Return to Transcripts main page

CNN News Central

L.A. Residents Face Long Recovery As Firefighters Make Gains; Trump To Kick Off Aggressive Immigration Push Soon After Swearing-In; SpaceX Starship Explodes, Showering Debris Over Atlantic. Aired 7:30- 8a ET

Aired January 17, 2025 - 07:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:31:02]

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: This morning crews battling the massive Southern California wildfires are making more progress. Finally, the strong winds have subsided, cooler air expected. But as you know, the road to recovery will be very long. Some residents who had evacuated have been allowed finally to return to what is left of their homes, but other residents in evacuation zones may have to wait for weeks or even longer to see what is there.

New video now from along the Pacific Coast Highway showing rows of homes burned to the ground.

CNN's Stephanie Elam is on the ground for us in Pacific Palisades. Stephanie, the weather has finally offered a bit of relief. What are you seeing, and what's the latest on the fires there?

STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, it's a bit of relief but we also know that next week we could have another Santa Ana wind event and obviously that is of concern here.

But overall, the area is still very much on lockdown here in Pacific Palisades because so much of it looks like this -- just mass devastation, so much so that you can go block after block after block and all of that is going to take a long time to clean up. And also, because of that it's going to take a long time for residents in this particular part of the affected area to get back home.

Take a listen to the mayor of Malibu discussing that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAYOR DOUG STEWART, MALIBU, CALIFORNIA: The hillsides in Malibu are extremely burnt. For the firefighters, they know that there's a glaze that goes on heavily burned soil, and if we have a rainstorm this is going to be almost catastrophic if we're not prepared for it. A lot of the work that's being done right now in the recovery portion is to get ready for rain; not just remove the debris.

(END VIDEO CLIP) ELAM: And we've seen this happen before. Typically, before things were affected by human-induced climate change, January was the second- wettest month of the rainy season, and then February is the wettest.

So while there's no plan for any rain on the schedule right now -- we don't see anything coming -- if it does come in February, it's very concerning because you can see those hillsides behind a lot of the Pacific Palisades and Malibu area. If they get all that rain those root systems of all the plants and trees that used to be there that burned away, it will just slough off. And if that happens you could have a massive mudslide like we saw with the Thomas Fire up on Montecito. And that happened in January of 2018 and there were deaths because of that.

So if you look at that situation, that's why they're very concerned about it. But if you look to see where we're standing now this is indicative of pretty much all of Pacific Palisades. It's just unbelievable still this many days later, Sara.

SIDNER: I know. Absolutely, Stephanie Elam. And I know that you and I both were there in 2018 seeing the effect of those mudslides that happened because of the rain. So not only the winds but the rain can have such a devastating impact after something like this.

Thank you so much to you and your crew out there early this morning for us -- John.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, with us now, Steven Dettelbach, director of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives for the remainder of today. It is your last day on the job.

The ATF is part of a joint task force leading this investigation, really, into the fires in California. Can you give us any updates on what you've found so far in terms of the cause?

STEVE DETTELBACH, DIRECTOR, BUREAU OF ALCOHOL, TOBACCO, FIREAMS, AND EXPLOSIVES: Well, so, as you said, what we've done is we've called in what's called the National Response Team, which is a group that responded to the Maui wildfires. It responded on New Year's Day in New Orleans because of the fire associated with that attack. And deploys at the request of our partners.

And what we come in and do is we bring chemists, we bring investigators, we bring certified fire investigators, certified explosive investigators, forensic people, and we literally look at -- under every stone, both literally and figuratively.

I will tell you it's an ongoing investigation. It will take a while.

[07:35:00]

And John, the other thing that makes these things very, very tricky is there's still an ongoing casualty event -- the fire event. So obviously the devastation that we've heard about, our heart goes out, but we have to also prioritize making sure that people are safe before the investigation can do all the things we want to do. BERMAN: What are the different possibilities in terms of what starts a fire like this? And how can you tell when you look under that stone?

DETTELBACH: So there's four different conclusions that you usually see depending on the facts.

So, one of them is what's called an incendiary fire. That's an arson. ATF has been in charge of investigating those things for 50 years all over the country on the federal side -- of course, with our partners. Another one would be an accidental fire. A third would be what we call natural causes. And then the fourth, which sometimes happens, is it can be indeterminant, which is you don't know.

You look at all sorts of things. These are -- these are highly trained experts on this issue, so they'll look at burn patterns. They'll look at whether there's one place where the fire started or several places where the fire started. They'll look at chemistry.

