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The Lead with Jake Tapper

Hamas And Israel Agree To Ceasefire-Hostage Deal; Bondi, Rubio And Other Trump Cabinet Picks Face Senators; TikTok Will Be Banned In U.S. Sunday If No Sale Or Court Ruling. Aired 4-5p ET

Aired January 15, 2025 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[16:00:02]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KARINE JEAN-PIERRE, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: As I said earlier, standing at this podium, behind this lectern, serving the American people and this administration has been an honor of a lifetime, and I will be forever grateful.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DANA BASH, CNN HOST: Jean-Pierre first took over as press secretary in May of 2022 l, after serving as deputy press secretary. The first black woman and LGBT -- LGBTQ person to be the White House press secretary.

THE LEAD WITH JAKE TAPPER starts right now.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Welcome to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper.

Our major breaking news right now, Israel and Hamas have agreed to a deal that will pause the fighting in Gaza and lead to the phased release of hostages in Gaza and Palestinian prisoners in Israel.

President Joe Biden just confirmed that in the last hour.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: One of the 15 months of terror for the hostages, their families, the Israeli people. More than 15 months of suffering by the innocent people of Gaza, fighting in Gaza will stop. And soon the hostages will return home to their families.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: The deal, the formation of which has been incredibly laborious and obviously is still fragile, could take effect as soon as this Sunday as the government of Israel releases hundreds of Palestinian prisoners. Hamas is expected to release 33 of the 251 hostages they kidnapped from Israel, 467 days ago, and their October 7th, 2023, attack, 157 of those 251 hostages have already been released.

Israel believes most of the 33 hostages set to be released hopefully Sunday are alive.

Sources tell CNN this group will include Americans Keith Siegel and Sagui Dekel Chen. Seven Americans in total are still being held hostage by Hamas, only three of whom are presumed to be alive. In addition to bringing the hostages home, the ceasefire itself could also allow the much needed relief and aid that be brought to the people of Gaza. Celebrations in both Israel and Gaza are taking place today, as this is all intended to be just the first phase in a larger potential peace deal.

If phase one goes well, negotiations for the second phase could begin on the 16th day of this first deal. Phase two is intended, we're told, to end the war itself. President Biden says it would bring the remaining hostages who are still alive, home.

We should note, of course, this deal is fundamentally what Biden proposed back in May. President-elect Donald Trump also claims the deal is only happening because he will take office in just a few days. Trump's Middle East envoy, Steve Witkoff, was there in Qatar for the final three day stretch of negotiations, a development that Biden administration official says said was critical in bringing negotiations over the finish line. A Democratic insider indeed tells me that the threat of what Trump would do if this was not resolved by the time he took office was a, quote, huge, unquote, factor in this deal happening.

Let's get right to CNN's Jeremy Diamond in Tel Aviv and MJ Lee at the White House for us.

And, MJ, we're getting brand new details about the hostages. Tell us.

MJ LEE, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yeah. You know, we had heard President Biden saying earlier today that Americans would be among the hostages that were released in this first phase. And sources tell me and my colleague Jenny Hansler that two American hostages, they are Keith Siegel and Sagui Dekel-Chen, they are on the list of the initial 33 hostages who will be released in this first six week phase of the ceasefire.

As a reminder, you're looking at their faces on the screen right now, seven American hostages remain in Gaza and four of them have been declared dead. And Keith and Sagui are among the three who had been presumed alive this entire time. So that is going to be, of course, a joyous celebration for those families. Once they are hopefully soon reunited with Keith and Sagui.

But for the rest of the American hostages and their families, of course, they are going to be waiting still for some good news. Now, securing the release of the remaining hostages. As you said, Jake, is going to fall on Donald Trump and his incoming administration. And President Biden actually said that it was for this specific reason that he instructed his team to work hand in hand with the incoming Trump team. But it was also clear during this -- the remarks that the president

gave at the White House that even still, there are some sensitivities around the question of who actually gets the lion's share of the credit for this deal coming together. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: This deal would have to be implemented by the next team. So I told my team to coordinate closely with the incoming team to make sure we're all speaking with the same voice, because that's what American presidents do.

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REPORTER: Who's credit for this, Mr. President, you or Trump?

