested he could send Trump to outer space on one of his Blue Origin rockets, after he'd been on the receiving end of Trump's ire for months. Bezos, Zuckerberg, Apple CEO Tim Cook and Google CEO Sundar Pichai also courting Trump as he begins his second term.
Cook has reportedly personally donated $1 million to Trump's inaugural fund. Amazon, Meta and Google have also ponied up $1 million for the inaugural fund.
TRUMP: If you look at Google lately, I think you can see they've become much more inclined towards Trump. They're starting to like Trump, because they're starting to get it.
KAYE (voice-over): All this wooing and the cash that goes along with it has earned these tech CEOs a seat on the world stage, front and center for Trump's inauguration. TikTok CEO is also expected to attend the inaugural festivities as Trump considers a possible TikTok ban.
Randi Kaye, CNN, West Palm Beach, Florida.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
COOPER: You saw Mark Zuckerberg there on Joe Rogan's podcast last week. Another comment he made during the interview was about why masculine energy, his phrase, was so important. He said, quote, "I think corporate culture was really trying to get away from it".
Those comments were discussed by my next guest, Scott Galloway, along with tech journalist Kara Swisher on their podcast Pivot. Here's what Swisher said.
(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)
[20:35:05]
KARA SWISHER, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: What I don't get -- and this is the one part, and this is a personal message for me -- is all of you have children. And Mark, you have three daughters. You are not a good parent right now to your daughters. What you're doing is reprehensible to your children.
You're going to regret what you're doing right now and the words that are coming out of your mouth for reasons I don't know. Get off social media. Get off of interviews. Everything you say seems stupider and stupider. It's shameful what you're doing.
Especially -- you know, if you had sons, I think it's shameful. But it's particularly shameful when you have three daughters.
(END VIDEOCLIP)
COOPER: Well, perspective now from Scott Galloway, professor of Marketing at NYU Stern School of Business, also host of the Raging Moderates podcast, and as I mentioned, co-host of Pivot with Kara Swisher.
Scott, Kara Swisher obviously feels very strongly about Mark Zuckerberg there. What -- I mean, when you heard that Elon Musk -- well, Musk makes sense, but Jeff Bezos, Mark Zuckerberg, other tech leaders are seated on the dais at the inauguration. Did that surprise you at all, given what we've seen over the last couple of weeks?
SCOTT GALLOWAY, PROF. OF MARKETING, NYU STERN SCHOOL OF BUSINESS: I would describe it as shocking, not surprising, when the same people who gave zero to the inauguration committee for Biden, who so far, as far as I know, have given zero to the Wildfire Relief Fund, all give $1 million to the Trump inaugural committee and go up there to sort of bend a knee.
We've gone -- feels like we've gone full oligarch. It's kind of disappointing because I just don't think these individuals necessarily support his policies. But you could argue most generously they're being good fiduciaries for their shareholders, recognizing that if they compliment and support the president and give him and his inaugural committee money, they're going to see a return on that.
But that's basically an oligarchy. So I think it's shocking, but not surprising.
COOPER: And you think money is at the root of it for Zuckerberg? I mean, he's got plenty of money.
GALLOWAY: Everything, as far as I can tell, you always bet on the money thing. It's -- I mean, a lot of us would do that for a lot less, but what's the point of having all this money if you're not going to stand up for principles?
The most generous thing you can say about Mark Zuckerberg right now is that he's being a pragmatic billionaire and totally focused on shareholder value, as are, to be fair, Jeff Bezos and Tim Cook. But at some point, what's the point of having all this money if you can't stand up for traditional American values?
Or quite frankly, just stick up the middle finger to someone who's trying to intimidate you or threaten to put you in prison.
COOPER: TikTok is also hosting an event during the inaugural festivities to celebrate influencers who campaigned for Trump. I know, obviously, the app CEO is also expected to attend the inauguration. They're set to be banned in the coming days by U.S. law, though now there's a scramble from both parties to extend the deadline, possibly stop the ban altogether.
What are you reading to the CEO being there? Does that -- that's also, I guess, purely transactional?
GALLOWAY: Jeffrey Yass (ph) gave, I think, $100 million to the GOP Senate campaign, and all of a sudden, he's one of the largest investors and owners, American owners, in TikTok, and all of a sudden, we're reconsidering a law that was passed by 80 senators.
And in a great, serious succession, Logan Royce (ph) says in a negotiation with his children, you are not serious people. Are we a serious country when the president signs a ban against a foreign adversary, and then on the eve of the ban, we blink?
