Return to Transcripts main page

The Lead with Jake Tapper

Republicans Join Kamala Harris At Campaign Event In PA; Sources: Israel's Retaliation On Iran Expected Before Nov. 5; Calls For Mercy Mount As Texas Inmate Faces Execution. Aired 4-5p ET

Aired October 16, 2024 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES & 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We here know the Constitution is not a relic from our past, but determines whether we are a country where the people can speak freely, and even criticized the president without fear of being thrown in jail or targeted by the military.

(APPLAUSE)

[16:00:17]

HARRIS: Where the people can worship as they choose without the government interfering.

(APPLAUSE)

HARRIS: Where you can vote without fear that your vote will be thrown away.

(APPLAUSE)

HARRIS: All of this and more defends on whether or not our leaders honor their oath to the Constitution. I have sworn an oath to uphold the Constitution six times, including as vice president, as a United States senator, and as the top law enforcement officer of the largest state in our country.

(APPLAUSE)

HARRIS: And I have never waivered from upholding that oath and this is a profound difference between Donald Trump and me. He who violated the oath to uphold the Constitution of the United States and make no mistake, he who, if given the chance, will violate it again.

Donald Trump lost the election, and he refused to accept the will of the people and the results of a free and fair election. He sent a mob, an armed mob to the United States capital where they violently assaulted police officers, law enforcement officials and threatened the life of his own vice president. And he refused to engage in the peaceful transfer of power.

Were it not for the courage and patriotism of Vice President Pence that day, Donald Trump might have actually succeeded in overturning the will of the American people.

Let's reflect on that.

And now Donald Trump is telling us how he intends to use power hour if he is elected again. He has stated that one of the biggest threats America faces is, quote, the enemy from within.

(BOOS)

HARRIS: The enemy from within. But know where that language harkens back to. Understand and let us be clear about what he is saying.

He considers any American who doesn't support him or bend to his will to be an enemy to our country and further, he says that as commander- in-chief, he would use our military to go after them.

Honestly, let that sink in. Use of the American military to go after American citizens? And we know who he would target first because he has targeted them and attacked them before -- journalist, who stories he doesn't like, nonpartisan election officials who refuse to cheat by finding extra votes for him, judges who insist on following the law instead of following him.

It is clear: Donald Trump is increasingly unstable and unhinged.

(APPLAUSE)

HARRIS: And he is seeking unchecked power.

Consider what his closest advisers have said, his national security advisor, two defense secretaries, his former chief of staff, his own vice president, all have warned America -- Donald Trump is unfit to serve.

[16:05:10]

Or listen to General Milley, Donald Trump's top general, he has called Trump -- and I quote -- fascist to the core, and said, quote, no one has ever been as dangerous to this country.

So think about that. General Milley served in uniform for more than 40 years, commanding American forces around the world. He has confronted some of America's worst enemies, and he is saying no one has ever been as dangerous to our country as Donald Trump.

America must heed this warning because anyone who tramples on our democratic values as Donald Trump has, anyone who has called for the, quote, termination of the Constitution of the United States as Donald Trump has, must never again stand behind the seal of the president of the United States!

(APPLAUSE)

HARRIS: Never again! Never again!

And to those and to those who are watching, if you share that view, no matter your party, no matter who you voted for last time, there is a place for you in this campaign. (APPLAUSE)

HARRIS: The coalition we have built has room for everyone, who is ready to turn the page on the chaos and instability of Donald Trump, and I pledge to you to be a president for all Americans. And I take that pledge seriously. I take that pledge quite seriously.

So as I've mentioned, many of you know, I spent a career as a prosecutor, in law enforcement. And I will tell you, I never asked a victim or a witness, are you a Republican or are you a Democrat? I never asked of anyone who needed help. If anyone who deserved attention, where were they registered and who did they vote for?

The only question I ever asked was, are you okay? And that is the kind of president I pledge to you that I will be.

That is my pledge to you because we have too much to do, and too much good work to do, to be relegated, to -- requiring each of us to be in some silo, disconnected from each other. There's too much good to be done, and the challenges that we face as a nation require us if we truly want to create solutions and strengthen our nation, the approach truly requires that we understand we're all in this together. This is so much more than rhetoric or a campaign.

It really is about tapping into the spirit of who we are as Americans, because we are all in this together. We are all in this together.