BIDEN: Is that a joke?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEE: And just to give you a quick sense of this coordination between the Biden and Trump teams that we are talking about, we have had the current Middle East coordinator for the White House, Brett McGurk, and the incoming person playing that role for Donald Trump Steve Witkoff they have basically been in the same place in Doha having these negotiations, being involved in the same conversation. So, basically working together to hammer out these final details.

One interesting thing I note is that President Biden did say in his remarks, if the negotiations do not result in the next phase of a ceasefire during the first six weeks, the ceasefire will still remain in place so long as the negotiations are still ongoing and the talks are happening.

But, of course, he is somebody that knows better than anybody else how tough those talks are going to be. But in just five days, that is no longer going to be President Biden's problem -- Jake.

TAPPER: All right. Jeremy, there's still a process that has to happen in Israel. Tell us what has to happen next in order for these 33 hostages to come home?

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: Yeah. That's right, Jake.

Tomorrow, we expect that the Israeli prime minister will bring this agreement before his security cabinet for an up or down vote. Following that, if indeed it passes, then it will go to the full cabinet for approval. This deal does not need to go before the full Israeli parliament, and we know that even as recently as today, the Israeli prime minister was still engaged in political wrangling with the right wing elements of his governing coalition. The finance minister, Bezalel Smotrich, who has expressed his opposition to this deal. Netanyahu is trying to convince him not to topple the governing coalition over it. And we are also being told, Jake, that the Israeli prime minister will not address the Israeli public until after that process is completed tomorrow, once this deal is fully approved by the Israeli government. We also expect that after that, the Israeli Supreme Court will have to hear petitions from individuals who want to block the release of the Palestinian prisoners who will be exchanged, hundreds of them, in exchange for these 33 Israeli hostages.

But once all of that is done, Jake, we expect that Sunday, this ceasefire will go into effect. The first Israeli hostages will cross into Israel, and then we will go through a process of six weeks, a process that will likely be agonizing for many of the families of these hostages. It will also be a process, of course, that will bring much needed calm and peace to the Gaza strip. After 15 months of this unending war of ceaseless bombardment. Finally, a reprieve and humanitarian aid also set to surge into the strip. Jake.

TAPPER: All right. Jeremy Diamond in Tel Aviv for us, MJ Lee at the White House, thanks so much.

With us now in studio, CNN chief international anchor Christiane Amanpour.

Christiane, you're here in D.C. because this morning you spoke when you interviewed Secretary of State Antony Blinken for his last interview as secretary of state. Tell us about the moment and put this in perspective for us.

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: So, you know, we are the last on his -- on his list of farewells. But timing is everything. So we were there as this was going on, and I was able to get from the horse's mouth the precise details.

So first of all, I asked him about what it would look like because there were all these details that people want to know. It\s multi- phased and this is what he told me about the first phase.

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AMANPOUR: Tell me when this ceasefire comes into effect, what exactly will it mean? Is that the end of the war? What is it? Or is it an interim method?

ANTONY BLINKEN, SECRETARY OF STATE: So it'll be on the basis of the plan that President Biden put forward back in May, and that we rallied the entire world behind and ever since then. We've been working to negotiate the details, the implementation. It's been delayed and derailed by different events. But we're I think finally, at the point where this gets over the line.

Once that happens, here's what happens. First, the firing stops. Hamas Israel stopped firing. Israel pulls back its forces. Hostages begin to be released.

Prisoners come out of Israeli jails and go back. And we surge humanitarian assistance to people who so desperately need it. All of that happens during a six-week period, but also during that six weeks, we have to negotiate the understandings to get to a permanent cease fire so that Israel pulls all of its forces out of Gaza. Hamas doesn't come back in, and there's the necessary governance, security, reconstruction arrangements so that Gaza can move forward.

AMANPOUR: Is that sorted?

BLINKEN: That's not sorted. We've worked on it intensely for the last 6 or 7 months, intensely but quietly, with Arab partners, with others. I think there's some basic understandings that we've reached. But the ceasefire itself hopefully would concentrate minds and get people to agree on what's necessary to get that day after a post-conflict plan in place.

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AMANPOUR: Day after post-conflict. And also, he said very clearly to lead eventually to an independent Palestinian state side by side with the secure Israel Israeli state. And so I thought that was very interesting, including what he said. You said, you know, you heard that it's Biden's plan. It could have happened in May. It didn't.

