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Florida Threatens to Prosecute TV Stations Running Abortion Ad; Interview With Rep. Jake Auchincloss (D-MA); Tim Walz Blasts Trump For Disparaging Detroit; Climate Change as National Security Threat. Aired 11:30a-12p ET

Aired October 11, 2024 - 11:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[11:30:00]

PAMELA BROWN, CNN HOST: We're going to dive into that question with our CNN national security analyst, Peter Bergen.

So Peter, great to have you on.

You write in a new piece out today: "Treating climate change as a national security problem is not a liberal position, but a hardheaded, realist one."

Where do you think the government is, the U.S. government is, about taking this threat seriously enough as a national security priority?

PETER BERGEN, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Well, I think you had Lloyd Austin is saying it is existential.

And the Pentagon actually for many years has actually focused on climate change as a national security issue, for two big reasons. One, the U.S. Navy, one of its most important ports is in Norfolk, Virginia, very much affected by climate change and rising waters. The U.S. Navy's SEALs are in Virginia Beach, also very much affected by climate change and rising waters.

So they have to plan for a contingency where they can still operate these ports, even though the water is rising significantly. Secondly, the Pentagon is aware that a lot of crises are amplified by climate change. So the big -- the most lethal war in the going on in the world right now is not -- very undercovered -- is in Sudan, where you have got millions of people displaced by climate change and the conflict simultaneously.

So it kind of complicates the conflicts that exist. And there's a school of thought that the civil war in Syria began with a drought, which then sort of prompted people to rise up against Assad. So the Pentagon is definitely treating this issue seriously.

I was arguing in the piece that we should all sort of think it -- when we think about security, it's not just freedom from attack. It's, are we able to live our lives in a way that it isn't interfered with by a pandemic? The pandemic, the COVID pandemic, killed 1.2 million people. That's more than every American who died in every war since the American Revolution.

That -- to me, so pandemics and climate change are, I think, national security issues.

BROWN: Yes. And you talk in your piece about just the evolving view of national security and how climate change should impact that view now.

BERGEN: Yes. Yes.

When Roosevelt was president, FDR, he thought of national security in a more holistic way. And the reason we have Social Security is because he thought it was important for people to live in their older years with some security. He had a more holistic view of national security.

Once the Cold War happened, it got more narrow-focused. It was a threat from the Soviets. And then, of course, 9/11 happened. It was a threat from terrorists. But I think we can all agree that, if people aren't secure from pandemics, floods, they're not really secure.

BROWN: Yes. I mean, I -- just looking at this video, think about this. And I have done reporting on it, actually, in my home state of Kentucky, these climate refugees, people who have been forced out of their homes and how the floods there in Eastern Kentucky are just going to become more common, right?

BERGEN: Right.

BROWN: The once-in-1,000-year floods are now going to be once every hundred years, and it's just going to continue to become more and more frequent. But they can't afford to stay. They can't afford to leave either. Right?

There are people who are in that predicament as well. And it raises the question of what more the government can do from a policy standpoint to combat climate change.

BERGEN: Well, there's a kind of moral hazard question, which is people shouldn't be able to rebuild in areas that are flood-prone.

I mean, the zoning laws should be enforced in a more strong way. And you have seen the insurance companies now in states like Louisiana, where my wife is from, they're not going to insure in the same way, because -- and I think that also affects the way that people think about buying property in Louisiana or buying property in Florida, because, if the insurance is either prohibitively expensive or you can't be insured, then I think people are going to start making their own decisions about where to live.

BROWN: Yes. I think that that's a really important point.

Your article on CNN.com, a really important read, I think. Thank you so much.

BERGEN: Thank you, Pam. BROWN: Still ahead this hour: Israel ramps up its aerial campaign in

the Lebanese capital as the world waits for its response to Iran's missile attacks.

You're live in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:38:40]

BROWN: Moments ago, Democratic vice presidential candidate Tim Walz sharply criticized former President Trump for his swipe at the city of Detroit.

Trump yesterday compared Detroit to a developing nation. Here's what Walz just said at a rally in Michigan.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. TIM WALZ (D-MN), VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Just yesterday, Donald Trump was in Detroit and he said: "Our whole country will end up being Detroit. You're going to have a mess on your hands."