And so I pledge to be a president who actively works to unite us around our highest aspirations. I pledge to you to be a president who is realistic and practical and has common sense and to always fight for the American people.

(APPLAUSE)

[16:15:12]

HARRIS: Unlike Donald Trump who frankly as we have seen cares more about running on problems than fixing problems, I want to fix problems, which means working across the aisle. It requires working across the aisle. It requires embracing good ideas from wherever they come.

That is why I have pledged to appoint a Republican in my cabinet.

(APPLAUSE)

HARRIS: That is why I have pledged to establish a council on bipartisan solutions to recommend to me common sense solutions to some of the most pressing issues facing our country.

(APPLAUSE)

HARRIS: Because nobody has a corner on the good ideas. They actually come from many places and one should -- especially if they want to be a leader, one should welcome those ideas and those ideas which are about in particular strengthening the middle class, securing our border, defending our freedoms and maintaining our leadership in the world.

(APPLAUSE)

HARRIS: And all of this is to also say that I believe for America to be the world's strongest democracy, we must have a healthy two-party system.

(APPLAUSE)

HARRIS: Because it is when we have a healthy two-party system that leaders are then required to debate the merits of policy and to work, yes, across the aisle regularly and routinely to get things done.

And I have experienced firsthand how important and rewarding that kind of bipartisan cooperation can be.

So I'll tell you -- when I was the United States senator, I served on the Senate Intelligence Committee. It was actually my favorite committee for a number of reasons but specifically this -- there we dealt with some of the most pressing issues affecting national security, there we would talk about hotspots around the world, and what we needed to do, to focus on keeping America safe and secure.

And to do that, we would review classified information which required us to meet in a secure room. Adam, you know it's called a SCIF, okay.

When we would go in that room, with all due respect, no cameras were allowed. No press, and we would roll up our sleeves and get to work. I'm telling you, senators of both parties would walk in that room, take off their suit jackets, roll up their sleeves, have a cup of coffee on the table and we would have real conversations, real conversations, as Americans, because we understood that what happened in that room -- well, the stakes were so high, and therefore, it could not be -- we could not afford to let it be about whether one was a Democrat or a Republican.

The stakes were too high. We were in that room and it was all about us as Americans, about doing what is in the best interest of the safety and security of our nation. I love that work, and it was what we have as the theme of today it was country over party in action, in action.

(APPLAUSE)

HARRIS: So I know it can be done and that is the standard of leadership and the aspiration that I have in terms of how we will work, when with your help, I am elected president of the United States.

(APPLAUSE)

HARRIS: So thank you, thank you, thank you.

(CHANTING)

HARRIS: So we got to get to work. We got to get to work. So let me just say an obvious point, there's a fundamental choice in this election, a very fundamental choice.

A choice between the leadership that I pledge to offer to America, leadership that brings folks together, that builds consensus and focuses on making life better for you with the knowledge that we have so much more in common than what separates us, and on the other hand, the choice of someone who I think we can guarantee will sit in the Oval Office plotting retribution, stew in his own grievances, and think only about himself and not you.

So as I have said, our campaign is not a fight against something. It is a fight for something.

(APPLAUSE)

HARRIS: It is a fight for the fundamental principles upon which we were founded. It is a fight for a new generation of leadership that is optimistic about what we can achieve together.

Republicans, Democrats and independents, who want to move past the politics of division and blame, and get things done on behalf of the American people. And when it all comes down to it, I know we are all here together, this beautiful afternoon because we love our country.

(APPLAUSE)

HARRIS: We love our country, and we are here because we know the deep privilege and pride that comes with being an American. And the duty that comes along with it. And the duty that comes along with it.

(APPLAUSE)

HARRIS: Imperfect though we may be, America is still that shining city upon a hill that inspires people around the world, and I do believe it is one of the highest forms of patriotism to fight for the ideals of our country.

(APPLAUSE)

HARRIS: So to people from across Pennsylvania and across our nation, let us together stand up for the rule of law, for our democratic ideals and for the Constitution of the United States.

And in 20 days, we have the power to chart a new way forward, one that is worthy of this magnificent country that we are all blessed to call home. Thank you all. May god bless you and may god bless the United States of America. Thank you.

(APPLAUSE)

(MUSIC)

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Welcome to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper.