Hamas and Israel responsible for, you know, blocking a lot of that. And so people's lives have lost since then. But he said he's been speaking to Marco Rubio, his successor. They've had very good conversations. They have been pretty much working in lockstep. And Rubio himself today credited both Trump and Biden officials for this ceasefire.

TAPPER: And you also asked Blinken about accusations of war crimes committed by Israel. Tell us about that.

AMANPOUR: I did, because first of all, you know, Ben-Gvir, the other extremist firebrand, has threatened to topple the government, says he's worked for a year to stop any kind of ceasefire negotiations and to bring back the hostages. And we've seen what's happened.

So I actually put it to Blinken in a way that really had the Israelis talk about the war crimes. Moshe Ya'alon, the former defense minister, saying that what Israel has been doing recently in northern Gaza, especially and around, is ethnic cleansing and war crimes. The Haaretz warriors for truth have had incredible investigations. I put all this to him about, you know, Israel in some areas, treating anybody who enters, including children, as a terrorist and killing them about breaking the silence, the incredible group that talks to and takes confessions, so to speak, of those Israelis who are not happy with what they have done in various conflict zones.

So he said to me, Blinken, it's not for me to say, but the Israelis themselves will and are already investigating, and he is sure that Israel itself will come to a conclusion about how they conducted themselves in this war, in part.

TAPPER: All right. Christiane Amanpour, great to have you here. Thank you so much.

As noted, the Biden administration worked for months on this deal, but the incoming Trump administration is also taking a victory lap and applauding the work of Trump's new Middle East envoy.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARCO RUBIO, SECRETARY OF STATE NOMINEE: All involved deserve credit for the ceasefire that the chairman has just announced, but Steve Witkoff has been a critical component of it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Democratic insider tells me. As I said earlier, Trump was indeed a, quote, huge, unquote, factor in this emerging deal. We're going to talk about Mr. Trump's role next.

Plus, the father of an American hostage held by Hamas will join me with his reaction to this deal. We'll be right back.

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TAPPER: And we're back with our breaking news. The celebrations in Gaza today After Hamas and the government of Israel agreed on a ceasefire deal, at least the beginning of it that will pause the fighting and could potentially see the release of 33 hostages being held by Hamas for the last 15 months on the streets of Tel Aviv. Emotional embraces and hostage square, where many families have reportedly been gathering for the last 15 months waiting for this very day.

Let's bring in studio here, Evelyn Farkas, who served as deputy assistant secretary of defense for Russia, Ukraine and Eurasia. Also with us, David Sanger of "The New York Times".

And, David, we really should emphasize this is still a very precarious agreement that could fall apart at any moment.

DAVID SANGER, CNN POLITICAL AND NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: It could. I mean, it's very hopeful. This is the closest they've gotten. And, you know, we've been through this for 13 months.

Tomorrow it's got to get through the Israeli security cabinet and the Israeli general cabinet could bring down Netanyahu's government. His right wing is still opposed. Hamas presumably has agreed to this. But the Hamas leadership is incredibly fractured in after, of course, the death of their leader, Sinwar and so forth.

And then you've actually got to execute on this. And there's some question about whether Hamas knows where each one of these hostages are, how long it may take to get them all together. There are 33 in this first group. We're not sure how many are alive beyond that.

It will be a joyous occasion when those 33 get reunited, but it's going to be pretty tense about all of the rest.

TAPPER: Yeah, and Evelyn, President-elect Trump saying this happened because he's taking office in a few days. He wrote on Truth Social today, quote, this epic ceasefire agreement could have only happened as a result of our historic victory in November, as it signaled to the entire world that my administration would seek peace and negotiate deals to ensure the safety of all Americans.

The Democratic insider does tell me that the threat of what the world will look like when Trump takes office was a, quote, huge factor in this happening. What do you think?

EVELYN FARKAS, FORMER DEPUTY ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF STATE FOR RUSSIA, UKRAINE & EURASIA: Success has a thousand fathers.

TAPPER: Right.

FARKAS: I mean, so, so clearly the plan was put in place by the Biden administration and the incoming Trump administration did a wonderful patriotic thing by joining with the Biden team and making sure they got this across the finish line.

