Return to Transcripts main page

The Lead with Jake Tapper

Trump, Harris Vie For Votes With 5 Days Left; Harris Calls Trump's Comments On Women "Very Offensive"; Trump Vows To "Protect" Women Whether They "Like It Or Not"; Sen. Mark Kelly (D-AZ), Is Interviewed About Harris Rallies Voters In Critical Battleground Arizona; Six Subway Surfing Deaths In NYC So Far This Year; Rep. Brad Wenstrup (R-OH), Is Interviewed About GOP-Led Panel Refers Fmr NY Gov. Andrew Cuomo To DOJ. Aired 5-6p ET

Aired October 31, 2024 - 17:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[17:00:00]

JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: Democratic Senator Mark Kelly for his thoughts on the race. Vice President Harris next heads to Nevada for two more campaign rallies, including one with singer and actress Jennifer Lopez. Will J. Lo sing, unlike Beyonce, at the Texas rally? Well, we shall see.

Donald Trump held his first event of the day in Albuquerque, New Mexico, this afternoon where he focused significantly on the southern border and immigration. Soon, the former President will take the stage in Las Vegas for a rally followed by an event with Tucker Carlson tonight in Arizona.

CNN's Priscilla Alvarez is covering the Harris campaign in North LAS Vegas, Nevada. CNN's Alayna Treene is about a 25-minute drive away covering the Trump campaign in Henderson, Nevada. Priscilla, you first. Harris has not been out west in a while, what is the message she's conveying to voters there?

PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, this is certainly going to be an appeal to Latino voters who are crucial in a state like Nevada and also a state that President Biden only narrowly won in 2020. And so far, polls indicate that both the Vice President and former President Donald Trump are about evenly split when it comes to Latino voters here in Nevada. So she is trying to gain an edge in her messaging here. But what she has seen over the last several days is a groundswell of support from Latino celebrities. You mentioned Jennifer Lopez, Mexican band Mana is also going to be here. There has been a lot of support, especially Jake, after the remarks made by a comedian at former President Donald Trump's rally in New York City earlier this week assailing Puerto Rico. So that may be part of the theme here tonight.

Of course, that has mobilized Puerto Rican voters but it's also mobilized Latinos. But when I speak to senior campaign officials, they tell me, look, now is the period of mobilization. That's important in a place like this. Nevada, of course, has in-person early voting. That ends tomorrow so timing here is no coincidence. Mail voting will continue and then in-person voting will continue again on Tuesday. So there is a focus here, of course, on capitalizing on early voting. But she'll also be talking about the issues.

You heard her talk earlier today responding to former President Donald Trump's remarks on women. She's going to hammer in reproductive rights today. But she'll also talk about immigration and the economy. We've seen ads on all of those fronts over recent days.

TAPPER: And Alayna, what should we expect to hear from Trump at his upcoming rally in Henderson, Nevada?

ALAYNA TREENE, CNN REPORTER: Well, I did hear him talk a lot about immigration. I continue to hear in my conversations with Trump's senior advisers that he really believes that the border is the number one issue. Even as people are telling him economy is the Number One issue in the minds of voters. Donald Trump believes that immigration is what helped him win in 2016 and he thinks it is what will help him win this cycle. That's why you've seen him spend so much time on that.

And especially in states like Nevada, where I am, later tonight, he's going to be in Arizona. That's going to be his main message. And similar to what Priscilla said, look, when I talk to Trump's campaign, knowing that we are five days out, they admit that there's no special strategy up their sleeve right now.

Their main focus over this next stretch is really to turn out as many voters as he can. That is the big goal and that's why he's going to every single battleground state before Election Day. And I do want to talk about, though, what Priscilla mentioned, which is Kamala Harris responding to his comments to women last night. This is a huge issue we have seen Donald Trump have, and it's something that his advisors are telling him as well, is a major issue for him. They have not been able to solve for that massive gender gap, noting that Harris does better with females, and that's kind of why you've seen it seep into some of Donald Trump's remarks himself. And last night, he got upstage and said he wants to be the protector of women, whether they like it or not.

That is not something his team wants him to be talking about. So I think you might hear some of that later today, because that is Donald Trump's version and really strategy, in his own way, of trying to connect with female voters even as he continues to struggle with them. Jake.

