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Trump Outlines Economic And International Agenda In Chicago; Georgia Judge: Counties Must Certify Election Results On Time; 2 Giant Pandas Arrive In DC After Nearly 10K-Mile Journey. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired October 15, 2024 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:30:00]

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: Where do you see the line and where do you have concerns about that line?

MARK ESPER, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST & CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, it's all speculation, of course, but the question would be is, to what degree is he trying to advise Vladimir Putin in terms of how to deal with the Biden administration, the United States?

Or is he promising certain things that, if he comes back into office one day, those would -- those would be major issues, major concerns of mine. But again, we just don't know.

And it's worth -- then again, it's not unusual for world leaders to maintain friendships, relationships beyond their terms in office.

What's unusual, again, is this is Vladimir Putin. He's an adversary. He's doing things to harm the United States and our allies. And what he's doing against Ukraine it's just terrible.

So this is why my concern is particularly peaked here.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Secretary, one more question for you, if you have a moment. I know you're running short on time. But it was a question that was asked that I thought illuminated Trump's worldview more broadly.

The moderator -- moderator was asking him about how the U.S. won the Cold War against the USSR. And it had to do with uniting allies.

He was asking about his approach in alienating folks that are supposed to be your friends on the world stage through the threat of tariffs, through some of his -- his rhetoric and whether he thought that that would ultimately cost the United States in what he views as a current Cold War with China.

I wonder what you make of that approach and that statement from Trump?

ESPER: Sure, it's a great question and it's a terrific issue. Look, I'm a Reagan Republican. And what Ronald Reagan did was rally the West.

And he led. And what Reagan did during the '80s, along with Margaret Thatcher and others, was to basically defeat the Soviet Union through soft power and pushing back here and there. But we did it with allies and partners.

And in today's context, the 21st century, where I see China as our greatest strategic advisor -- adversary, followed by Russia, Iran, North Korea, we have a great lineup of allies, the Europeans, the Japanese, Australians, Filipinos.

You go around the world, we have dozens, dozens of treaty allies and even more partners.

The other side, the China team, the Russia team, what they have are the four of them plus Nicaragua and Mali. It's not a very -- it's not a very good team.

So it's important that we kind of keep the big picture in focus. That means democracy has to win here in the 21st century. And we're only going to do that if we, the democracies of the world, our allies and partners, work together.

And what that means is making sure that we don't do things unnecessarily to fracture that alliance, to fracture those partnerships. And that would be my concern.

We talk about 100 percent tariffs across the board, or breaking up trade agreements, things like that. Look, it's -- it's fair to look at those things. It's fair to assess trade agreements to make sure their current with the times, that they're meeting our interests. That's fine.

But to threaten those things and possibly fracture these important alliances and partnerships in this standoff we're now against autocracies of the world, I think is what concerns me.

KEILAR: Yes, he said allies are taking more advantage of the U.S. then their enemies.

Secretary Esper, great to have you. Thank you so much.

ESPER: Thank you both.

KEILAR: I want to go to Kristen Holmes now, who has been tracking this event.

Kristen, a really interesting event so far. Certainly one where former President Trump is getting very much challenged on his economic plans.

And we heard John Micklethwait there saying that, you know, being I think critical of some of Trump's economic plans. Trump trying to turn the tables on him saying, what do you know, "Bloomberg" is wrong, the "Wall Street Journal" is wrong.

Micklethwait trying to say, look, a lot of economic experts, which is true, have concerns about your plans. And they do. They're very concerned about the inflationary effects of what Trump has in store. KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Brianna. And this is really the first time we've heard somebody be able to challenge Trump on these tariffs.

Generally speaking, when he is in an interview with a more friendly environment or more friendly moderator, they let him speak and then that's it.

Generally, if we shout out, as the press corps, in a press conference, a question about this, he can choose if he wants to answer it or not. And he's not answering questions about a follow-up on tariffs.

This was the first time we've actually seen him have to answer questions about those economists, about the fact that the "Wall Street Journal," that "Bloomberg" have all said that this could lead to massive inflation, this kind of terrorists.

One of the most interesting points that was made by the "Bloomberg" editor-in-chief was something that Donald Trump often does. He pointed out the fact that Donald Trump was talking about singular event saying, OK, I'm asking you about your tariff plan as a whole, but you're bringing up one offs, like John Deere moving.

OK, so you stop them from moving with the threat of tariffs. But we're talking about what tariffs would do to the overall country, to the overall ecosystem of the economy if you were to actually implement them in the way that you want to.

And Donald Trump is doing what Donald Trump does, and he himself called it the weave (ph), which is really going off into separate stories about when he was in office or conversations that he had, getting away from the topic at hand.

[13:35:05]

But, for his part, that editor-in-chief is pushing Donald Trump on the issue of tariffs.