And you have been watching Vice President Kamala Harris speaking at a campaign event in Washington Crossing, Pennsylvania, in battleground Pennsylvania, specifically Washington Crossing is in Bucks County, the most Republican of the suburban collar counties outside Philadelphia, where Harris needs to run up the vote in order to compensate for how well Trump will do in the more rural parts of Pennsylvania. She especially needs to run up the vote among many moderate Republicans.

Harris was joined today. You see her talking to them right now. There's Bill Kristol, Olivia Troye, Adam Kinzinger, Geoff Duncan, others. You see them standing there. We also know Geoff Duncan, of course, the former lieutenant governor of Georgia, Adam Kinzinger on the right there from Illinois and others, Olivia Troye, who worked for Mike Pence in the White House.

These are decidedly Republicans in a part of the state where she needs to do well with Republicans.

Let's bring in CNN political commentators Kate Bedingfield who is the former Biden White House communications director, and former Obama senior advisor David Axelrod.

David, what do you make of the case Harris just laid out and what do you make of Democrats who are critical of the fact that she is reaching out to Republicans instead of focusing more on getting out the Democratic base, African-Americans, Latinos, young people, et cetera.

DAVID AXELROD, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yeah. Well, look, I think one thing doesn't preclude the other. I find her -- the argument compelling personally.

[16:20:05]

I think there are a lot of people who do. But the question is, are the voters who are hanging out in this race, are -- do they find it compelling?

And you know, it seems to me that a lot of the people who will respond to this argument are probably supporting her. I think it's important to make the outreach. This was -- this was valuable but it may not be the argument that tips the balance with the voters who are going to decide this election.

And among them are minority voters, but there are other voters as well who ask the question, what does this mean for me? They're more transactional about their own personal situation. I've said a lot of times, if you're talking about the future of democracy over the dinner table, you're probably not worrying about the cost of food on the table.

And so, she has to do all these things at once. I think this was valuable but insufficient.

TAPPER: Kate, what do you make of it?

So, James Carville was on the show on Monday. He said basically this is a 48 percent to 48 percent race right now, and it's a fight over this last 4 percent, who are these 4 percent, who are these individuals that Trump and Harris need to get to vote for them to tip the scales?

KATE BEDINGFIELD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yeah, well, it's a lot of these suburban voters, a lot of moderate voters, and I think that this message -- while I certainly agree with David, this is not the -- this is not the whole enchilada. Obviously, she needs to talk about the economy. She needs to talk about cost. She's been doing that I think.

But we have seen evidence -- we saw it in the 2022 midterms, we saw it after the vice presidential debate in some of the focus groups here on CNN after that debate, some of those moderate swing voters undecided, said that the moment that J.D. Vance wouldn't say that Donald Trump lost the election in 2020 was a deal breaker for them.

So we know that for moderate independent suburban voters, some of whom are going to be critical in deciding the outcome of this election, especially in a state like Pennsylvania, you know, we know that this argument does carry weight with them.

And you know, the other thing that she has to do here in the final stretch of the campaign is, you know, she has to motivate people who may be feeling across the board apathetic about the process, may be feeling not super energized to vote, and laying out the stakes, reminding people what's really at stake here, showing, you know, Republicans, lifelong Republicans who won't vote for Trump because of the things that he said, you know, that undermine our constitution, you know, that's reminding people that this is a critically important moment that choosing not to vote is effectively voting for Trump, and so trying to really kind of light a fire in the last three weeks of this race.

And I think that's the other thing that this argument helps to do.

TAPPER: I want to turn to some of the ads that are running in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania and other battleground states because, David, I'm hearing from Democrats about how effective some Trump ads have been, including ones in Pennsylvania focusing on the economy and specifically on fracking. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

AD NARRATOR: Kamala Harris pushed the far-left green new deal. That means huge new taxes, increased utility bills and banning gas cars.

HARRIS: That's why I am committed to passing a green new deal and finally putting an end to fracking once and for all.

AD NARRATOR: Kamala's fracking ban would kill jobs and raise gas prices. Kamala doesn't give a frack about you. Only President Trump will bring back Trump's strong economy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: So what I'm being told from Democrats in Pennsylvania is that these ads are effective and it's one of the reasons why polls are neck and neck.

David, what do you think?