TAPPER: All right, Alayna Treene and Priscilla Alvarez, both in Nevada for us, thanks to you. Kamala Harris speaking now in battleground Arizona. Let's dip in and listen a little bit of that.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KAMALA HARRIS, PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Donald Trump's answer to the financial pressures you face is the same as the last time, another trillion dollars in tax cuts for billionaires and the biggest corporations. And this time, he will pay for it. And this time, his plan is a 20% national sales tax on everything you buy. That is imported clothes, food, toys, cell phones. A truck sales tax, according to the economist, would cost the average American family an additional $4,000 a year.

And on top of that, Donald Trump still wants to get rid of the Affordable Care Act, also known as Obamacare. And he has a powerful friend in Congress, the Speaker of the House, who recently said if Trump wins, there will be "No Obamacare", which would throw -- understand the meaning of that. It would throw millions of Americans off of their health insurance and take us back to the time, which we remember, when insurance companies could deny people with pre existing conditions.

[17:05:21]

Well, we are not going back. We are not going back. We're not going back. We are not going back. We are not going to get back. We're not going back. And we are not going back because ours is a fight for the future, and it is a fight for freedom, like the fundamental freedom of a woman to make decisions about her own body and not have her government tell her what to do.

And remember how we got here. Donald Trump hand-selected three members of the United States Supreme Court with the intention that they would undo the protections of Roe v. Wade. And they did as he intended.

And now in America, one in three women lives in a state with a Trump abortion ban, many with no exceptions, even for rape and incest, which is immoral. And Donald Trump's not done. Did everyone hear what he just said yesterday? That he will do what he wants, quote, and here's where I'm going to quote, "whether the women like it or not". And we must vote because this is the thing. You know, there's a saying that you got to listen to people when they tell you who you are, who they are. And this is not the first time he has told us who he is. He does not believe women should have the agency and authority to make decisions about their own bodies. This is the same man who said women should be --

(END VIDEOTAPE)

TAPPER: All right and we're going to dip out of that. You've been listening to Vice President Kamala Harris in battleground Arizona. Just two teeny little fact-checks there. First of all, she keeps referring to the Trump proposal on tariffs as a sales tax. It's not a sales tax. You can dispute the tariffs and whether or not they're a good idea. But it's not a sales tax.

And the second thing is when Trump said he was going to do something for women whether they like it or not, whether the women like it or not, he was talking about protecting women, protecting women whether they like it or not. Certainly, you can take issue with the language. But it wasn't -- he wasn't saying he was just going to do whatever he wanted, regardless of, you know?

Anyway, well, anyway. But let's, let's talk. I mean, but you take my point. You don't disagree, right?

KAREN FINNEY, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: No, no, I -- I get it.

TAPPER: He was saying I'm to protect them whether -- that women want me to protect them, whether --

FINNEY: And some would say that's misogynist. Then that's --

TAPPER: But it's not as true as she presented it.

FINNEY: I think -- well, look, ultimately, I think we have to be careful in these last days. We did this in 2016. He's going to say something horrible, ridiculous, over the line --

TAPPER: Well, just -- so quote it accurately.

FINNEY: No, no, well, that's not my point. I just don't think we need to say every update because the point is what she -- where she went to, which is, we know who this guy is. This is not someone who respects women. That being said, sorry, I think the Puerto Rico ad or General Kelly's comments are in a different category.

TAPPER: So I want to get to the Puerto Rico in a second. But I just also want to talk about because she was just talking about Obamacare, because Speaker Johnson did say in a statement, I guess it was in a fundraiser or some sort of private event, that no Obamacare. And President Trump disputed that because Kamala Harris attacked him for that.

Trump posted on social media, "Lion, Kamala is giving a news conference now saying that I want to end the Affordable Care Act. That's Obamacare. I never mentioned doing that, and never even thought about such a thing. You know, it was a major part of his action as President and Ron Brownstein points out, Trump hosted a ceremony at the Whitehouse after the House voted to repeal Obamacare in 2017." That one seems like fair game to me from the Harris team.

MIKE DUBKE, FORMER TRUMP WHITE HOUSE COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: I will -- first of all, I was at that event in 2017.

TAPPER: 2017.

DUBKE: And it really was spiking the football on the one-yard line.

TAPPER: Yeah, because it did not --

DUBKE: It was a terrible event.

TAPPER: You'd expect it because it didn't get to the Senate.

FINNEY: Right.

DUBKE: I don't understand why we did it.

TAPPER: Yeah.

