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Trump's Team In Good Spirits After Hegseth Hearing; Officials: Israel & Hamas Nearing Ceasefire-Hostage Deal; Special Counsel Report: Enough Evidence To Convict Trump In Election Case. Aired 2:30-3p ET

Aired January 14, 2025 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[14:34:24]

DANA BASH, CNN HOST: Pete Hegseth. Donald Trump's pick to run the Department of Defense, took a lot of tough questions on Capitol Hill earlier today.

Despite that, CNN has learned that President-elect Donald Trump's team is in good spirits. They see the warm reception that he received from Republican Senators as a very good sign.

I want to discuss this with CNN senior political commentator, Scott Jennings, and CNN political commentator, Karen Finney.

Hello to both of you.

Scott, what's your takeaway?

SCOTT JENNINGS, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, in short, I think Pete Hegseth kicked their asses today. I mean, it wasn't even close. They didn't lay a glove on Hegseth. No mistakes. Calm, cool, collected.

I mean, before the thing even started, you had this, like, Code Pink, you know, protester freak show trying to disrupt the hearing. That's the Democratic base, by the way.

[14:35:01]

Which probably explains why the Democrats on the committee acted in such a bizarre and unprofessional way. I was appalled at some of the way these Senators handled themselves and some of the lines of questioning.

I mean, Tim Kaine sounded like a sex pervert in his questioning of Pete Hegseth. Blumenthal, who lied about his service in Vietnam, questioning Hegseth's qualifications.

You had Gillibrand, you had Warren, you had Hirono going on unhinged rants about things. Angus King obviously doesn't understand what it's like to fight terrorism. On and on and on.

Hegseth was cool in the face of this unhinged questioning. They made him look good today. It would be difficult for a Republican to vote against Hegseth after the Democrats unseemly mudslinging today.

BASH: Karen?

KAREN FINNEY, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, look, it was as performative as these hearings ever get. I mean, Republicans do it to Democrats. Democrats do it to Republicans. I mean, so that happens on all sides.

Look, overall, though, clearly, Hegseth was well prepared and it was clear Democrats recognized that given that there was some, clearly, concern that he wouldn't be able to handle more than one round of questioning, they were clearly trying to get certain things on the record.

Personally, I would have -- the comms person in me would have framed it differently. I would have talked about a number of these issues, both based on his writings, which, at one point, were trying to do that. That was part of the strategy.

But really, in the context of the modern military, because the reality is, as military leaders will tell you, climate change is a national security concern. It's real. It is -- it is a threat to our forces. It is a threat to our bases. It is a threat to our readiness.

You know, so I would have framed some of these questions more in the context of the current challenges the modern military faces. It is a diverse force, which is part of why diversity matters.

I thought they also could have done more to, you know, again, use some of the concerns about the way Trump has spoken. I thought Slotkin was very effective with this in terms of the use of force on American soil and, you know, and the Geneva Conventions.

I think those questions got a little muddled. And I think those topics actually are very relevant and did not get quite the airing I wish they would have.

BASH: That's interesting. It doesn't sound like you're all that thrilled with -- with the way that your party's Senators sort of performed as a whole with this, despite the very notable exceptions --

FINNEY: Yes. I just --

(CROSSTALK)

BASH: You didn't love it.

OK, well, there's one Senator who you know pretty well, considering the fact that he was the vice presidential nominee when he worked on the Hillary Clinton-Tim Kaine presidential campaign.

Because Scott mentioned this, I do want to run part of what Tim Kaine said in his line of questioning. And then on the backside, I want to listen to Markwayne Mullin, a Republican Senator, who's very close with Pete Hegseth, said as a counter. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. TIM KAINE (D-VA): Many of your work colleagues have said that you show up for work under the influence of alcohol or drunk. I know you've denied that.

But you would agree with me, right, that if that was the case, that would be disqualifying for somebody to be secretary of defense?

PETE HEGSETH, SECRETARY OF DEFENSE NOMINEE: Senator, those are all anonymous false claims. And the totality

(CROSSTALK)

KAINE: They're not -- they're not anonymous.

We have seen records with names attached to all of these, including the name of your own mother. So don't make this into some anonymous press thing.

SEN. MARKWAYNE MULLINS (R-OK): The Senator from Virginia starts bringing up the fact that, what if you showed up drunk to your job? How many Senators have showed up drunk to vote at night?