AXELROD: Well, yeah, look, I think the Trump media campaign has been very effective in many ways, and they've got an easier job, Jake. They basically devoted all of their media to trying to take down Kamala Harris who was new and to people -- unknown to a lot of people though she's been vice president because vice presidents by definition are less known, and they've used a lot of the uh the video and sound from her 2019 campaign, including that.

She's renounced that position. She did shortly after the campaign but it is effective. I mean, you know, her comments about Bidenomics they've used to great effect. Her comment they they've now put on an ad from last week about when she was asked whether she would uh differ from Biden or where she would differ from Biden and she punted probably out of politeness as much as anything, but they've used it to some uh effect.

So they have run an effective media campaign. They've also run this ad using her sound on -- on -- aimed on -- about prisoners who sought transition surgery and so on. That has been effective.

So they have been effective with their campaign, but they have an easier task.

[16:25:03]

She has to introduce herself and make the case against Trump at the same time. That is a more complicated task.

TAPPER: All right. Kate Bedingfield and David Axelrod, thanks to you both.

This major programming note, CNN is going to hold our own presidential town hall with Vice President Kamala Harris. That's next Wednesday night at 9:00 Eastern, again right here on CNN.

Coming up, the other side of this race, Donald Trump and getting a Republican senator's reaction after the former president suggested military action be taken against political opponents that he's describing as the enemy within.

Stay with us his.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: In our world lead, the Biden administration expects Israel to retaliate against Iran sometime in the next 20 days, before the November 5th election day in the United States. That's what sources are telling CNN after the attack earlier this month when Iran launch some 180 missiles at Israel. That attack was in response to Israel killing members of the group Hezbollah, which the U.S. considers to be a terrorist group, including the leader of Hezbollah, Hassan Nasrallah.

[16:30:04]

I want to bring in Republican Senator Markwayne Mullin of Oklahoma. He is on the Senate Armed Services Committee.

Senator, thanks so much for joining us.

What do you make of Israel clearly conveying that it wants to retaliate against Iran before the U.S. election on November 5th?

SEN. MARKWAYNE MULLIN (R-OK): Well, I think Israel has a right to do it, Jake. I think it's really painful to watch this administration through Secretary Blinken and through President Biden, that's starting to put limitations on the way Israel can defend themselves.

Remember, no one told us how we could defend ourselves after the war on -- after the war on terror when we got struck in 9/11. Their -- their fight of 9/11 was October 7th.

We all know that Iran is the head of the stake -- the snake when it comes to funding terrorist organizations like Hezbollah, the Houthis or Hamas, and then obviously Iran attacked them.

So Israel is supposed to set idle on that? That's not -- that's not how you defend yourself. That's not how you portray strength in a -- in the Middle East when all they respect your strength. And so, Israel has the right to defend them and we should be standing by our friends and our ally completely without hesitation instead of sending mixed signals to them. I'm really disappointed in what's happening right now with our administration.

TAPPER: So there are U.S. service members that are going to be helping Israel with missile defense. And I'm wondering how concerned you are about Israel launching a retaliatory strike which might only provoke Iran to strike back and with U.S. service members in country, it might possibly draw the United States into this conflict even more directly.

MULLIN: Well, to escalate the situation -- Iran escalated the situation, not Israel. Israel has a responsibility to defend themselves and they do that by taking out the individuals that attack them and what with what weapons they attacked them with.

As far as our men and women in uniform, they know what they got themselves into and I'm not trying to be hard on this one, but they -- they signed up to be in the military and they're deployed forward with our allies. It's not like we're in a -- in a country that we're not familiar with. We fight with Israel.

Israel, we've always said, is our strongest ally, and I would say the men and women that are there right now with the -- with the missile defense, they're there knowing that they can do their job and do it well and they're proud to do it and we're proud to stand with them each day.

I'm -- I'm proud to finally see that we have some Americans that are actually there helping Israel because until now, the secretary of defense had a standing order that no personnel be it on their personal time or on official time inside the DOD was allowed to even step foot into Israel and how I know that is because I'm headed over there next week and my liaison officer who we're required to travel with will cannot go into Israel with me because that's the standing order from Secretary Austin.

TAPPER: Let's talk about American politics now. You're out this week campaigning for Republicans in battleground states --

MULLIN: Yeah.

TAPPER: -- Nevada, North Carolina, you're specifically trying to speak with Native Americans. Why and what are you hearing from them?