DUBKE: But it happened. I will say that President Trump said maybe a month ago that hands off Obamacare. So there has been and there's this accusation. And he has consistently, at least over the last six weeks or seven weeks have been saying that, you know, getting rid of Obamacare is off the table. So I'm not sure it is a fair head. But I do appreciate your other fact checks earlier. I do want to say that.

[17:10:17]

FINNEY: But he hasn't come up with anything.

MARIA CARDONA, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Right?

FINNEY: I mean, since 2015 actually. I think he told CNN it's going to be beautiful.

TAPPER: Let's have Maria come in here.

CARDONA: And recently, you know, he might, I don't know if he's said that actually hands off Obamacare because if Speaker Johnson does everything he says and he just said he's going to repeal Obamacare and the problem is, and I think you lived it, that there is no replacement. And in fact, recently he said we have a concept of a plan. And that's exactly the problem. Obamacare is incredibly popular whether you call it Obamacare or the Affordable Care Act for every single coalition of voter in this country. And that's why that's problematic.

TAPPER: So we're getting into a lot the like last minute, you know, five days, a lot of people saying things. JD Vance just sat -- Senator JD Vance, Donald Trump's running Mate Satt for an interview with the great and powerful Joe Rogan today. And he was talking about DEI and here's some new stuff.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SEN. JD VANCE, (R) VICE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: If you are a middle- class or upper middle-class white parent and the only thing that you care about is whether your child goes into Harvard or Yale, like obviously that pathway has become a lot harder for a lot of upper- middle-class kids. But the one way that those people can participate in the DEI bureaucracy in this country is to be trans. If you become trans, that is the way to reject your white privilege.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

TAPPER: Yes, so I don't know if anybody wants to talk about that.

FINNEY: Please.

KRISTIN DAVIDSON, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Well, look, I think the overall point he's trying to make --

TAPPER: We can just go on to the next subject if you want.

DAVIDSON: Look, I do think there is something there that this DEI woke agenda that we see on the news and that the Democratic party really flocks to, I think a --

TAPPER: Diversity, just so people at home might not even know what this is, diversity, equity, and inclusion. It's a program to boost minority representation. And what? FINNEY: It's not just it was women, people of color, and low-income people, a lot of low-income white people benefit from all that.

TAPPER: Well look, JD Vance is succeeding. We're talking about DEI on our -- you know.

DAVIDSON: Yes, yes, exactly. That's what they're all very good at. Well look, there's also some merits to, you know, getting to the positions by your merit and not just by you know, a demographic checkpoint. But overall, I think the woke, you know, we can say that word over and over again. Americans are getting tired of it. They're getting tired of us getting outraged at everything JD Vance and Donald Trump says.

TAPPER: I'm not -- I'm not outraged. It's just the latest. I hadn't even heard it. I guess it was the latest thing. I want to show you the Kamala ad, Spanish-language ad about the just aired. And then I'm going to give -- and then I'm going to give Maria 30 seconds to respond. Can we just run that ad?

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Kamala backed Biden on everything. She supported his disastrous economic agenda, higher taxes on the middle class. Kamala backed --

(END VIDEOTAPE)

TAPPER: Okay. So the first part of that was not -- it was -- it was a Trump ad against Kamala Harris. Can you translate the Spanish language ad? Because I don't know what it said, but I know it's airing in Pennsylvania, North Carolina, and Georgia.

CARDONA: It says this guy said we are trash. We are not trash. We are so much more. And it talks about scientists, it talks about doctors, it talks about lawyers, and it talks about Supreme Court justices, and it talks about actors and actresses and singers and everything that has come out of that amazing 35 by 100 mile little tiny island that they want to believe and have told people they think it's trash. It is, Jake. I have to say, you know, I've been working in Latino politics for a very long time, one of the most culturally competent ads I have ever seen. And it is incredibly compelling. It has gone viral.

TAPPER: You think it's going to make a difference?

CARDONA: It's going to -- it's going -- I think it's going to make a difference. They've put money behind it and it's going to be seen in all of the battleground states.