And they'll just go out and do independent lead investigation. They'll look at camera footage. They'll talk to the people all around the area. They'll do all the things that really qualified and expert federal investigators do to try and put together the forensic, the good old-fashioned gumshoe detective work, and their expertise.

And the most important thing -- because I'll tell you, John, this is going to take a while. I know that from past experience from Maui -- is to get it right.

BERMAN: It is going to take a while, as you keep saying.

What are the particular challenges about this investigation?

DETTELBACH: Well, obviously, all of these are different but obviously this is a vast area that's involved. We're basically taking the lead on the Pacific Palisades, so we're talking about right now 26,000 acres and counting of destroyed area. Almost 3,000 or more homes. As you pointed out in the reporting, hundreds of thousands of people displaced. Those are all challenges.

The scope of the endeavor, the stakes, and the tragedy and devastation that's been caused are all -- and the fact that the fire is still going, those are all going to be challenges.

But we have seen this before and there is nobody better in the world than the ATF at this, and I say this on my last day as director. This national response team, which is supporting our great people already in California is typical of ATF. I don't think people know that among the many things we do -- running to gunfire and dealing with very, very dangerous situations is also -- this includes fire-related investigations.

And for people out there who want to know a government agency -- a law enforcement agency that's saving lives and deserves to be properly supported and funded -- and I say that to the people who make those decisions and will make them after I'm gone tonight -- you need to support law enforcement, and ATF is a huge part of that equation. BERMAN: Thank you so much for explaining this process so well. I think we all learned something. ATF Director Steven Dettelbach, we're honored that you spent the morning of your last day with us -- appreciate it -- Kate.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Thanks so much, John.

We also have new reporting this morning on President-elect Donald Trump's plan to crack down on immigration as soon as he takes office. We're talking hours; not days in. The incoming administration in this new CNN reporting is reportedly finalizing a slate of executive orders that could be released within hours after he is sworn in. That is according to two sources familiar with the plans.

The plans include ICE sweeps across major American cities, moving more Pentagon resources to the southern border, and working quickly to roll back the policies that the Biden administration has put in place.

Joining us right now to talk about this is Meghan Hays, Democratic strategist and former White House director of message planning under President Biden. And Pete Seat, former spokesman in the George W. Bush White House. It's great to see you, guys. Pete, it's great to have you here in person. Meghan, I wish you were here as well.

Hours after he takes office people can expect executive actions to take -- one side note, Trump and Republicans have both criticized Biden for using and not using executive actions when it comes to immigration. I digress. But these big sweeps of American cities and much more.

Campaign promise made, campaign promise kept?

PETE SEAT, FORMER WHITE HOUSE SPOKESPERSON FOR PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH, FORMER SPOKESPERSON, INDIANA REPUBLICAN PARTY, VICE PRESIDENT, BOSE PUBLIC AFFAIRS GROUP: Absolutely, campaign promise made and kept. He ran on immigration. He is a hardliner on this topic in securing our border and making sure that we tackle the surge of illegal immigration in this country.

And Donald Trump has said -- you know, a lot of people think it's bluster and bluff when he says I'm going to act on day one. It sounds like he's going to act on day one.

And Tom Homan has been saying --

BOLDUAN: Um-hum.

SEAT: -- the same thing ever since he was tapped to lead ICE in this Trump administration. He has said on day one, 12:01 p.m., expect action to be taken.

[07:40:00]

And a lot of action needs to be taken because Joe Biden signed -- I think it was 94 or 96 executive orders in his first 100 days to scrap what Trump had done and what was working. So they're probably going to have to reverse a lot of that.

BOLDUAN: Yeah, we'll get to the back-and-forth --

SEAT: Yeah.

BOLDUAN: -- of executive orders scrapping in just a second.

Meghan, how do Democrats -- Democrats want a secure southern border as well. How do Democrats respond to this -- react to these moves and in their view make sure it doesn't go too far? Because you know that Kamala Harris, during the campaign, definitely moved to take a more aggressive approach on immigration as part of a campaign.

This gets to this debate that's important and interesting of -- amongst Democrats, which is should they be the resistance or should they learn to co-exist with Republicans and Trump this time?

MEGHAN HAYS, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST, FORMER WHITE HOUSE DIRECTOR OF MESSAGE PLANNING UNDER PRESIDENT JOE BIDEN, DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL CONVENTION CONSULTANT: Look, I think they're going to have to take a middle road here, right? We're going to have to co-exist, but we also have to make sure that we're doing things that the American people want that also are constitutionally correct and appropriate.