(LAUGHTER)

MULLINS: Have any of you guys asked them to step down and resign from their job? And don't tell me you haven't seen it because I know you have.

And then how many Senators do you know have gotten a divorce before cheating on their wives? Did you ask them to step down? No.

But it's for show. You guys make sure you make a big show and point out the hypocrisy, because the man's made a mistake.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: Karen?

FINNEY: So here's what I thought was interesting about that. And Mark Kelly tried to get to that.

First of all, Tim Kaine did -- you know, he came, you know, loaded with the questions he wanted to ask? He has a son who served in the military. So obviously he takes a lot of this very seriously in terms of the expectations that -- the expectations we have of our servicemembers should be the same expectations and standards we hold the secretary to.

I don't think he was wrong on that. But I thought Mark Kelly did a little bit of a better job kind of teasing some of that out and trying to get more underneath some of the substance of that question in terms of -- you know, he said, well, you've said you have made mistakes, but you're not willing to tell us what the mistakes are.

I thought that was another way to kind of go at that question.

[14:39:59]

BASH: And, Scott, before I let you guys go, did you have any concern about the sort of lack of answers on some of the really important policy issues that he will have to face as defense secretary, or even information about treaties, like ASEAN?

JENNINGS: No, I don't have any concerns about anything he did today. I thought he specifically answered the questions he needed to.

And some of this stuff is going to be set by the president of the United States and the president's National Security Council advisers and staff. I mean, he's not a one-man show.

The secretary of defense is important, but there's a whole national security team. I don't think Hegseth or anyone else for one of these kinds of positions should go to the table and act like they're going to unilaterally set policy. So I think he handled himself well today.

I think Democrats had maybe built up in their mind that he was going to be a low performer. He -they've lowered the bar, but he far jumped over any expectations they had set.

And I just want to say one thing about Karens comment. She made some great points. She raised some issues that Democrats obviously care about. These are important issues.

I agree with her that maybe they did deserve a little more questioning today, which is why it's all the more puzzling why a Tim Kaine, who has worked for the Clintons or campaigned with them, or who campaigned with Doug Emhoff, decided to spend eight minutes, eight minutes --

FINNEY: The vice presidential nominee.

JENNINGS: Yes. So --

(CROSSTALK)

JENNINGS: So -- so he's - he's supported some of these folks. And then he decided to spend eight minutes on the granular details of this man's sex life. I mean, it was embarrassing for the Democratic Party today, particularly coming from Kaine.

So I think Karen has it right. They did not do a good job. They totally whiffed on this. And they made it more, not less likely that Hegseth is going to be confirmed.

BASH: Well, it seemed as though that was -- the writing was on the wall even going into this hearing.

But I appreciate both of you coming on and giving me your -- and our viewers, your expertise.

Scott and Karen, good to see you.

FINNEY: Thank you.

BASH: And ahead, Hamas and Israel are inching closer to a deal. That is what officials on all sides are telling us. But can they agree on that final pact that could see the hostages finally come home and a ceasefire put in place in Gaza? That's next.

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[14:46:28]

BASH: The following breaking news out of the Middle East as Israel and Hamas appear to be on the brink of a ceasefire and hostage deal.

Now, we have heard "on the brink" before. But it does seem, according to officials on all sides, that it is different this time.

What they are talking about -- you see there on the screen -- is 33 hostages in exchange for hundreds of Palestinian prisoners. The agreement would also mean a 42-day ceasefire in a war that has been raging for 15 months.

At this hour, though, details are still being finalized by negotiators who are meeting in Doha.

CNN's Jeremy Diamond is in Tel Aviv for us.

Jeremy, what are you hearing from your sources on where these talks stand?

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: Well, listen, Dana, there's no question that Israel and Hamas are on the cusp of an agreement here, and at this moment of incredible hope and promise, but also uncertainty.

What we saw here tonight at Hostages Square in Tel Aviv was thousands of people gathering to stand shoulder to shoulder in that moment. And no less among them the families of the hostages who may indeed be released as part of this agreement.

I spoke tonight with the uncle of Yarden Bibas, that father of those two beautiful redheaded babies who you may remember being taken captive on October 7th.

Here's part of our conversation.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DIAMOND: Everyone says that we are now on the cusp of this ceasefire and hostage-release deal between Israel and Hamas. How are you feeling at this very moment?