TAPPER: Gracias. Thanks to all of you. Really appreciate it. If you've ever wondered how TV networks call an election, you're in luck. Coming up next, CNN's political director is going to explain what you're going to see next Tuesday night and then Wednesday and Thursday and Friday. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:18:24]

TAPPER More on our 2024 lead on election night. Just five days from now, you're going to find me right here bringing you the results of this race that we've been covering for months and months now, years really. But if you're wondering how we or any other news network actually project who is going to win a specific state or the presidency, well, today is Audie Cornish Thursday, as you know, and she's going to bring us an inside look at that answer.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

AUDIE CORNISH, CNN ANCHOR, ASSIGNMENT ON THE ROAD (voiceover): Today we set the assignment podcast table down in CNN's election night studios with David Chalian, CNN's political director. He's seen it all when it comes to election night, from nail-biters to swing state flips on the red and blue map. So what goes into the decision-making at the decision desk? I'm Audie Cornish and this is the assignment on the road.

CORNISH: So we're going to talk about just the whole idea of the Decision desk. How is it that any given network can look at a state and see that it has 10% of the vote in, and then decide to like, call that state for a candidate?

DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: So the only way in which you see projections with that little amount of vote in is if there is not a competitive race. So all the prior polling prior to Election Day shows a blowout. I'm talking 30 points, 40 points, 50 points. But I just want to stress one thing at the outset here, Audie. The standard for making a projection remains the same no matter what, whether it's a blowout or it's the last state to decide the presidential contest.

CORNISH: What is that?

CHALIAN: Our decision desk need to get to 99.9% certainty that a second-place candidate is not -- does not have a mathematical possibility to overtake the first-place candidate.

CORNISH: So how do you kind of like manage the expectations people have about how something is going to turn out?

CHALIAN: Well, first of all, you do it with humility. I have no idea how it's going to turn out. So this is -- the race we're covering now is a toss-up race. I think it would be a fool's errand given how close each of these seven battleground states are, for someone to say that they know what the outcome of this race is going to be.

CORNISH: Which is important to say, I think because campaigns have a vested interest in talking about the data they have in the best light.

CHALIAN: Of course.

CORNISH: And so I think sometimes you hear their surrogates, you know, on TV, in newspapers, and it carries an air of, well, they must have some secret information.

CHALIAN: Right? Campaigns pay a ton of money for polling and data analytics. But here at CNN, we don't report on internal polls of campaigns because we don't have insight into it. They're not transparent to us. The ones that meet all of our benchmarks and we are able to look inside and under the hood and see the methodology and it meets our standards for reporting on a poll. Those are the polls we include in our poll of polls or that we would report on a given day on our air or online.

CORNISH: So what keeps you up at night?

CHALIAN: I mean, the Florida 2000 scenario is something that keeps me up at night. The idea of us making a projection that we have to pull back and correct, it's just, you know, it's hard not to think of the huge ramifications in this environment, especially of getting it wrong, and we won't. But that's what keeps me up at night.

CORNISH (voiceover): Find us online or wherever you get your podcasts.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

TAPPER: Our thanks to Audie Cornish for that report. And of course, please listen to The Assignment with Audie Cornish wherever you get your podcasts. My mom just started doing it and she loves it.

Coming up, what is likely the true strategy behind Elon Musk and those million-dollar sweepstakes that are causing so much controversy? A senior campaign strategist is giving us his take on what's really going on here. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:26:24]

TAPPER: In our law and justice lead, billionaire Elon Musk skipped a court hearing today in Pennsylvania after being sued for his $1 million daily giveaways. He's asking registered voters in battleground states like Pennsylvania to sign a petition to support free speech and gun rights, the first and second amendments. And if they sign that petition, they could win a million dollars.

Separately, Musk's super PAC is looking at the petitioner's names and they're targeting low-propensity voters, looking to see if any of them are in there, and then they will try to get them to vote for Trump. According to FCC records, that super PAC that Musk has, has spent $140 million since forming this summer. The tech billionaire and his super PAC have been accused by the Philadelphia District Attorney and others in law enforcement of "an illegal lottery scheme to influence voters".

Overnight, Musk filed paperwork to move this case to Federal court. In response, the judge put the state's case on hold, leaving little chance of hearing will happen before Tuesday. Let's bring in David Axelrod, former journalist, former Obama senior advisor, and congratulations Dave, you just dropped your 600th episode of the Axe Files, which launched in 2015, a fantastic, fantastic podcast. DAVID AXELROD, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yeah, yeah. Thanks,

Jake.

TAPPER: But just stepping away from the legality of it because neither you nor I are lawyers or judges. What is -- what do you think of what Elon Musk and his pro-Trump super PAC are doing with this scheme to go after low propensity voters and to get their names and addresses.