(BOOING)

WALZ: Well, look, I know you don't -- that's not unexpected for him. That's exactly what he's going to do, tear down America.

But if the guy would have ever spent any time in the Midwest, like all of us know, we'd know Detroit's experiencing an American comeback and renaissance.

(CHEERING)

WALZ: Look, I'm a Twins fan, and you whipped our ass. We know where this is. Detroit's there. So we know.

City's growing, crime's down, factories are opening up. But those guys, all they know about manufacturing is manufacturing bull (EXPLETIVE DELETED) every time they show up.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: CNN White House correspondent Priscilla Alvarez joins us now.

And it is true that actually population has grown in Detroit under the Biden administration.

[11:40:00]

Priscilla, what else did Walz say?

PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, but notable all the same that it's Tim Walz who is launching an attack against former President Donald Trump over what he said in Detroit yesterday. And then pivoting, he was moment -- just moments ago talking about the

auto industry, about manufacturing, and what the Harris/Walz administration would offer on that front. So, he spent some time there, as you heard, attacking the former president for his remarks, but then pivoting to what the campaign would do, perhaps as expected.

But it is this type of appeal that the campaign saw in Walz that he brings to the ticket and that they are trying to lean in on again in this final stretch, so he can pull from his own roots to talk about this candidly.

And you heard that there when he was discussing manufacturing and the Midwest, as someone who knows the region, who knows about this industry. Now, of course, Tim Walz is in Michigan. Michigan is a state that former -- or President Biden won narrowly in 2020.

It is one that the campaign is keeping a very close eye on, one, of course, where the polls have, like many other of these battleground states, been quite deadlocked. So him delivering these remarks in this battleground state was important.

I will also note, Pam, that the vice president will be heading to Detroit next week as well. So we will keep eyes to see if she also responds to what former President Donald Trump said this week.

BROWN: All right, Priscilla Alvarez, thank you so much.

And new this morning, Russian leader Vladimir Putin held a historic meeting with Iran's president. It's actually the first time that the counterparts have met and this latest sign of a warming relationship between the two countries.

And it comes as the crisis builds in the Middle East. Much of the world is waiting right now for Israel's response to Iran's barrage of nearly 200 missiles last week. Prime Minister Netanyahu has vowed retaliation, adding to fears that Israel's offensive against Iran- backed groups could lead to a wider war in the region.

Joining us now is Democratic Congressman Jake Auchincloss of Massachusetts. He also served in the Marine Corps.

Congressman, thanks for coming on.

So let's begin with a meeting of Israel's security cabinet to consider how best to retaliate against Iran. A source tells CNN that the gap separating the U.S. and Israeli positions is closing. Do you believe that could be critical in preventing a regional war?

REP. JAKE AUCHINCLOSS (D-MA): Before we talk about the tactics, I do think it's helpful to level-set on the objectives, because objectives are upstream of both strategy and tactics in warfare.

What are Israel's objectives here? I think they're threefold. One, they want to get the hostages home from Gaza. Two, they want to demilitarize both their southern and northern border areas, because both Hamas and Hezbollah have been launching rockets and precision- guided ammunitions into Israeli population centers for years.

And then, three, they want peace with their Arab neighbors. The Abraham Accords was an important start, but they want to extend it into Saudi Arabia and beyond. Now let's compare that to what Iran wants. Iran wants to destroy Israel.

There's no positive agenda. There's no benefit, betterment for the Iranian people. It's just simply a genocidal agenda. And because of that asymmetry in the two countries' agendas, Israel needs to be able to strike back at Iran when it senses vulnerability and liability to prevent Iran from acquiring the means to destroy Israel.

Now, the time, place and manner for those strikes, I think, should be maintained as a closely held state secret. You don't want to signal what you're going to do to your enemy. But, certainly, Israel has the right and the responsibility to hit back.

BROWN: Right.

And President Biden has indicated he is supportive of that. I think the question is how Israel hits back in trying to prevent that regional war.

I want to go to this copy of the Bob -- that CNN obtained of Bob Woodward's book "War." And ahead of its release, we obtained it. President Biden, in the book, privately referred to Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu as a "son of a B," calling the Israeli prime minister "a bad effing guy."

Netanyahu has consistently ignored Biden's calls for restraint. Do you think that's changing at all?