What happens the next time we're negotiating a trade agreement or trying to negotiate them not invading Taiwan? Are we a serious people? We're blinking. We're scrambling. They called our bluff.
COOPER: I'm wondering what you thought when you heard Biden talk of a looming threat from a tech industrial complex.
GALLOWAY: I thought it was really appreciative. It reminded me of Eisenhower's warning of an emerging military industrial complex. There's too much power in too few hands, and we have a technology sector that is the most powerful people, the most powerful companies with almost no regulation.
And, you know, as you know, Anderson, I think a lot about young men. We have the deepest-pocketed, most well-resourced companies in the world all trying to convince young men they can have a reasonable facsimile of life online with an algorithm.
I have a 14-year-old son. TikTok -- the average 14-year-old is spending 17 hours a week on TikTok.
COOPER: It's terrifying.
GALLOWAY: I mean, it is a real threat. And social media, which has no regulation, continues, in my opinion, to increase teen depression, teen anxiety. And we're just watching it all happen. When we look back on this era, we'll regret income inequality. We'll regret the concentration of power, the weaponization of our elections.
But the things you and I are going to regret, unfortunately, I think this will be figured out because your kids are so young. But the thing my generation will regret is how did we let this happen to our children?
COOPER: But the thing I worry about with my kids, who are now four and almost three, is with AI. You know, if every job can be done better by some machine, and I'm talking, you know, five years from now, what do most people do? I mean, what do you strive for?
And, you know, the tech, the AI people say, well, you know, you have time to really become the, you know, to focus on what you're really interested in. But like, what do you -- like there is something good about striving.
[20:40:06]
There is something good. I mean, there's a lot good. I spent a long time, you know, pursuing something and working hard for something. If a machine can just do it, I'm terrified about like, what does everyone do?
GALLOWAY: In terms of AI, I'm actually an AI optimist. And with every technology, there's short-term fear about job destruction, about elevator operators or automation. Automation did destroy some jobs in the manufacturing sector in the short run, but we couldn't envision heated seats or car stereos.
And over the longterm, there's now more jobs in the global auto industry than before. I think AI will follow the same cadence as every technology, destroy some jobs in the short term, but create more jobs because there'll be so many opportunities.
And the advice I would give to anybody who's worried about losing their job to AI is AI is not going to take your job. Someone who understands AI is going to take your job. So put another way, I think your kids are going to have a hard to imagine and even better life than you or me, in part because of these technologies like AI, which will create a lot of prosperity and a lot of jobs. I'm an AI optimist.
COOPER: Yes. Well, all right. That makes me happier. I'm glad.
Scott Galloway, thank you.
GALLOWAY: Thank you.
COOPER: Well, coming up, Rudy Giuliani reaches a settlement with the Georgia election workers he defamed. We'll have details ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:45:31]
COOPER: Rudy Giuliani has reached a settlement with the two Georgia poll workers he defamed. The announcement came the same day a federal civil trial was set to begin on whether he would have to give up some of his prized possessions as part of a $148 million jury decision.
Kara Scannell has more.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)
RUDY GIULIANI, FORMER TRUMP ATTORNEY: I have no regrets at all. I'm on the side of justice, right, and truth.
KARA SCANNELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): No regrets, says former Trump attorney Rudy Giuliani. That was back in July at the Republican National Convention when asked about the two Georgia election workers, Shaye Moss and Ruby Freeman, who sued him for defamation.
KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Are you worried about them being able to seize your New York apartment, your Florida condo?
GIULIANI: Didn't I explain to you that I'm not afraid of anything? Because I'm on the side of justice and right. And when history writes about this era, I'm going to be a hero.
SCANNELL (voice-over): In the days after the 2020 election, Giuliani falsely accused the pair of corrupting the vote count in Georgia.
GIULIANI: They're surreptitiously passing around USB ports as if they're vials of heroin or cocaine.
SCANNELL (voice-over): None of that was true. Moss and Freeman testified to the January 6th committee about the anguish unleashed by Giuliani's accusations.
SHAYE MOSS, GEORGIA ELECTION WORKER: I don't want anyone knowing my name. I don't go to the grocery store at all. I haven't been anywhere at all.
RUBY FREEMAN, GEORGIA ELECTION WORKER: I've lost my name, and I've lost my reputation. I've lost my sense of security.
SCANNELL (voice-over): A jury agreed that Giuliani defame them.
GIULIANI: I owe $145 million.
SCANNELL (voice-over): Ordering him to pay a nearly $150 million judgment. Then in October, he was told to turn over some of his most valuable possessions, including his multi-million dollar Manhattan apartment, a collection of watches, a signed Joe DiMaggio jersey, and a 1980 Mercedes once owned by Hollywood star Lauren Bacall.