YAIR KESHET, NEPHEW OF YARDEN BIBAS BEING HELD AS HOSTAGE IN GAZA: Wow. Actually, frightening to hell. You know. Very frightening. You know, it's -- it's a kind of, you know, a, like I said, the carousel, you know, up and down right now.

DIAMOND: A roller coaster?

KESHET: Terrifying roller coaster. Yes. Terrified to hell.

What, because we don't know -- first of all, we don't know if it's going to happen. It looks like it's going to happen, but we don't know if it's going to happen.

We don't know what we are going to get. Who is going to come back, how they are going to come back, their physical condition, their mental condition. We -- we don't know if they are going to get them back.

They say that some of the people, you know, some of the kidnaped, they don't know where -- they are right now. We know nothing right now.

The only thing that we -- that I will know when something will be here in Israel, and we will see it by our by our eyes, then I believe.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DIAMOND: And, Dana, Hamas has said that those two babies, Kfir and Ariel, as well as their mother, Shiri, that they are dead. But the Israeli government has yet to confirm that.

And tonight, Yair, their uncle, told me that he is still holding out hope, as is the rest of the family, that just perhaps they may come out alive as part of this agreement-- Dana?

BASH: Yes, it's just so brutal, so heartbreaking on so many levels.

Thank you so much, Jeremy. Appreciate your reporting.

[14:49:37]

And up next, we're going to come back to the United States and look at Jack Smiths conclusion revealed in his final report. The special counsel says the evidence is there to convict the president-elect for his efforts to overturn the 2020 election.

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BASH: Former Special Counsel Jack Smith says there is enough evidence to convict Donald Trump were he not the president-elect. That's a pretty powerful conclusion from Smith's final report on Trump's efforts to overturn the 2020 election.

It was released overnight. And in it, Smith made clear that, while Trump's reelection prevents him from being tried, he doesn't believe it exonerates the president-elect.

CNN's Paula Reid has been following this case from the start.

Paula, it was just a little more than 24 hours ago where you came on with me when Judge Aileen Cannon kind of cleared the way for this report to be released.

[14:55:00] At the time, you said that if it is released, that perhaps there won't be much in it then that we haven't already reported. Is that true?

PAULA REID, CNN CHIEF LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Yes, that is the case. There were some interesting insights, though, from the special counsel.

Like, we know the damning allegations. We've seen a lot of the evidence, but we haven't heard much from Jack Smith about his overall experience during this investigation.

And he said -- you alluded to this in the intro -- the evidence was there to convict. Now, you don't always know how things are going to go when you take a case before a jury. But he never had the chance to take this to trial.

And he talked about how one of the big roadblocks that he faced was the Supreme Court. He asked them over a year ago to just weigh in on this question of whether Trump has any immunity, and they did not. They waited for it to go through the trial court, the appellate level. They waited seven months.

It was the last decision that they released in the Supreme Court term. And because they took so long, it was impossible for Smith to bring his case before the election. And, of course, he says, for him, the ball game was Trump's reelection.

And we heard Judge Juan Merchan up in Manhattan touch on this last week. He said, look, the American people have seen the allegations. They've seen the case. In that case, they saw a conviction and they decided to send him back to the White House.

I mean, that's a blow for a prosecutor who has worked on cases like this.

The one thing I was a little bit surprised at, Dana, is that Smith took some shots at the Trump legal team and of course, Trump. That doesn't surprise me.

But that same legal team, many members of that team, including Todd Blanche, are about to occupy very powerful positions inside the Justice Department and will be in a position to investigate Smith and his team for any possible evidence of political motivation or any other misdeeds.

So I don't know if I would have taken those parting shots, but it's water under the bridge now.

BASH: Presumably, they were going to do that investigation no matter what Jack Smith said or didn't say about them.

So fascinating that the strategy to delay at every stop, which was aided by a Supreme Court that didn't answer to a lot of the questions along the way, and the judge in Florida, the federal judge, Aileen Cannon, who helped with that delay, it worked.

REID: It takes a village to delay two federal trials. It worked. It worked.

BASH: All right, Paula, thank you so much.

Ahead, we are following new evacuations in Los Angeles as winds are growing stronger. It is complicating the very difficult efforts to stop these deadly wildfires there. We'll be right back.

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