MULLIN: Well, we're talking with business communities and Native Americans. I was in Austin earlier today. Then I was in Nevada, Arizona. I'll be in North Carolina this Friday.

You know, we're -- Native Americans as a population for some reason that's been overlooked. I'm Cherokee. I always joke and say I don't really necessarily look Cherokee but I actually am, unlike Elizabeth Warren and -- and when we start talking about specific issues inside the Native American population which call Indian Country, there's some big issues like healthcare. Why is healthcare so radically underfunded when it comes to other federal programs like the V.A. or Medicare or Medicaid?

When you start talking about economic development, inside the -- inside Indian Country, the -- we -- it's like a third world country when you go to some of these reservations. The economic development is rich, be underneath our feet and above the ground. But for some reason we have to ask permission.

And what President Trump is trying to push out there is self- determination and sovereignty, actually understanding Indian Country and what that means inside the treaties when it talks about self- determination and it talks about a sovereign nation. Now, that means that we don't have to ask permission. We should be able to develop the land just like any land owner does.

But unfortunately, when you start trying to deal with the secretary of interior, there -- it's -- it's almost impossible to develop those areas. And so, we want to see dramatic growth but we also want to reach out and say we're not listening to the rhetoric that we've always heard. We want to listen to you -- directly from you and say, how can we help you pull yourself up by your own bootstraps. And we're here to lend that hand.

TAPPER: The leader of your party former, President Trump, in the last few days, not only called his political opponents the enemy from within.

[16:35:03]

He suggested he would like to use the National Guard or the military on them.

Let's play a clip of what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) DONALD TRUMP, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT & 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We have some very bad people. We have some sick people, radical left lunatics. And I think they're the -- and it should be very easily handled by, if necessary, by National Guard, or if really necessary by the military.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Now he went on to talk about Congressman Adam Schiff as one of these lunatics in his view. Today at the Fox town hall, he talked about the Pelosis. What's your reaction to that?

MULLIN: Well, I think it's kind of taken a little bit out of context of some degree but when you start talking about the enemy of a state, remember, after January 6th and prior of January 6th, you heard domestic terrorism used over and over again by the FBI and other intelligent agencies, and they specifically targeted Republicans at the time.

I'm not saying we should do tit-for-tat at all. That is not what should happen. But we do need to be looking at who's trying to destroy our American system, who's trying to destroy the democracy that we have, and take a very, very, very hard look at it.

Going after political opponents that -- we -- we're too good of a country to do that, Jake, but at the same time we can't be weaponizing our U.S. government against individuals, and we know that the left has done that. We've seen what they've done to President Trump. We've seen what they did after January 6, and it hasn't slowed down.

We need to stop this and say, listen, we agree to disagree on certain issues.

Jake, you and I agree and disagree on some issues too, but I'm not going after you and you're not going after me. We can sit down have a cordial conversation. That's where the American politics need to go all together.

TAPPER: What do you mean the FBI -- that you take issue with what they did after January 6? I mean, the FBI was investigating people that broke the law and broken to the Capitol and committed acts of violence and tried to stop the constitutionally mandated electoral count. You're not talking about the criminals that did that.

MULLIN: No, I'm talking about defining a whole group of individuals as domestic terrorism and going directly to them, researching individuals by looking at their phones, where they were at and the proximity of it, and then researching and I'm going into them, weaponizing the IRS to go after a business owners or people that might have been associated with them or businesses that were associated by them.

And this is, you know, I'm not making this stuff up, Jake, you know, this to be factual. And so what we're -- what I'm sitting there saying is, why are we doing this? Why are we going after each other that we agree to disagree with? But when one side has weaponized the political system and a government to go after a group of individuals like they have, and Republicans with the Democrats going after President Trump and nonstop going after them, it does say, when do we say enough is enough?

And I would hope after November 5 that we can say enough is enough. But here's what I'm afraid is going to have -- to have -- what's going to happen November 5th, if the Republicans win, the Democrats are going to cry. He's an illegitimate president like they did in 2016 or -- and they're going to continue to try to go after him and impeach him say that election was -- wasn't fair.

Vice versa, if the Republicans were to lose and God forbid, Kamala -- Kamala gets elected, then we'll probably hear the same thing from the right, too.

And so, what I'm saying is like after the election, November 5, let's just try as a country to put the country first rather than putting party politics first. I'm so tired of party politics because were running the great country that's given all of us a tremendous opportunity in a place to live.