AXELROD: You know, I'm not going to -- I mean I can, I'm not going to make a moral judgment about it. But just technically speaking, clinically speaking, it's very smart because what they're doing is getting people to sign these. You have to be a registered voter to qualify for because he's paying people $100 for signing this petition. He's also paying people $47 for everyone they refer who signs the petition. And then he's got this million-dollar lottery that if you sign the petition, you're entered into. And what they're doing is using the First Amendment and the Second Amendment, free speech, and gun rights as a way of identifying people who they think are likely to be Trump voters. They're checking to see if they're register -- they're checking to see if they voted.

They're looking for, as you say, low-propensity voters, people who might not otherwise vote. And then he is running a get out the vote operation for Trump. And he will then target those voters for particular attention. And there are people on the ground, Jake, in Pennsylvania, who believe, Democrats, who believe that this could make a 50,000 vote difference in Pennsylvania. If that were the case, given the closeness of the race, that could be really important.

TAPPER: Yeah. I mean, you could, and it might be the margin of victory itself.

AXELROD: It could be.

TAPPER: I wanted to ask you about what President Biden did the other night when he said that the only garbage he sees out there are Trump supporters. And then he tried to amend it. And the Whitehouse claimed that there was an apostrophe s in there or this and that. The most charitable interpretation of it is that he very clumsily spoke and gave a distraction. What did you make of all that?

AXELROD: Well, I can't speak to why he said what he said. All I can say is that it sent the campaign in a whole different direction. Kamala Harris was making a speech right outside the Whitehouse that had precisely the opposite message about how we should treat each other as Americans and how we should treat opposition. And this became the story. So instead of her closing speech being the story, half of it was what Biden said, and it gave an out to Trump after that horrible rally at Madison Square Garden with that comedian sliming Puerto Rico and Puerto Ricans. And it gave him a chance to pose in a garbage truck and say they're -- they're accusing my supporters of being garbage. So, it really was an unforced error but it wasn't hers. It was his, which makes it kind of egregious.

TAPPER: Yes. There are going to be books written about that guy. David Axelrod, thanks so much. Really appreciate it. Always good to have you here.

AXELROD: Great to see you, Jake. Thank you.

TAPPER: And congratulations again on The Axe File, 600 episodes.

AXELROD: Thank you.

TAPPER: That's --

AXELROD: Thank you.

TAPPER: Amazing.

The challenges for Kamala Harris, specifically in Battleground Arizona. She wraps up that rally moments ago in Phoenix. My next guest knows Arizona pretty well.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: In our Politics Lead, Kamala Harris only moments ago trying to rally voters in Phoenix in battleground Arizona. We turn now to Democratic Senator Mark Kelly of Arizona. Senator, thanks for joining us. So Vice President Harris just finished speaking right where you're standing. I'm going to run a little bit about what she said about Donald Trump and what's at stake. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: This is someone who is unstable, obsessed with revenge, consumed with grievance and out for unchecked power. And in less than 90 days, it will either be him or me in the Oval Office.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[17:35:16]

TAPPER: What do you make of that as a closing message?

SEN. MARK KELLY (D-AZ): Well, I think she got it about right. You know, Jake, I -- a few months ago, I was in Europe meeting with our allies in the Baltic states and Finland. They're really concerned about their own safety and the safety of our European allies.

And, you know, Donald Trump in four years in the White House spent a lot of time and energy on shredding our alliances. So, I'd say with the exception of -- of -- of that, I think she got it, you know, 100 percent right. And this election is so consequential. We've got five days. There's a lot of energy here in Arizona. We're working to get out the vote. And I believe that Kamala Harris is going to win Arizona is going to be the next president and get sworn in 90 days.

TAPPER: Arizona is not only a battleground, it's a really tough battleground. Biden only carried Arizona by fewer than 11,000 votes. And there is a competitive Senate race as well. What does the ground game look like in these final days? The operation to actually target voters that have not voted early, get them to the polls. You've been flying yourself across the state recently. What voters still need to be reached?

KELLY: Yes, Jake, my staff loves that when I fly this -- I fly myself around in this little airplane. I was just the other day with Tim Walz. I was up in Window Rock on the Navajo Nation. I've been to Tuba City, also on the Navajo Nation, Lake Havasu, Flagstaff, Casa Grande, Sierra Vista, Yuma, all over the state in the last 10 days. It feels really good. We've got 130,000. I mean, think about that, Jake, 130,000 volunteers who are making phone calls, sending texts, knocking on doors. Lot of energy.