I would say hopefully it's one step. It's a really important step. Obviously, these people need to be brought home, including our Americans, the Israeli people have been protesting, you know, every Saturday for the release of the hostages, and Hamas is on the back foot. So this was a great deal, a great opportunity.

The question is what's next? Because really we want peace and stability in the Middle East. And that is going to be now up to the Trump administration.

TAPPER: Yeah. And that is the big question because, David, there's still negotiating to be done. One of the key questions who's going to govern Gaza. Much of it is in ruins. Obviously people are in dire need.

SANGER: That's right. So there have been a couple elements. First on Evelyn's point, what's been fascinating here is the work between Brett McGurk, who's been the president's negotiator on all of this, and Steve Witkoff, who has been President Trump's negotiator on it.

Mr. Witkoff told me on, a week ago at Mar-a-Lago, just before he went over for this last part of this, that he has sat in on every one of McGurk's negotiating sessions, it was clear to both sides that the Trump administration would inherit the six week deadline here for this first phase and have to take over the second.

But I think the other question is, what does this open up?

[16:20:02]

And the biggest one is that it could open up a chance to go negotiate with Iran, which is going to be the thing that's going to hit the new Trump administration head on when they -- when they take office. TAPPER: And, Evelyn, could this deal have any impact on national

security here in the United States, especially on the subject that David just brought up the idea of this confrontation with Iran, which President Biden pointed out is probably weaker now than its been in a long time because of what's happened in Syria, what happened with Hezbollah, what happened with Hamas? Et cetera.

FARKAS: Yeah. I mean, Jake, we face two threats from Iran. First, of course, the nuclear program that they have, which eventually could hit the United States if we let them go to fruition. So we need to put that back in the box.

I -- it's likely that I don't really know what president Trump threatened Iran because we know, okay. They threatened they put pressure on Hamas, but they really put pressure on Tehran. So they may have threatened to actually bomb those nuclear facilities if he hasn't threatened that, I'm sure he would be happy to do so.

The second part of the threat posed by Iran are the terrorist organizations that they control, not just Hamas, not just the Houthis, but independent actors. And we know that they have put a mark, a target on Americans, Americans who served in the Trump administration before, but also service members. They've attacked our service members.

So we want to eliminate the threat posed by Iran. Ultimately, what we want is a peaceful regime change. And but -- but in the meantime, we'll take -- we'll take them back in the box through negotiations.

TAPPER: All right. Evelyn Farkas and David Sanger, thanks to both of you.

Two American hostages are expected to be released in this first phase of the deal. Edan Alexander is not on that list. You see him on the screen right now. His father is going to join me next amid this uncertainty still about his son's release.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: Back with the major news in our world lead. Israeli and American officials believe that seven people with American citizenship hostages are still in Gaza. Sources tell CNN that two of the three, who are presumed alive, Sagui Dekel-Chen and Keith Siegel will be released in the first phase of the ceasefire and hostage deal. They believe it is unlikely that 21 year old New Jersey native Edan Alexander will be released in the first phase since he serves in Israel's military.

Edan Alexander's father Adi joins us now.

Adi, this must be an incredibly emotional moment for you. How are you and your family processing this news?

ADI ALEXANDER, FATHER OF AMERICAN HOSTAGE EDAN ALEXANDER: Hi, Jake. Yeah, it was very emotional, long coming. We've been so close before,

and finally, the parties managed to pass it over the finish line. And we really are grateful.

TAPPER: What is your understanding of when Edan could be released?

ALEXANDER: My understanding is it could happen between now and 42 days from now, and we really encourage the parties that are still in Doha. Do not wait 16 days to start to negotiate for the second phase. Do it tomorrow morning.

Don't waste the time. It's been too long, 15 long months. And we have to keep pushing.

TAPPER: So your wife Yael spoke at a protest recently and appealed directly to President-elect Trump, urging him to use his influence to get the deal done and, quote, show the world what the United States can do.

Do you feel like this happened in part, at least due to Trump entering office next week?

ALEXANDER: Yeah, absolutely. I think the -- using the January 20th as a deadline actually helped the parties. And this last visit of Steve Witkoff in Israel on Saturday pushed things forward. And we are grateful that both presidents worked with collaboration on this issue. It was really important and -- good job.