TAPPER: Republican Senator Markwayne Mullin of Oklahoma, thanks so much, sir. Appreciate it.

MULLIN: Thank you.

TAPPER: Another major story that we've been covering here on THE LEAD this week, a huge legal case that's putting Texas Governor Greg Abbott on the spot. Will he respond before a deadline tomorrow on this case that is literally life or death?

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:42:44]

TAPPER: There's just one day -- one day left before the scheduled execution of Texas death row inmate Robert Roberson. Texas's board of pardons and paroles just denied his request for clemency, so that means Governor Greg Abbott is now limited to issuing a one-time 30-day reprieve if he so chooses.

Robertson was convicted in 2003 of murdering his 2-year-old daughter, Nikki. That conviction was tied to shaken baby syndrome, which is a very real syndrome, but his attorneys say it is not relevant to this case. It was not what happened to Nikki. And with hours to go in Roberson's life, calls are growing to spare him from this execution.

CNN's Ed Lavandera has all the latest.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ED LAVANDERA, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Tears and emotion overwhelmed Robert Roberson's lawyer as she left a courtroom in Palestine, Texas.

GRETCHEN SWEEN, ATTORNEY FOR ROBERT ROBERSON: I'm not giving up. That's the message.

LAVANDERA: As the latest legal attempt to spare his life failed again.

SWEEN: I'm enraged. I'm heartbroken, but we are not giving up this fight.

LAVANDERA: In 2003, Robert Roberson was sentenced to die for abusing and killing his daughter, Nikki. At trial, medical experts testified Nikki suffered multiple head traumas and brain bleeding, indicative of shaken baby syndrome.

Roberson's legal team, which includes the Innocence Project, says the 2-year-old had a history of medical issues and that she died of double pneumonia that progressed to sepsis, which can mimic symptoms of abusive head trauma. They also said she had fallen off the bed that night, but some have called Roberson's new medical claims preposterous.

DR. SANDEEP NARANG, PROFESSOR OF PEDIATRICS, MEDICAL COLLEGE OF WISCONSIN: Even if the child did have pneumonia, there was no way any of those were consistent with the multiple trauma impact areas to the head.

LAVANDERA: The doubt over Roberson's case has intensified in a highly unusual letter, a bipartisan group of 86 Texas lawmakers are fighting to stop Roberson's execution.

JEFF LEACH (R), TEXAS STATE HOUSE: I believe strongly that the system has failed. Mr. Roberson in this case, and it's our obligation and our duty to speak up and step up.

LAVANDERA: Some lawmakers prayed with Roberson inside prison this month.

Your execution date is approaching. How do you -- how do you cope with that?

ROBERT ROBERSON, CONVICTED OF KILLING HIS 2-YEAR-OLD DAUGHTER IN 2002: Tried to keep hope alive each and every day, you know?

LAVANDERA: CNN spoke with Roberson inside the death row prison unit.

Why should people believe that you didn't kill your daughters?

ROBERSON: Because I didn't, you know.

[16:45:02]

It's like you or me, we can't make a person believe us, you know, and stuff, you know? But I carry to the hospital and stuff, you know, I didn't have nothing to hide.

LAVANDERA: But you didn't violently shake your daughter?

ROBERSON: No, sir. I didn't yell at her, never did violently shake her, all I was accused of, and never did. LAVANDERA: Why do you think you were convicted?

ROBERSON: Because I couldn't explain what happened to her. They said you're guilty and that way I was acting funny because of my autism. I didn't know I had autism until I was here.

LAVANDERA: Brian Wharton is the former police detective who helped convict Roberson. He says he's ashamed and now believes Roberson is innocent.

This week, Roberson asked Wharton to be with his family and friends in the execution chamber if that moment comes.

When you've got the call that Robert has put you on the witness list -- I mean, I cant imagine getting that call.

BRIAN WHARTON, FORMER DETECTIVE: Well, I don't want to be there. I don't want to watch it happen but it's again, it's a moment that I owe him. If he's asked me to be there, I owe him that much. And so I'll be there.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LAVANDERA (on camera): Jake, Roberson's lawyers have also petitioned the U.S. Supreme Court. So, they're still waiting for that. As you mentioned, really all focused now on Texas Governor Greg Abbott as to whether or not he will make -- issue a 30-day reprieve.