Then this January, the judge ordered them to go to trial. At stake was even more of Giuliani's possessions, including his Palm Beach condo, where he says he currently lives, as well as four World Series rings, three of which he claims he gave to his son.
Today, with the trial set to begin, the parties were able to reach a settlement, with Giuliani posting on X, "I have been able to retain my New York co-op and Florida condominium, and all of my personal belongings". Calling the whole episode unfortunate.
The two election workers called the past four years, quote, "a living nightmare", going on to say, "We have reached an agreement and now move forward with our lives".
(END VIDEO TAPE)
COOPER: Kara Scannell joins us now, along with Former Federal Prosecutor, Elie Honig, who's a CNN Legal Analyst. Do we know -- Kara, I mean, do we know how much -- how this happened? Like who paid the money? Did somebody pay the money? Do that -- like, how much they settled for?
SCANNELL (on-camera): That's still the big question. The settlement notice does not indicate the dollar amount here. But the underlying question has been, these women have been in court fighting for this settlement, to get the money that they were owed. And then we just find out on the day of the trial expected to start, that there is a deal here.
You know, everyone is wondering where the money came from, how much money it is. You know, we don't know the answer to that, but we do know that on X, a few days before the trial started, Trump had posted, save Rudy. And we just don't know what kind of reaction that got.
COOPER: There are only -- I mean, how does this work? You know, if you're awarded $150 million, say, in the settlement, you're only -- they were only likely to get a fraction of that. I think his New York apartment was for sale for like $6 million. His Florida place, I don't know how much that, was --
SCANNELL (on-camera): $3.5 million.
COOPER: I don't know how much a Joe DiMaggio jersey goes for.
ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Yes.
COOPER: I don't know anything about -- is it authenticated? Like, I don't know. Check the authentication on that.
HONIG: Yes, I have some questions about that. It is a sad reality of our legal world that you can get a mammoth judgment, $150 million here. But the reality is, how are you going to collect? And it wouldn't surprise me at all, especially given the comments we just heard. It's been clear.
We've seen Ms. Moss and Ms. Freeman. They've been interviewed. They've spoken publicly. I don't think they were looking to enrich themselves off this. I think they were just looking for some measure of justice.
And it wouldn't surprise me if they looked at this and said, let's just be done with this guy. He's been torturing them for years. He's been lying, cheating, playing games with his assets. And so if they were given enough that they could just get him out of their lives, it wouldn't surprise me that that was the end calculation.
COOPER: Kara, what happened this morning in court before the settlement was reached?
SCANNELL (on-camera): So this was weird. At 9:00 a.m., this trial was supposed to begin. This was about the providence of the World Series rings and the Palm Beach and whether he would have to give up that condo. Giuliani was supposed to be on the stand at 9:00 a.m.
The courtroom had reporters in it. His attorney was walking in the hallways. No one knew what was going on.
[20:50:02]
Giuliani, though, posts on X a video of a Pomeranian dog, Vinny, who's wearing a tie, putting -- there's the video of it. He's at Mar-a-Lago, and Giuliani writes that Vinny is looking forward to spending more time in D.C. to be with his favorite president.
So that's happening as Giuliani's supposed to be on the witness stand. Then court is adjourned. 1:00, they come back, and then it hits the docket that a deal has been reached. But really, no further explanation of what was going on, other than the fact --
COOPER: Was the Pomeranian part of the settlement? Like was he going to have to give up the Pomeranian or the tie?
SCANNELL (on-camera): I mean, I hope not, but it sounds like he's going to D.C.
COOPER: And this is not Giuliani's only legal problem.
HONIG: Yes. He has a pile of legal problems. But again, on paper, it looks like he's faced accountability, but reality's been different. I mean, he's been sued over and over, yet he still has his lifestyle. He's not living poorly.
He has his homes, his -- maybe his dog, his World Series rings. I mean, think about the indictments, right? Rudy got indicted in Georgia. That case derailed itself because of Fani Willis. He's been indicted in Arizona. That case is moving like molasses.
And one thing I was reminded of just yesterday or two days ago, when Jack Smith's final report came out, he reminded us there were co- conspirators. Remember, Rudy was, I think, co-conspirator one. Jack Smith makes a big deal in the report about how serious their conduct was. Never indicted, though.
So, ultimately, Rudy got charged and accused of a lot of things, but I'm not sure how much he's actually been held accountable.
COOPER: Yes. Well, I wonder what he does now in the new administration. We'll see if anything.