TAPPER: Yeah. Yael Rosenberg at "The Atlantic" writes that the pending presidency of Trump convinced Hamas that they were not going to get a better deal in a week. And two, Netanyahu is very eager to stay on Trump's good side, and that was part of his motivating factor.

Is that -- is that your understanding, too?

ALEXANDER: Yeah, I agree with that. Absolutely. I completely agree with that.

And again, once you put the deadline and all the parties trying to push forward for that deadline, I think it was -- it was a great achievement.

TAPPER: Adi, we've been talking to you since this horrible calamity happened on October 7th of 2023. What has kept you and Yael, your wife, go. How have you been able to hold it together during all this?

ALEXANDER: First of all, it could end up differently on October 7th, over the last year for our son. As, you know, his post was surrounded by so many -- so many terrorists. And he managed to survive or surrender. And we had signs of life, from back in November, and that recent video that was released on Thanksgiving evening, Thanksgiving weekend that kept us really, really hopeful.

We -- it was the first sign of life for us. And we really are grateful to receive that that video back then. And really, you go on autopilot every day, put the t-shirt, and keep pushing. [16:30:00]

TAPPER: Yep. Well, Adi Alexander, thank you so much. Our thoughts and prayers continue to be with you and your family. And let's pray for peace for all the innocent people in the region. Thank you so much for joining us.

ALEXANDER: Thank you, Jake.

TAPPER: This was also a big day on Capitol Hill where six Trump administration nominees for his cabinet were in confirmation hearings. That includes Pam Bondi, President-elect Trump's pick for U.S. attorney general. The loyalty question she was repeatedly asked and the praise she's getting after a tense day of fielding questions. That's next.

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TAPPER: In our politics lead, six of President-elect Donald Trump's cabinet nominees in confirmation hearings today. That list includes Pam Bondi for U.S. attorney general, Sean Duffy for transportation secretary, John Ratcliffe for CIA director, Senator Marco Rubio for secretary of state, Russell Vought for head of the Office of Management and Budget, and Chris Wright for secretary of the Department of Energy.

[16:35:17]

Pam Bondi drew wide praise earlier today from Judiciary Committee Republicans such as Senator Lindsey Graham of South Carolina.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM (R-SC): I think you're the perfect pick at one of the most dangerous times in American history, and I look forward to supporting you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

The most contentious exchanges today came with committee Democrats, who repeatedly pressed Bondi over her loyalty to President-elect Trump.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. DICK DURBIN (D-IL): Are you prepared to say today, under oath, without reservation, that Donald Trump lost the presidential contest to Joe Biden in 2020?

PAM BONDI, ATTORNEY GENERAL NOMINEE: Ranking member Durbin, President Biden is the president of the United States. I was an advocate for the campaign, and I was on the ground in Pennsylvania, and I saw many things there. But do I accept the results? Of course I do.

SEN. MAZIE HIRONO (D-HI): Who won the 2020 presidential election?

BONDI: Joe Biden is the president of the United States.

HIRONO: Ms. Bondi, you know that there is a difference between acknowledging it. And, you know, I can say that Donald Trump won the 2024 election. I may not like it, but I can say it. You cannot say who won the 2020 presidential election.

Okay. It's disturbing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: CNN's chief legal affairs correspondent, Paula Reid, followed the hearing from Capitol Hill.

And, Paula, Pam Bondi received strong support from Senate Republicans and some tough questions from Democrats.

PAULA REID, CNN CHIEF LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: That's exactly right. Now, the one thing that everyone seemed to agree on is that Bondi is qualified, after three decades as a state prosecutor, but Democrats still appear skeptical that she will be able to resist the kind of pressure that President-elect Trump has put on his previous attorneys general when he wanted to use the Department of Justice to pursue his own aims.

Let's take a listen to one of the answers she gave on this issue.

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BONDI: I will not politicize that office. I will not target people simply because of their political affiliation. Justice will be administered evenhandedly throughout this country.

Senator, we've got to bring this country back together. We've got to move forward, or were going to lose our country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

REID: Now, Bondi has previously said that she believes Trump was unfairly investigated and prosecuted, and that those investigators should be prosecuted. Now, when pressed specifically today on whether former special counsel Jack Smith should be investigated, she was noncommittal but said that he has not been prejudged.