There's also been a state house committee hearing that's been listening to testimony from medical experts all day, but it's unclear exactly what that committee can and will do here in the coming hours -- Jake.

TAPPER: All right. Ed Lavandera, thank you so much.

Coming up, one of the richest men in America, Steve Ballmer, once the CEO of Microsoft, now owner of the NBA's Los Angeles Clippers. His side job is he's on a crusade for the truth to be told in American politics. And he'll be here on THE LEAD.

That's next time.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:50:53]

TAPPER: In our 2024 lead, a leading voice in the world of technology is now laser-focused on how to money ball democracy. By that I mean focusing on data and facts in this moment of deep division and misinformation.

Steve Ballmer, former CEO of Microsoft, current owner of the L.A. Clippers NBA team and founder of USA Facts join -- joins me now.

Mr. Ballmer, thanks for joining us.

So explain this mission and why you're focusing on facts in this moment.

STEVE BALLMER, FORMER MICROSOFT CEO: Yeah, I started off at one point after I retired from Microsoft really trying to understand our government. I'm a numeric guy. I wanted to understand things like who is really paying taxes? What is our money being used for?

And because government's not a business, then you have to ask what kind of outcomes? How are health outcomes, education, crime, standard of living? And I decided that the best approach, the least partisan approach, and to me the most sensible approach wasn't to look at forecasts, wasn't trying to explain and wasn't trying to use numbers that didn't come from our government.

I got interested in that. I said, hey, maybe some other people would want to see these numbers presented in context comprehensively. Unlike our politicians who liked to, a number and just focus on one number that doesn't really tell the complete story.

TAPPER: So you're putting on a number of videos. What are a couple of the key data points you think are critical for voters to understand before they vote?

BALLMER: Yeah, I think there's -- there are things of this ilk. Inflation has been 19 percent in total over the last four years. But wage growth, medium wage growth has been 21 percent. I'm not saying one thing or another, each person needs to decide, but it may be a little bit different than the story that people hear and that may lead them one way or another in terms of their voting, as an example.

The growth in our deficit -- do people care about that or not? And how would we really get after it understanding that Social Security and Medicare together account for about 40 percent of all federal government spending?

And so some thoughts about how to balance the budget need to be put into context of what we're really spending today. And what we're spending it on, second area.

Third area, we talk about health. The rise and accidental deaths, which includes most significantly the rise in overdoses is tremendous. We all know that, but if you really look at the data, we've gone from about 3,000 deaths per -- sorry, yeah, about 3,000 -- so about 73,000 deaths per year from fentanyl and that's in an environment in which there are other overdose types, cocaine, meth, that are exploded.

Those are the kinds of things I think people really need to understand, think about, and whether it's in the presidential election, it's in Congress, or even in their local elections. These are critical.

TAPPER: You know, one of the things that's interesting is that technology can be such a force for good when it comes to facts and it also can be such a source for evil and misinformation. Not to pick on Elon Musk, but he obviously is openly supporting Donald Trump. And I don't just mean the giving $75 million to Trump-aligned super PACs. Twitter or X has transformed into a place where were disinformation is spread, sometimes amplified by Musk. What is the role of technology in trying to reassert facts and truth before the American people?

BALLMER: Yeah, I think we have a lot of opportunity as we go forward. If people want to embed essentially, I won't call it a fact checker.

[16:55:07]

I'll just call it a data provider so that when you're in reading something, if you want to switch it on, you can click and say, show me what actually happened here by the numbers. And then you can make your own, own judgments whether you're hearing from people on the left or you're hearing people on the right, that ability to get the context, not the forecast. As I might say, just the facts, man, I think that's better.

TAPPER: All right. Steve Ballmer, thanks for joining us. Stay in touch and keep a keep coming back and talking to us about this effort. We appreciate it.

BALLMER: Okay, man. Thank you.

TAPPER: On the topic of misinformation, there's a lot more where that came from, including from Trump's running mate, Senator J.D. Vance, just moments ago talking about the 2020 election. How this issue continues to be amplified in this race by the very top of the Republican presidential ticket.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: Welcome to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper.

This hour, Jimmy Carter makes history. The 100-year-old former president fulfills his wish and cast his ballot in the upcoming presidential election. He did so for Vice President Kamala Harris. Jimmy Carter's grandson is going to join us live to describe what this moment meant for the entire Carter family.