I think people understand the consequences. But you're right, this is Arizona. And in 2010, Kamala Harris and Joe Biden won by only 10,000 votes. And I think this is going to be another very close election. Feels very similar. Voting pattern is a little bit different. We're not in a pandemic anymore. But I really believe that our -- our ground game is better than Donald Trump's. They've got to pay people to do this work. We have volunteers that are committed to the future of this country.

TAPPER: Two gaffes in the last few days. You have Joe Biden seeming to call Trump supporters garbage. You also have that comedian at the Trump rally in Madison Square Garden calling, joking, I guess he was trying to make a joke of Puerto Rico is a floating island of garbage. As you're out there in the trail, how much are either of these breaking through to voters?

KELLY: You know, I think if you're Latino, especially if you're Puerto Rican, I think it means a lot that, you know, Donald Trump and, you know, the people that he will put at stage -- on stage at a rally, you know, have this view of you as an individual, you as a community. That is just -- that is just wrong and divisive.

But that's who Donald Trump is. I mean, he's a guy who has spent the last 10 years just trying to divide -- divide us by race and any other reason he can find to divide this country. Kamala Harris is committed to being a president for everybody. You know, she talked about that to -- today on the stage. She had, you know, sitting in the row with Gabby and I was Jeff Flake and John Giles and John McCain's son, Jim. You know, these are Republicans that are there because she's going to be a president for everybody.

She -- she is -- you know, Donald Trump has been anomaly in our country's history. The first president who I feel is intentionally trying to divide our country. So, you know, the -- the contrast couldn't be more clear to the American people.

TAPPER: Authorities in Maricopa County, which is the largest in Maricopa County, are ramping up efforts to protect poll workers, given a rise in threats. How concerned are you?

KELLY: Well, we do elections well here. In 2020 and in 2022, especially with Kari Lake on the ballot. But with Donald Trump contesting a free and fair election, it did create some problems. Now, I'm going to quote our former governor, Republican Governor Doug Ducey. We do elections well here. We've got a governor now and Katie Hobbs, the Attorney General, the Secretary of State, who are committed to making sure this is a free and fair election.

Donald Trump and his allies are already questioning an election that didn't happen. Kari Lake is doing the same thing. So it's a concern. Our Republican County recorder here in Maricopa County, Steve Richer, did a fine job in 2022. He's going to do a good job again here. We're going to get this done. People are able to vote.

[17:40:12]

You know, we'll -- we'll -- we might have a little -- small bumps in the road of -- of -- along the way. That always happens. But we do this well here. Arizonans are already voting. They're voting at very high numbers. And we're going to have a good Election Day on -- on November 5th.

TAPPER: Senator Mark Kelly of Arizona, thank you so much. Appreciate your time, sir.

A social media trend known as subway surfing turns deadly. How officials are trying to stop this before the next person dares to try this again. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: In our National Lead, it's called subway surfing. It's a deadly stunt where New Yorkers often young New Yorkers ride on top of a moving train. And it's claimed another young life just this week. This time the victim was 13 years old. CNN's Brynn Gingras explains how this social media phenomenon is making it increasingly difficult for officials to stop this fatal trend.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRYNN GINGRAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Its viral videos like this one showing teens on top of New York City subway cars so called surfing. That could lead to tragic consequences.

[17:45:07]

GINGRAS: That initial reaction, what was her thought hearing this happened to her daughter?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She didn't accept it. She was just felt that couldn't believe it.

GINGRAS (voice-over): The family of 13-year-old, Krystel Romero, too distraught to show their faces. The teen killed after slipping and falling between moving subway cars Sunday.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She spoke to her not doing it. Like -- like many times but she just --

GINGRAS: She tried to warn her.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know kids right now, like they just tell them something and they just don't care.

GINGRAS (voice-over): Romero's death marking the sixth from subway surfing this year, the second in just weeks.

GINGRAS: Tell me what's in your hand right there?

NORMA NAZARIO, SON DIED WHILE SUBWAY SURFING: This is Zackery's funeral card, which I don't want any mother to be holding this like I am right now.

GINGRAS (voice-over): It's been more than a year since Norma Nazario lost her son to subway surfing.

NAZARIO: He was introduced to TikTok and the challenge at the moment which it was subway surfing. Unfortunately, I didn't know. I wish I did.