So I think that the two-pronged approach here is having a secure border with legal citizenship or a pathway to citizenship. But I think that some of these actions that he wants to take on day one, he's not going to want to have some of the optics of mass deportation and separating families here.

So I think that we will see some actions being taken from Trump. It will not be as extreme as he was when he was campaigning. Again, campaigning is different than governing. And I think this is one of those issues where they're going to figure out that governing is going to be much more challenging than the campaign.

BOLDUAN: And they also you would think, Pete, have learned the lesson of when you put in place a policy without thinking of how quickly -- how the fallout will lay with the first -- you know, with the -- with the first -- with the first ban -- travel ban that they put in place. I mean, the optics of that was horrendous.

SEAT: Well, I would say it would be smart to set expectations. Almost anything the government does -- it doesn't matter if it's Republican or Democrat -- can be a little messy at times.

BOLDUAN: Um-hum.

SEAT: And if it's --

BOLDUAN: Well, actually, that's a good point. Do you think they're setting expectations to hide --

SEAT: Yeah.

BOLDUAN: -- from what they're going to be able to pull off? SEAT: Yeah, and I -- look, I think that is a hallmark of Donald Trump. He loves to set high expectations. He will move the goal post if he needs to to declare victory. But the prudent move on this I think would be to lay the expectations out and say hey, this isn't going to be quick and it's not going to be easy.

BOLDUAN: There's also, Meghan, been a lot written about how much Joe Biden is doing in these final days to, I'll just say box Trump in potentially.

I mean, you've got the commutations -- the list that he just -- that was just announced this morning. Bans on oil and gas drilling in the final moments. Extending temporary protected status to nearly a million immigrants. Removing Cuba from the state-sponsored terror list.

What is -- what do you think Joe Biden is doing, and what do you think it does to Donald Trump?

HAYS: Look, I think Donald Trump has a very smart team behind him and they are going to try to figure out how to get out of some of these different things. But this is President Biden's right. He is president until January 20 at 11:59 and he is able to do what he wants to do. And some of these were policies that he wanted to do when he ran for president.

So I don't begrudge him for actually following through to the very last day and running through the tape, as they like to say over there at the White House. So I don't begrudge him for doing any of that.

And Donald Trump will have to figure out if it's worth the optics of getting out of some of these things that the American people actually did want.

BOLDUAN: What do you think, Pete, on this one?

SEAT: I'm not all that surprised. A lot of presidents do this on their way out the door.

BOLDUAN: All presidents do this --

SEAT: Right.

BOLDUAN: -- on their way out the door. It's been noted that what Biden has done has been unusually -- like, has been more -- you know, it's been -- it's been an unusual flurry of executive orders.

SEAT: It's certainly a flurry and unique and unprecedented in ways. Let's -- you know, Hunter Biden. We can put that aside.

But the sense that I have gotten just watching Joe Biden in these final weeks is this is not someone who is at peace with his legacy and the way his presidency is ending. And I think some of these decisions are maybe Hail Marys to leave some kind of legacy that is more positive than it has been up to this point. And even the fact that he's only done a couple of interviews on the

way out. Only one television interview last night. Only one print interview with USA Today. Usually, a president would be doing a flurry of interviews in addition to those executive orders.

BOLDUAN: And Meghan, that actually -- the legacy question is one that is -- gets exactly to the agreement or non-agreement on how well they have worked together when it comes to the Israel-Hamas hostage and ceasefire deal. Biden is sitting down in his final interview that he did just last night and Trump sitting down for a radio interview -- it's just like an odds on who should get the credit now.

Look at this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, (D) PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I told him what I was doing and what I thought could happen. But what we did, we brought in the people -- or his - going to be his national security people. We brought them in closer to tell them what was happening as we hand this off.

DONALD TRUMP, (R) PRESIDENT-ELECT OF THE UNITED STATES: It was so ungracious of Biden to say oh, he did it. He didn't do anything. If I didn't do this, if we didn't get involved, the hostages would never be out. They would have never come out.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[07:45:00]

BOLDUAN: Why can't they, do you think, just say we worked on this together as their staff seem to be very capable of saying that we've brought them in, and we've worked in coordination? Is this -- is this -- does this get to the question of legacy for Joe Biden?

HAYS: No. I mean, also, to Pete's earlier point, you can't judge a legacy here in just the last couple of days of what he's doing. He's had 50 years of public service so his legacy will be long past some of the -- these execution actions that he is doing in the last couple of days.