Now, Republicans wanted to keep the focus on her resume, and a lot of the other important work that the Justice Department does. The one thing I will say that came as a bit of a surprise was how many questions she got about Trump's pick to lead the FBI, Kash Patel. She was repeatedly asked to explain or defend or react to things he has said about his perceived enemies, about dismantling parts of the FBI and a statement in support of QAnon.

And not surprisingly, she deferred to Patel to respond to those things. But the fact that she got so many questions about him suggests that his path to confirmation will be nowhere near as smooth as Bondi's appears to be.

TAPPER: All right, Paula, thanks so much.

Lets discuss all of this with our panel.

And, Jamal Simmons, we just heard Pam Bondi say she will not politicize the Justice Department. What's your reaction to that?

JAMAL SIMMONS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: God, I hope so. Like, I really do hope so.

Listen, she is obviously a not -- a denier of the election in 2020. She's obviously an apologist for the president. And, you know, she was a lobbyist when she was in Florida. So she's got some things that we may not necessarily like as Democrats, but gosh, it sure could have been a lot worse if we had had Matt Gaetz sitting on that stand.

So I think everybody on in the quiet part of themselves is, is sighing a little sigh of relief that we don't have to deal with Matt Gaetz while also knowing were going to have a Trump apologist in the Justice Department. And hopefully, like she said, there will be no enemies list in her DOJ. So we're going to hold her accountable to those statements.

TAPPER: Elliot, Pam Bondi was asked about Trump's nominee to lead the FBI, Kkash Patel, as we've been discussing.

Here's part of that exchange.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BONDI: I have known Kash, and I believe that Kash is the right person at this time. For this job, you'll have the ability to question Mr. Patel, when you do.

SEN. SHELDON WHITEHOUSE (D-RI): And I'm questioning you right now about whether you will enforce an enemies list that he announced publicly on television.

BONDI: Oh, Senator. I'm sorry. There will never be an enemies list within the Department of Justice.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Elliot, what's -- what's your reaction as a former federal prosecutor?

ELLIOT WILLIAMS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Yeah, Jake, that -- that was the only defensible answer she could have given, and she did give it. And frankly, she should be applauded for that.

[16:40:01]

You know, Kash Patel has noted, I believe his book was called "Government Gangsters" and people in the deep state, and had identified a number of people that potentially, I guess, he wanted to go after. He can answer those questions when he comes up for his hearing. It is a very important point of concern. The FBI is the largest investigative agency within the Justice Department.

She will ultimately be his boss, and its a fair question for a senator at a confirmation hearing to ask if a major employee of yours does have a, quote/unquote, enemies list, what will you do to enforce it? So she gave the right answer there. But to Jamal's point, it remains to be seen. And this is why Congress exists to oversee questions like this of, you know, of senior government officials to see if she keeps her word over the years that she has the role.

TAPPER: Tiffany, to the -- to the point about Kash Patel. I want to play something that Republican Senator Thom Tillis of North Carolina said during the hearing about all the questions for her about Kash Patel.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. THOM TILLIS (R-NC): You should be happy that so many comments have been directed towards Kash Patel, whose confirmation I am supporting. In fact, I'm meeting with him today because that means they're out of stuff for you. So if it comes up again, you will once again know that you've got a great reputation and a great resume and they are just trying to find things to put your integrity into question.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Tiffany -- I mean, Republicans control the Senate. Did you see anything today that might stand in the way of Pam Bondi's confirmation?

TIFFANY SMILEY (R), FORMER WASHINGTON SENATE CANDIDATE: No, look, I think it was very encouraging. It's clear that Pam Bondi is completely qualified and exactly what our country want -- needs at a time like this that we are in. And as far as Kash Patel, you know, he will have his chance to -- to be questioned in the hearings. But let's remember that he is extremely qualified as well.

President Trump has put together a dream team who is ready to get going in fighting. President Trump is erring on the side of the doers and the fighters. So Kash Patel has had over 60 jury trials around that. I believe he has worked in the intel space. Not only that, he actually oversaw the successful prosecution of terrorists in the Obama administration.

So it's clear that he is also extremely qualified. And Pam Bondi did a fantastic -- fantastic job of laying that out ahead of his hearings as well.