Kara Scannell, thank you. Elie Honig as well.
HONIG: Thanks.
COOPER: Next, how surfers are helping the firefighters in their communities in Southern California.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:56:04]
COOPER: At least 9,500 firefighters are on the scene in Los Angeles County. They've been doing remarkable work for more than a week now. Working with them are members of what's known as the Community Brigade. Many of them are surfers who volunteered to be kind of a community watch for fires and fire prevention.
Gary Tuchman has their story.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)
GARY TUCHMAN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Their passion is surfing off the Southern California coast. But Keegan Gibbs and Tyler Hauptman also have a passion to save lives.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's been this cultural challenge to get people to understand that it's the little things that you do that make a big difference.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is the worst fire I've ever seen.
Keegan and Tyler are two of the founders of the Malibu-based L.A. County Fire Department Community Brigade, a group of dozens of volunteers, mostly surfers like Keegan and Tyler, who work in close conjunction with the fire department to rescue and evacuate victims during a fire and make houses safer before a fire.
KEEGAN GIBBS, DIRECTOR OF OPERATIONS, COMMUNITY BRIGADE: The Community Brigade program was born out of Woolsey, the Woolsey Fire in 2018, out of a recognition that us, homeowners, residents, need to take more responsibility for our decision to live in a high-risk area like the Santa Monica Mountains.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm heading (INAUDIBLE) right now.
TUCHMAN (voice-over): This video was shot by the Community Brigade as members encountered flames from the Palisades fire. The brigade leaders said they helped to evacuate hundreds of residents.
On this road on a Malibu hillside, several houses were destroyed, but this home has no damage. The owner of this house had previously gotten together with the brigade, learning about home hardening.
TYLER HAUPTMAN, WILDFIRE MITIGATION SPECIALIST (NFPA): Home hardening is a methodology to protect your home and mitigate your home from wildfires.
TUCHMAN (voice-over): Critically important, keeping flammable vegetation more than 5 feet from your house. The brigade founders went back with us to the house that did not burn.
GIBBS: Remember how -- this was a lot heavier, remember? It was like --
HAUPTMAN: Yes.
GIBBS: It was up into the window almost before. And wow. See, you know, we -- the second time we visited, it was still high, and we were like, hey, remember, bring this down because if it ignites up against the window. She brought it all down, it ignited, burned, didn't even spread to the ones next to it.
TUCHMAN (voice-over): Not leaving windows and doors open, putting one- eighth inch mesh screens over vents, other crucial pieces of advice, the brigade preaches to residents all over Malibu. Regarding this house.
GIBBS: It's absolutely tragic to see the scale of devastation on this, but this is the glimmer of hope.
TUCHMAN (voice-over): But there is a sad irony to what Tyler Hauptman went through while he was helping so many others.
TUCHMAN: Tell me about your home.
HAUPTMAN: Well, it's like a thousand square foot home. My wife designed the whole thing.
TUCHMAN (voice-over): Tyler's home burned to the ground. When houses are close together in neighborhoods like this one, your home hardening efforts are much less effective if your neighbors aren't doing the same. Because if a neighbor's house catches fire, a flaming domino effect dramatically increases the chances yours will too.
HAUPTMAN: It's just really hard to process still. TUCHMAN (voice-over): But both Tyler and Keegan continue on helping people, dealing with the aftermath of this fire. Many hours of work, which they combine with their day jobs and their surfing.
HAUPTMAN: Anytime there's Santa Ana winds is usually when the surf's great, but it's also the most terriest (ph) fire conditions. So we've missed a lot of good days for sure.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
COOPER: Gary Tuchman joins us now from the Pacific Palisades. I saw some of those guys out there in the Pacific Palisades. Talk about the connection between being a surfer and being in the brigade.
TUCHMAN (on-camera): Yes, Anderson, it's very common for avid surfers to know a lot about the environment, about ecology, about meteorology, about wind speeds, about wind direction, and that's all information that will help save lives.
Something also important to mention, for people in Malibu who get in touch with the brigade and say, please come to my house, help me, give me information, help me harden my house, the cost of that appointment is zero. It's free.
COOPER: Yes.
TUCHMAN (on-camera): So these brigade people are very noble people.
COOPER: Yes.
TUCHMAN (on-camera): Anderson?
COOPER: Gary Tuchman, thank you very much. Appreciate it.
A reminder, if you want to help those affected by the Los Angeles area wildfires, go to CNN.com/impact.
That's it for us. The news continues. The Source with Kaitlan Collins starts now. See you tomorrow.