On the issue of the ceasefire I do think that Joe Biden is being more gracious to Donald Trump and giving them credit, saying they were being brought in. But the fact of the matter is this was their framework from May, as the president announced, so they should get the lion's share of the credit. They've been over there trying to deal with this negotiation. But also, Donald Trump's team was impactful here.

And so they can split credit. I'm not sure that these two men can figure out how to do that. I think there's some other things at play here. But I do think that both of these teams deserve credit to get these hostages home.

BOLDUAN: Yeah. Teams versus the two men at the top. Those are two different men. These two men -- they're not going to say it. Their teams though saying we got this done.

Great to see you guys. Thank you very much -- Sara.

SIDNER: All right. Just ahead we did lose the ship. The enormous SpaceX explosion that rattled people on the ground and managed to disrupt flights.

Also, Americans are more stressed out than ever. What if two simple words can help bring that stress down and potentially change your life in ways you could never imagine? My conversation with world-renowned motivational speaker and best-selling author Mel Robbins ahead.

(COMMERCIAL)

[07:51:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (Bleep) -- what the (bleep)?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: All right, the reaction to seeing the remains of the SpaceX mega Starship rocket streaking across the sky. The rocket, which is the largest one ever built, was on its seventh uncrewed test flight when minutes after takeoff it experienced what SpaceX called a rapid, unscheduled disassembly. As the civilians you heard right there -- as they might say, "It blew the f up."

CNN aviation correspondent Pete Muntean is with us now. And Pete, this actually disrupted air traffic for some time.

PETE MUNTEAN, CNN AVIATION CORRESPONDENT: Don't let the PR speak get in the way of a good story there, John.

BERMAN: Yeah.

MUNTEAN: You know, this is pretty significant, and it could be the first time falling space debris has ever had a major impact on air travel like this, though not the first time that falling space junk has been seen by pilots. Remember, it's the Federal Aviation Administration that controls airspace in the U.S. -- the same federal agency that grants launch waives to SpaceX. So there could be an interesting rub developing here.

Pilots reported seeing the view of Starship breaking up about 10 minutes into its test flight 90 miles above the Earth. That's when the link to Starship was lost. And there was apparently some real concern that some of this could fall on a commercial flight below because the airspace in the Caribbean can be very busy, especially in the wintertime.

So the FAA put into place this rare sweeping delay for flights leaving Miami International Airport and also Fort Lauderdale-Hollywood International Airport. And this was the peculiar line. Flights were delayed an average of 45 to 60 minutes because of a rocket launch anomaly. A separate alert from the FAA said this was due to debris.

And I want you to listen now to this recording from LiveATC.net of air traffic controllers telling pilots of this space debris delay -- listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PILOT: We just got a major streak going from at least 60 miles. There are all these different colors. I'm just curious. It looked like it was coming towards us but obviously because of distance. Just letting you know.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MUNTEAN: The good news is this did not last for all that long.

And here's the statement from the FAA. "The FAA briefly slowed flights and diverted aircraft around the area where space -- where the space vehicle debris was falling." And that "normal operations have resumed."

Now, the FAA says it was able to divert some flights away from this but also keep incoming flights out of the area of concern.

This is exactly why the FAA restricts airspace and will slow flights because of a launch. And private spaceflight really makes the skies all the more crowded. They are crowded already with airliners and such.

So this is the first time, maybe, that this has happened but probably not the last. The FAA says it establishes what it calls "debris response area" when something like this happens. How's that for a little bit of another misnomer there, John?

BERMAN: Yeah. Look, I'm going to file this in all stuff I didn't know until Pete Muntean just told me. All that's really interesting, Pete. And for a child of the '80s like me, what it really all looked like was an advertisement for Reading Rainbow, but that aside.

MUNTEAN: (Laughing).

BERMAN: Thank you for your reporting this morning, Pete.

MUNTEAN: All of the colors, John.

BERMAN: All of the colors.

As always, thanks for your reporting, Pete -- Sara.

MUNTEAN: See you.

SIDNER: Butterfly in the sky I think is how that one started, John.

All right. Americans are more stressed out than ever. According to Gallup polling, the most recent data shows that nearly half of all Americans -- 49 percent -- say they frequently experience stress. But what if a simple trick could take some of that stress away? One of the most followed and sought after experts in mindset behavior change and life improvement says the answer lies in two words, let them.

We sat down with the award-winning podcast host and New York Times bestselling author Mel Robbins.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MEL ROBBINS, PODCASTER, AUTHOR, "THE LET THEM THEORY": I do believe with my entire heart and every cell in my body that you're one decision away from a different life.