TAPPER: A much friendlier and substantive hearing was also taking place in front of a different committee, the Senate Committee on Foreign Relations, where members were questioning one of their colleagues, Republican Senator Marco Rubio of Florida, Trump's pick to be secretary of state.

Jamal, Rubio seems to have broad support, not only among Republicans, but Democrats as well. Do you think hell make a good secretary of state?

SIMMONS: You know, these two nominees, both Bondi and Rubio, are kind of in the broad swath of normalcy, right? Let's just call it that. They're obviously Republicans. They're partisans. They obviously come at the job with their own loyalty to Donald Trump, which we always have to be a little careful about.

But they also -- at least with Rubio, he's been on the Foreign Relations Committee. He understands some of these big national -- national and international issues. I may disagree with him on a lot of policy, but at least you don't expect him to, you know, veer too far off -- off the -- off the rails.

Now, what I am concerned about is he said something like, you know, the American public has to be bold and, you know, and stand up for things like, you know, stand up against Putin. But, you know, Trump is talking about going into the Panama Canal and talking about taking over Greenland. He's not being measured when he talks about those things.

But Rubio seemed to be much more measured when he talked about standing up to Putin in Ukraine. So I think we've got to find out what this administrations real policy is when it comes to defending Europe and NATO from the aggression of Russia.

TAPPER: Thanks to all of you.

Those of you on TikTok know full well that the app could get shut down in just four days if a new owner doesn't come along and buy it from the Chinese company ByteDance. What are the chances of new ownership that fast? What are the chances of the U.S. Supreme Court stepping in and stopping that ban from taking place?

My next guest covers the tech world, when we come back.

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[16:48:36]

TAPPER: In our tech lead, 170 million Americans could see one of their favorite apps shut down on Sunday. ByteDance, the owner of TikTok, reportedly is making this threat less than a week before a new U.S. law takes effect, requiring the app to be sold to a U.S. owner. ByteDance is Chinese, or be banned.

Right now, the U.S. Supreme Court is deciding whether that ban is constitutional.

Let's bring in CNN contributor Kara Swisher.

And, Kara, ByteDance said it would just shut down TikTok in the United States rather than sell. Is this about leverage, or are they really serious about walking away from one of the app's biggest markets?

KARA SWISHER, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Well, I'm sure they're hoping for a deal of some sort, or figuring out something that they don't have to shut down, but that's one of their options. And obviously, this whole thing is about leverage and negotiations and a deal, and which of the many things being floated will be used.

There's a lot of things that could happen here. But the first thing is what the Supreme Court says. And if they declare the ban unconstitutional based on national security grounds, someone has to do something, either Apple or Google or ByteDance.

TAPPER: TikTok users have been flocking to other Chinese based apps, such as Lemon8 or RedNote. How would they be any different in terms of U.S. national security concerns?

SWISHER: Well, they're smaller, I guess, and I guess that's another thing. This is such a specific piece of legislation, which is one of the flaws of it. It should have been a much broader piece of legislation about foreign ownership.

[16:50:01]

But -- but they'll flock to 'em and then they'd have to deal with that. RedNote is is relatively delightful. And so we'll see what people do. It's interesting they're not flocking to American ones or flocking to these really innovative Chinese apps, which they're very good at these -- these particular kind of apps.

TAPPER: "The Washington Post" is reporting just in the last few minutes that President-elect Trump is considering an executive order to save TikTok. How would that -- I mean, would that even work?

SWISHER: No, I mean, it might. I mean, it's just -- you know, "The Post" correctly said in the -- in the thing that an executive order like this is just a -- you know, just a press release on nicer stationery.

No, he can't do that. This is a law. He's got to have the law overturned. He doesn't have to enforce the law when he -- he's not president when it gets banned. So he has another day before that. So he could not enforce it.

And I know Pam Bondi didn't -- wouldn't say whether or not she would. But these companies it's a -- it's a Supreme Court law. It's a law of Congress. They have to decide whether to follow Congress or to follow the president.

And so they'll probably follow what the Supreme Court says over Trump here, because they've got to re-pass a law or figure out some solution, a sale to someone or something like Project Texas.

What's ironic here is Trump is the one that started this off the ban. He was for the ban before he was against it, essentially.

TAPPER: What do you make of this idea of selling -- selling TikTok -- ByteDance selling TikTok to Elon Musk?