Now when it comes to Putin, it was interesting also this is the first time Donald Trump has been able to -- or has been able to be asked about whether or not he has spoken to Putin since he's been out of office. Obviously, he dodged that question multiple times.

But it did sort of leave the door open. It sounded as though he had, in fact, talked to Putin.

Now I will say when the editor-in-chief made the same point that I just did, he said that's not what I said. I just didn't answer your question on that.

But one thing to keep in mind here is that this -- it's not as though this would exist in a vacuum of, did he talk to Putin or not?

This is a presidential candidate who has spent much of his time on the campaign trail praising Vladimir Putin, saying that they had a really strong relationship, saying how smart Vladimir Putin was. Even in the context of Ukraine, and what is going on with the Ukraine war, talking about how he has good relationship with Vladimir Putin. And now after his meeting with Zelenskyy, has a good relationship with Zelenskyy.

So he could be the one who got something done on this front, again, without any real details as to what exactly a negotiation would look like, another thing that he hasn't answered questions on.

But I will say, just in this very conversation, this is a setting where you have one topic going on about the economy, where Donald Trump can actually be pressed, where it's harder for him to bob and weave and move to other topics.

So we saw him really -- we saw the head of "Bloomberg" there really trying to get some answers from Trump on the economy, particularly as we have heard this enormous amount of pushback really across the spectrum on what tariffs would do overall for the economy.

SANCHEZ: He seemed to taunt the moderator at one point, saying that he could keep going, he could keep weaving if he wanted to during a long, long answer.

Kristen Holmes, thank you so much.

Let's get some political analysis now with CNN political analyst, Gloria Borger, and CNN political analyst, Coleman Hughes.

Thank you both for being with us.

Gloria, first, I want to commend you. This is yet another event --

(CROSSTALK)

(LAUGHTER)

SANCHEZ: -- where -- where Trump has gone on and on and on and you've patiently sat with us through it.

(CROSSTALK)

SANCHEZ: I'm curious -- I'm curious to get your thoughts on the weave. His described method of answering all sorts of questions that weren't actually asked.

GLORIA BORGER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, the weave is kind of a stream of consciousness. And it seems as if he can't stick to one topic at a time.

And if you notice in this interview, he talks in anecdotes. You know, the interviewer was trying to get macro answers about the economy, what tariffs would do to the economy, et cetera, et cetera.

And instead, Donald Trump is talking about, well, John Deere or I told -- I told this person who is building plants in Mexico this and that. So he doesn't really answer in a macro way. He answers in terms of his own experiences and his own stories. And

then he weaves from one to the next. So it's kind of difficult to keep track.

He calls it a weave. I'm not really sure what we should call it. You know?

KEILAR: What did you think, Coleman?

COLEMAN HUGHES, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, I thought that -- I've always thought that the issues that Trump was most sincerely passionate about, the issues that he's been talking about the same ways for decades, are immigration and trade.

He has a view of trade that is very different from the mainstream view of economists. He believes trade deficits are really important, whereas economists would say they actually don't matter much.

He believes that other countries pay the price for tariffs, whereas almost all economists would agree that American consumers pay the price for tariffs.

But to give him credit, he's had a coherent philosophy around it. He's probably -- in our time, he's probably the most effective communicator of that philosophy, even though it's one experts don't share.

And so in some way, when you get Donald Trump talking about tariffs and trade deficits and negotiations, especially, you're seeing him at his best, even though he does have this weaving style of communication.

I'd argue it's not that different from how a lot of politicians speak. A lot of politicians will respond with an anecdote rather than directly address the question.

Soin some way, you're seeing the crux of the difference between Donald Trump and how the consensus of economists view this issue.

SANCHEZ: In some sense, the one policy that Trump has been consistent on, the one singular policy that he has been consistent on since the 1980s, at least, is the idea that other countries are taking advantage of the United States when it comes to trade.

And yet, his view of certain trade deals, even his view of certain world leaders and nations has been troubled at times because of his rhetoric. He talks about having a good relationship with Kim Jong-un, someone he called Little Rocket Man. Just one example. And that's an adversary, not an ally.

[13:40:02]

So, Coleman, I do wonder how you took the point that he made when he was talking about Senator Lindsey Graham, who he mislabeled as a progressive, at one point, saying that you can't have Trump policies without Trump himself. Because I know a lot of conservatives have lamented, at least through this election cycle, that they wish that it was someone running on his policies, just not him delivering the message and the distraction.

HUGHES: Yes, it's a very good question. And it's something we're thinking about.

Trump -- when Trump does things, like threaten to pull out of NATO, it makes the hair on my arm raise because I think NATO is an incredibly important alliance, not something that should be spoken so lightly of.

On the other hand, Trump, since for decades, he has prized himself as this great negotiator. And he has said that one of his negotiation strategies is to threaten something crazy in order to get some result, right?