[07:55:00]

SIDNER (voiceover): Mel Robbins knows this because that is how she changed her entire adult life. She's now the number one female podcaster in the world and a New York Times bestselling author.

SIDNER: First of all, this is kind of a full circle for you. Welcome back to CNN.

ROBBINS: Well, thank you. I don't think a lot of people realize that follow me that I actually spent three years as a legal analyst here.

SIDNER: I mean, I remember seeing you on TV and here you are. You went to law school, and you passed the bar, you were a lawyer, and you managed to get a TV gig, and you weren't happy?

ROBBINS: When I landed a job at CNN what was happening in my personal life is not what you saw on television. What was happening in my personal life is that my husband and I were about $800,000 in debt. I was going back home to a house that had liens on it and a phone that was ringing off the hook with debt collectors calling because they're asking for money.

SIDNER: I'm literally getting anxious listening to this.

ROBBINS: I responded to the crisis in my life by avoiding doing anything. And so I found myself, like, chronically hitting the snooze button four, five, six times a day. My kids were the ones who were waking me up because I had missed -- they had missed the bus.

SIDNER: Oh, no.

ROBBINS: And I became a person that I didn't recognize.

SIDNER: What was it that sort of lifted you out of bed?

ROBBINS: Um, it was just this dumb trick. I literally just started counting backwards five, four, three, two, one, and I stood up. And that one technique of counting backwards -- five, four, three, two, one -- changed my whole life. The decision to get out of bed -- that turned my life in an entirely new direction. And it's the initial domino that falls, and that's why I say you're one decision away from a different life. SIDNER (voiceover): It's a technique she wrote a book about, and it's

backed by science, by giving your brain a different pattern to use than the destructive one.

Her latest book is starting a revolution of the mind. "The Let Them Theory" is so effective people around the world are tattooing the theory on their bodies.

ROBBINS: I was the person that was pissed off in the grocery store. Stressed out and gripping the steering wheel. Annoyed by inconsiderate behavior.

Bother -- you know, like, bending over backwards because people made me feel guilty. Just playing into narcissistic personality style. It's just over and over and over trying to make other people happy. Trying to change other people. Controlling other people because I thought it would make me feel better. Like, just exhausting.

And when I stumbled on to these two words "let them" while I was micromanaging my son at his high school prom and trying to --

SIDNER (voiceover): Her daughter was the one who uttered the two simple words to her.

ROBBINS: What I learned in researching the "let them" theory is this. That when we have an opinion about worry about or try to pressure someone else to change we don't motivate them. Based on neurology and based on the science you actually create resistance to changing and here's why.

SIDNER: Oh, so you're making it worse?

ROBBINS: You're making it way worse. I'm going to teach you how --

SIDNER: OK.

ROBBINS: -- to use this theory. It's going to make your relationships way better and it's also going to make you more effective.

SIDNER: Hmm.

ROBBINS: Because you cannot change somebody else, but I never said you couldn't influence them. I'm ready to use science.

So the first thing you have to say is let them -- let them fail. Let them struggle. Let them get bad grades. Let them lose that job. Let them put on more weight. Because when you say let them to -- a number of things are happening and they're really important.

Number one, you're actually seeing and accepting a person exactly as they are and exactly as they aren't maybe for the very first time.

SIDNER: Yeah.

ROBBINS: The second thing you're doing when you say let them is you are recognizing that this situation and this person's behavior right now is completely outside of my control. Therefore, why on Earth would I waste any time and energy trying to control something that I cannot control.

SIDNER (voiceover): But it does not end with let them. There is a second part Robbins calls "let me."

SIDNER: When you say let them --

ROBBINS: Uh-huh.

SIDNER: -- my first reaction when I -- when I saw the cover of the book was, like, so you're just going to let people do everything they want to do? Walk all over you? Just go like, oh, I surrender?

ROBBINS: You're already doing that.

SIDNER: Damn.

ROBBINS: So you're already doing that and then bitching about it and then aiming it back at yourself. The "let them" theory --

SIDNER: You got me.

ROBBINS: -- is a power move because you're letting people reveal who they are and who they're not. You're letting them reveal through their behavior what their priorities are and where you stand.

When you let somebody reveal who they are, let them. And then you go let me remind myself that my relationships are my responsibility. Let me remind myself that I get to choose how much time and energy I pour into another person, or a business meeting, or an interview, or a date, or a conversation, or a text chain.

SIDNER: Do you have to say it a lot?