GINGRAS: Why do you think he did that that day?

NAZARIO: The challenge. Social media likes. I can do it better.

GINGRAS (voice-over): City and state officials continue to comment the dangerous craze, with public service announcements by scrubbing videos from social media sites --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- everyone, I got it.

GINGRAS (voice-over): -- and now drones.

MAYOR ERIC ADAMS (D), NEW YORK CITY: The drones is the game changer for really catching it in action.

GINGRAS (voice over): CNN got an exclusive look at how the technology helps.

GINGRAS: People calling in and also the officers on the ground and also the drones.

ADAMS: Yes -- yes.

KAZ DAUGHTRY, DEPUTY COMMISSIONER OF OPERATIONS, NYPD: And also it's -- you should note that these kids are getting crafty. They'll have a black jacket on when they're doing subway surfing. As they descend to the actual train car.

GINGRAS: They're disguising themselves.

ADAMS: So we already know who they're looking for.

GINGRAS (voice over): Once caught, the NYPD says the kids aren't arrested. Instead, their parents are shown police drone footage like this, hoping they'll be spooked enough to never do it again.

ADAMS: That rush of getting that like, like, like and views and that competition makes it even more and more dangerous. GINGRAS (voice-over): Meta tells CNN it removes videos that don't meet its guidelines, so does TikTok, which also puts up warnings like this one when searching for the videos. Still not enough for Nazario, who sued several social media sites in the wake of Zackery's death.

NAZARIO: They could give me a billion dollars and -- and I don't care. Just bring me my son back.

GINGRAS: Brynn Gingras, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

TAPPER: And our thanks to Brynn Gingras in New York for that report. Possible legal trouble may be on the way former New York Governor Andrew Cuomo, a Democrat. A House Republican subcommittee just referred Cuomo to the Justice Department for potential prosecution. What's the alleged act behind this referral? That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:52:07]

TAPPER: In our Law and Justice Lead, former New York Governor Andrew Cuomo may be in hot water, not just politically, but legally. The Republican-led House Subcommittee on the coronavirus pandemic just referred the Democrat to the Justice Department for potential prosecution, saying that Cuomo lied to Congress during an interview this summer with the subcommittee on his role in drafting a 2020 report, New York State health report, that underestimated the number of COVID nursing home deaths in New York State.

Let's bring in the chairman of the subcommittee, Republican Representative Brad Wenstrup of Ohio. He's also a physician. Congressman, what exactly does your committee believe Cuomo lied about?

REP. BRAD WENSTRUP (R-OH), CHAIR, SELECT COMMITTEE ON THE CORONAVIRUS PANDEMIC: Well, first of all, let me -- let me just say on behalf of the -- the victims of -- of COVID and their families, and especially in New York in this case. You know I wish we weren't required to make referral, but the facts left us no choice, and so we recommended charge -- to charge criminally on -- on false statements.

So, let's just start with one. You know, Governor Cuomo said that he was not involved with the review or drafting of the New York Health Department report from July 6th, which was intended to downplay the -- the accusations that his directive to put COVID patients into nursing homes was -- was a problem. And it was to downplay that.

He said he had nothing to do with it. He said he didn't review it and didn't edit it. But we were able to get documents. We spoke to people on his team, we requested records, and we were able to clearly get evidence that he did do that. But in his transcribed interview, he said he did not.

Another one that stands out is they said there were no discussions with him about getting the report peer reviewed. You know, if you didn't have anything to do with the report, I guess you wouldn't have anything to do with the peer review. But evidence shows to the contrary that he did, that he made recommendations of who he wanted to peer review the article.

And, you know, at one point, he said he had no knowledge of anyone outside the Department of Health reviewing the report. But clearly, by the evidence, that shows that he did have influence on that as well. \ TAPPER: And the evidence is mainly people who worked around him contradicting him. I mean, I saw the -- the transcript of his former assistant who was forwarding a document with edits, and she told your committee that, your subcommittee, that was his handwriting, the notes on the edits for this New York State Health Department report. That's -- that's what you mean when you -- you talk about evidence that contradicts him?

WENSTRUP: Abs -- absolutely. And in one of the e-mails, it was said that the governor's edits are attached for your review, and that was part of it. So, you know, clearly there's a contradiction there. When he said he had -- he had nothing to do with that.