And again, this is his instinct. It's an instinct that can be dangerous because you have to be willing to do the crazy thing, or at least, you know, South Korea has to actually be worried that he's going to pull troops out, which I think would be a terrible idea.

But they have to really be worried in order to actually respond. And from Trump's perspective, he has to make the crazy threat in order to get our NATO allies to pave the 2 percent of their GDP and so forth.

But again, there are these examples where he calls the leader of North Korea Little Rocket Man, which is such a flagrant and flippant and dangerous move and could have terrible consequences.

So there are two sides to it in that he feels he can get concessions out of these countries by threatening crazy things. But on the other hand, you have to actually threaten those crazy things, and as a world leader of the most important country on earth, you don't really want your leader to threaten crazy things.

BORGER: Well, you know, he sees our allies as potential adversaries in every -- in every way. And he basically said that, you know, today.

And this has been his M.O. for his entire life. I remember reporting about Donald Trump with some real estate executives and they said, you know, he'd walk into a meeting. They we're about to cut some deal and he would just blow it up. And then walk out.

Because he wanted a better deal or he wanted something else. And this is -- you know, this is -- this is what he does. He blows things up and then comes back to the table.

And I think that's kind of what you're hearing from him. So it's been a constant in his life for decades.

And you know, Donald Trump hasn't changed since the '70s, right? And he's the same person he always was. And that is the way he would negotiate with allies and try and negotiate with adversaries.

KEILAR: Yes, it might work sometimes.

BORGER: It might.

KEILAR: Sometimes it doesn't.

BORGER: I will say today that the conversation that we have so far here today is better than a dance party.

(LAUGHTER)

BORGER: Because at least you're hearing Donald Trump answer direct questions, as Kristen was saying, which many times, you know, in many arenas you don't get to hear the answer to.

And so it was good to have him sit down and be challenged on tariffs and whether he talked to Putin, et cetera. I think it was very useful.

SANCHEZ: In some arenas, all you hear is YMCA.

BORGER: Right, exactly.

KEILAR: Or Ava Maria.

(LAUGHTER)

SANCHEZ: Which some might --

(CROSSTALK)

BORGER: -- playlist.

SANCHEZ: Gloria Borger, Coleman Hughes, thank you both so much for the conversation. We appreciate it.

We're going to continue to monitor former President Trump's remarks. Stay with CNN. We're taking a quick break. We'll be right back.

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[13:48:05]

SANCHEZ: Early in-person voting officially kicks off today in the battleground state of Georgia, and voters are lining up at polling places. Some there even before the polls open.

KEILAR: Also this morning, a state judge ruling that county election boards cannot delay or decline the certification of election results, dealing a major blow to a conservative effort to broaden their powers in the state.

CNN's Nick Valencia is at an Atlanta polling place.

So, Nick, let's start with this ruling. What can you tell us about it?

NICK VALENCIA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, this ruling is happening as early voting is underway, so we're still getting court decision as people are already casting their ballots.

Judge McBurney sending a very clear message to Republicans who were trying to challenge the certification process.

This lawsuit stemming from a lawsuit filed by Julie Adams, who is a conservative on the Democratic stronghold county of Fulton County, their Board of Elections.

And she made news earlier this spring by refusing to certify the results of the presidential primary. But Judge McBurney saying, in his ruling, highlighting current existing Georgia law, saying, "Certification is mandatory."

All of this happening as these long lines we're seeing behind me. And it has been a record turnout. It has been smashing the numbers that we sat in 2020.

Already, as of 1:00 p.m., the secretary of state's office tells us that there have been more than 154,000 people who have early voted. In 2020, that record was set at 136,000.

And early voting and voting in general is going to look slightly different for Georgians this time around. For starters, absentee ballot drop boxes will be fewer and further between.

That was a point of contention in 2020. They were available 24/7. They're now going to be available during normal business hours and be located inside election offices and where you can early vote.

The early voting, though, has also been extended. So two Saturdays have been added and potentially two Sundays if county election officials see fit. Those are just some of the changes.

And of course one that was immortalized by Larry David in that show on HBO Max, "Curb Your Enthusiasm," where he was arrested for handing out water and food. One-hundred and 50 feet -- you cannot hand out food or water in Georgia 150 feet from where a ballot is being cast.

[13:50:05]

Early voting, though, still underway, going -- happening right now. So five more hours to go. We've already smashed the record. Consequential, was Fulton County in 2020. We'll see if it has the same fate here in 2024 -- guys?

KEILAR: Yes. Look at all those folks doing their thing.

SANCHEZ: Yes, solid plug for the corporate overlords of Warner Brothers Discovery.

(LAUGHTER)

SANCHEZ: You can stream that show now on Max.

Nick Valencia, thank you so much.

(LAUGHTER)

KEILAR: Still ahead, what's black and white and back in the U.S.? Oh, my gosh, the cute little answer is in that crate. We have details next.