SWISHER: Oh, that's one -- one of the things I sort of said, oh, that would be an interesting thing that would happen here, because he could put it with X or Twitter, whatever you want to call it. That's a possibility. There's a lot of interested parties here.

The problem is if you sell it without the algorithm, is it TikTok? And of course the Chinese do not want that to happen. And so, you're buying kind of just a brand. And is it worth that, especially given all the competition? And will someone else just supplant that?

It's a really -- it's a very dicey situation. But the reason TikTok is good is because of the algorithm, and that it gives you whatever you happen to, like, I don't know what you like on TikTok, but it gives you whatever you like. I happen to like ASMR, sand cutting, but you know, everybody's different.

TAPPER: I have a TikTok account, but I don't.

SWISHER: I use it on a burner phone.

TAPPER: Yeah, I have a burner phone. I don't trust the Chinese government.

SWISHER: Me neither.

TAPPER: Speaking of tech, we have seen a major shift in tech CEOs recently, in "The Washington Post". A bunch of the journalists who was still there wrote a letter to Jeff Bezos questioning the direction of the paper.

But on that note, Zuckerberg of Meta, Bezos of Amazon, Sam Altman, Elon Musk, among the tech billionaires, all with choice seats for President-elect Trump's inauguration.

SWISHER: Yeah.

TAPPER: What is this? What's going on here? I mean, lets remove Musk from it because he's been with Trump for a while. But what about the other guys?

SWISHER: Oh, self-interests. Naked self-interest, I don't know. What else do you want? They want things from the government. And Trump is the president.

They did this in 2016, if you recall. I wrote a piece I actually broke that story when they went to Trump Tower and I called them sheeple. And at that time they wanted tax cuts. They wanted repatriation of monies, income from abroad. They wanted less regulation.

It's the same story. And that's what they're doing. They're just flocking to someone who's going to give them what they want. And I don't think it's any more complicated than that. I don't think they like him.

I don't think they are friends with him. Maybe Musk is, I don't know, but I do think they want -- they want their in their self-interest and their self-interest right now is to back Trump. And that's what they'll do.

TAPPER: What do you make of all the hand-wringing with no more fact checking, officiated by Facebook? It will be like community notes on Twitter.

SWISHER: Well, you know, its interesting. Over the many years, Mark, when I've talked to him, has said this is the solution, A.I., community is the solution. Fact checking is the solution. Content moderation is a solution.

It's an incredibly difficult issue. And Mark has seen an opportunity to get rid of it because it's always been a pain -- a costly pain for him. And it's not -- it's not as -- he goes on and on about the First Amendment, but all he cares is he doesn't want to deal with any kind of hate on his platform because it's not -- he doesn't think it's his responsibility.

I think it's his responsibility in creating the platform the way it is. It's a cauldron of hate in many cases, and he just doesn't want responsibility for it. And because he can't be sued or he can't be fired, he doesn't want to deal with it. And so he's in this phase.

But, you know, if Kamala Harris was president, he want us to call him they/them, and would do whatever it takes to satisfy her.

So he's a -- he's -- he's a -- he's a I call him a sad weathervane, but he'll do whatever it takes for his shareholders and himself. So, absolutely.

TAPPER: A sad weathervane.

All right. Kara Swisher, thanks.

SWISHER: Sad weathervane.

TAPPER: Thanks so much. Good to see you.

Coming up, the breaking news, a ceasefire hostage deal likely going into effect on Sunday. The reaction from Hostage Square in Tel Aviv right now.

Plus, a journalist who was in Gaza just last month and has seen the dire need for humanitarian aid. She's going to join us with her take on where negotiations landed.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:59:25]

TAPPER: And welcome back to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper.

And we start this hour with major news in our world lead Israel and Hamas have reached phase one of a ceasefire and hostage deal. The news was met with joyous celebrations in Gaza, and it gatherings in Hostage Square in Tel Aviv after seemingly irreconcilable demands were finally seemingly reconciled after nearly a year of intense talks in Qatar.

President Biden confirmed the deal this afternoon, noting that it was made possible by negotiators from Qatar, Egypt and the United States with an assist from the incoming Trump administration. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: This deal was developed and negotiated under my administration, but its terms will be implemented for the most part by the next administration.