[17:55:08]

It's very interesting, Jake, because he said he had nothing to do with the directive to put patients into nursing homes with COVID. And that was a directive that wasn't a guideline or a recommendation. That was a directive. And so he put that out, prohibited the nursing homes from even testing patients for COVID, and then said he had nothing to do with it but then was defending it saying well, it adhered to CDC guidelines, which it did not. Or else there have been a lot of states that were maybe doing the same thing, but they weren't because it didn't adhere to CDC guidelines.

And then he said, well, the nursing homes should have been following CDC guidelines, but those were guidelines, and his was a directive with -- with his name on it.

TAPPER: So, his legal team filed a referral letter to the Justice Department requesting that they investigate you.

WENSTRUP: Right.

TAPPER: They're alleging some collusion having to do with you and Janice Dean, who's a "Fox News" weather reporter whose husband's parents died in a nursing home in New York. And I think he's suing the state. What -- what's your response to this?

WENSTRUP: It seems reactionary, but I -- I -- I don't take it very seriously, Jake, because there's nothing there. You know, I will never apologize. I know they use a picture where I'm hugging Janice Dean but I'll never apologize for being compassionate towards people that lose loved ones.

That to me is just a human touch. And part of me as a physician. And I've had to do that with gold star families et cetera. So I -- I think they're just trying to find something. And maybe they don't understand what a congressional investigation is required to do. And I can tell you, as a member of Congress and chair in this committee, we wanted to hear from the people of New York that had something to say because they were so personally affected. And Janice Dean happened to be one of them but one of many. And -- and she's just one of many from both sides of the aisle that have stepped forward, Jake.

TAPPER: Yes. And for people at home to -- who maybe don't fully understand, that report from the New York Department of Health under counted the number of deaths due to this directive at nursing homes by about 46 -- 47 percent. That's according to a different audit by a New York Democrat.

Republican congressman from Ohio, Bren Wenstrup, the chairman of the subcommittee on the coronavirus pandemic, thanks so much for your time.

WENSTRUP: You bet. Thank you.

TAPPER: And we are following a breaking story in Chicago right now. The Chicago school board president has just resigned at the request of the mayor. Let's go to CNN's Whitney Wild. Whitney, why did the mayor ask the school board president to resign?

WHITNEY WILD, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT CORRESPONDENT: Well Jake, local news reports had surfaced detailing social media posts that were highly problematic that Chicago leaders called anti-Semitic, called misogynistic and called conspiratorial. For example, Jake, one of those posts that this school board member reposted was a photo of the 9/11 attacks. And the caption in that photo read that 3,000 plus experts agree 9/11 really was an inside job.

And the school board member reposted that with the caption facts, exclamation point, exclamation point. So, this is a photo you're looking at right now of Reverend Mitchell Johnson. He was, Jake, the Chicago Board of Education president for a short seven days before being asked to resign. We are also following, Jake, a story breaking at this moment.

This is a follow up to a story we told you about earlier this week where a man who shot a Jewish man who was walking to synagogue on Saturday morning is now being charged with terrorism and hate crime charges, Jake. Let me just walk you through this case. This happened 9:30 in the morning on Saturday. Again, is this man who was wearing Jewish garb, a kippah, for example, he was walking to synagogue and he was targeted by this man, a 22-year-old man named Sidi Mohamed Abdallahi.

He was shot. He suffered non-life-threatening injuries. But after this he got into a shooting with the Chicago Police Department. The alleged assailant here is now in the hospital. Earlier this week he had been facing a long list of felony attempted murder charges, Jake.

And in Chicago there were many questions about why he was not being shot, charged with a hate crime. Police saying that they were working toward determining a motive. They were able to do that, Jake, after combing through his digital -- his digital records. And they were very concerned about making sure that they had a good solid evidence to back up that motive. Now they say they have it. They are now charging him with terrorism and hate crime charges. Jake?

TAPPER: Yes. It often takes a couple days to determine definitively motive. Whitney Wild, thank you so much. Appreciate it.

[18:00:03]

We are just five days out from election night in America. And that night I will bring you everything going on, the key race alerts and the projections. We'll have John King at the Magic Wall. We'll have so many wise commentators and reporters on the ground and at the campaign headquarters. No one covers an election like CNN.

Our special coverage is next Tuesday starting at 4:00 p.m. Eastern. Going to be a long night. Going to drink a lot of coffee. The news continues on CNN with Wolf Blitzer in The Situation Room. See you tomorrow.