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SANCHEZ: It's panda-monium. And the pun that was deleted from the script that I pushed --

(CROSSTALK)

SANCHEZ: After a nearly 10,000-mile journey, two giant pandas have arrived in the nation's capital. A FedEx cargo plane, dubbed the "Panda Express," arrived from China earlier today, welcoming -- for the first time in 24 years, the U.S. capitol has welcomed a new set of furry diplomats.

KEILAR: Bao Li and Qing Bao, both 3-years-old, are on loan to the National Zoo for 10 years with an annual fee of $1 million to support conservation efforts back in China.

Let's bring in the host of ABC's "Wildlife Nation," Jeff Corwin, to talk about this.

Jeff, this is so fantastic. I mean, we're here in D.C., we're very -- I'm more excited than Boris, just to be honest. I mean, you can just kind --

(CROSSTALK)

KEILAR: It is like --

(LAUGHTER)

KEILAR: It's radiating off of me, as it is for so many people here in our nation's capital.

Why is this so important?

JEFF CORWIN, ABC HOST, "WILDLIFE NATION": Boris, with his pen writing little quip, some pandas.

(LAUGHTER)

SANCHEZ: Yes. Brainstorming.

(LAUGHTER)

CORWIN: Brainstorming. Well, it's -- yes, this is kind of finally this epic day, the great partnership, the great friendships between these great nations connects over pandas as they make this epic journey from China to downtown D.C.

SANCHEZ: So, Jeff, I know a keeper from the National Zoo spent the last 10 days with the pandas. What is it like to get to know a panda and to have it become familiar with you enough that you can welcome it as a friend in a new home?

CORWIN. Well, you know, these animals go through a tremendous amount of enrichment and social cultivation to ensure that they are prepared to adapt to their new home at the various zoos where they will be living around the world.

[13:55:11]

There are 600 pandas living in our global zoos. Only about 1,800 pandas survived today in the wild. So it's an important mission to really tell the story where they serve as an ambassador regarding endangered species.

And China, Boris, faces a huge problem. Nearly 4,000 endangered species in China, but a tremendous amount of work has gone in to ensure that this habitat will be welcoming. There will be no surprises.

Essentially, it's like muscle memory for everybody on board to ensure that these pandas will thrive and have a quality existence at our National Zoo. One of the best zoos on the planet.

KEILAR: Love that. Our neighborhood zoo. Why are people, Jeff, so obsessed with pandas? Because it really is this huge thing when they -- when they come and go because they have a certain stay, right?

And when they left the National Zoo last time, I mean, people were crying over it. There's been this period of time where we haven't had the pandas. Now they're back. It's so exciting.

Why are people so crazy for them?

CORWIN: I think we have this anthropomorphic connection to pandas because they are adorable and they have this cuddly look.

Although, personally, I would not want to cuddle with a panda because, likely if I did, I would spend a couple of hours in urgent care afterwards because they are wild creatures.

So we sometimes lose the fact that they're wild and they're endangered. Again, the hope is they serve as this umbrella species because they live in this remote imperiled forest.

If you protect the ecosystem and the panda, you protect all those other species that live there.

But this is kind of, Brianna, a double-edged sword. Because if it -- we all fall prey to charismatic species syndrome. We think they are more important than other species.

The truth is pandas are no more special and no more important than all the other endangered species that face extinction on our planet. We should love all our creatures and endangered wildlife, like we do with our pandas.

But thankfully, they're the ambassador species that tell this very important story.

SANCHEZ: On a logical and emotional level, I totally take that point, Jeff, that all species are precious. And yet, we're playing video of these pandas and they're just so cute.

Like I want to do what they're doing --

(CROSSTALK)

SANCHEZ: -- laying around.

CORWIN: It sounds like you were actually wearing a panda suit.

(LAUGHTER)

(CROSSTALK)

SANCHEZ: I should -- I should be in the colors, but I should have been --

(LAUGHTER)

(CROSSTALK)

KEILAR: -- Halloween.

(LAUGHTER)

SANCHEZ: Jeff Corwin, take care.

(CROSSTALK)

CORWIN: -- Boris. They're adorable and, of course, social media drives that. We see them. They have personalities. We know these two individual pandas have their own personalities.

They're very intelligent creatures, very interactive. They have incredible maternal skills. But they face incredible pressures. They have a high level of infertility, which is why we need to have these zoo-type breeding programs, to ensure that they survive.

But, yes, they're awesome. They're adorable. And they -- they -- we're hardwired to have all our heart muscles tugged by these pandas.

SANCHEZ: And tugged, indeed, they are.

Jeff Corwin, thank you so much for the time, sir.

CORWIN: Thanks, guys.

Stay with CNN NEWS CENTRAL. We're back in just a few minutes.

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