AUCHINCLOSS: I think we have to divorce the personalities and politics in between Biden and Netanyahu with the deeper and stronger U.S.-Israel relationship, which is ironclad and, actually, I would argue stronger than ever.

I mean, President Biden's frustration with Netanyahu is, in fact, mirrored by the Israeli public's frustration with Netanyahu. Everything Joe Biden said in private about Netanyahu has been said publicly and repeatedly by Israeli political officials of all parties publicly about Netanyahu.

So it kind of just underscores the degree of alignment between our two countries. The objectives that I described earlier, both countries share them, as you say. The tactics employed by the IDF have, I think, largely been consonant with U.S. advice.

[11:45:06]

The missing bridge has been the strategy. As part of this book, Woodward says that at one point President Biden exclaimed: "What's your strategy, man?"

And I think that echoes a lot of the frustration, is that Netanyahu has not articulated how he is going to help architect infrastructure, education, economic development in Gaza with the Palestinian-led rebuilding effort that would actually marginalize and defeat Hamas in the long term.

He has not explained how we're going to get to the blue line in Lebanon. He has not explained what his long-term strategy regarding Iran is. That's what we need political leaders to do, is articulate and build support for strategy.

BROWN: This morning -- I got to ask you about this -- the Kremlin confirmed another claim in the book, that Trump sent Vladimir Putin several COVID tests early in the pandemic.

Of course, Democrats have seized on this, saying that those tests should have gone to Americans during a time that they were scarce as the death toll rose. What is your reaction?

AUCHINCLOSS: It underscores, I think, a deeper problem that we have in the Republican Party these days, which is, Donald Trump has made the wrong people afraid of him.

He has made Ted Cruz and Marco Rubio and Tom Cotton afraid of him. They don't want to say that the election in 2020 was free and fair. They don't want to push back on his disinformation about the hurricane. At the same time, as Republican elected officials in America are afraid of Donald Trump, Vladimir Putin and Xi Jinping and Kim Jong-un are not afraid of him.

They're laughing at him. He's sending them fanboy presents. And so this is a danger to U.S. national security.

BROWN: When you say they're laughing at them -- at him, what do you mean? Like, how do you know that?

AUCHINCLOSS: What I mean is that Vladimir Putin and Xi Jinping do not take Donald Trump seriously as an adversary.

What they see is that he is not just sympathetic, but indeed aligned with their authoritarian impulses and that, when he degrades our institutions and when he says he believes Russian intelligence over U.S. intelligence, that he is in fact elevating their decades-long campaign to drive Western societies out of the rules-based international order that we helped architect after World War II.

BROWN: All right, Congressman Jake Auchincloss, thank you.

And still ahead: TV stations in Florida threatened with criminal charges if they air an abortion rights ad. You won't believe what Florida is doing about this and how the federal government is responding. This is quite a story.

Stick with me. We're going to discuss it next with Brian Stelter.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:51:45]

BROWN: Welcome back.

Florida is threatening to prosecute local TV stations that air an abortion rights ad. It centers on the Amendment 4 ballot measure that would enshrine abortion rights in the state constitution and overturn the six-week ban signed by Governor Ron DeSantis.

CNN chief media analyst Brian Stelter joins us now.

So, first let's listen to a bit of this ad. It features a mother named Caroline.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CAROLINE WILLIAMS, MOTHER: If I did not end my pregnancy, I would lose my baby, I would lose my life and my daughter would lose her mom. Florida has now banned abortion, even in cases like mine.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: Well, this sounds pretty similar to campaign ads you and I see on our TVs all throughout the election season, including right here on CNN.

Why is Florida's Department of Health taking such an extreme step here?

BRIAN STELTER, CNN CHIEF MEDIA ANALYST: In my 20-plus years covering the media, I have never seen a state try to punish a local TV station in this way.

And these letters went out to multiple TV stations in the state of Florida. So why is it happening? Why this extreme step? It's because the political battle over this abortion rights amendment is so fierce, Pamela.

Ron DeSantis' government is trying everything it can to ensure the amendment fails. But so far, from local polling, it appears the amendment is likely to pass. Abortion rights may be enshrined in the state of Florida, so the right-wing government's trying desperately to stop it.

BROWN: Right. Can we just take a step back here? This is a state government threatening to prosecute a local TV station that is legally bound to carry political ads, right?

STELTER: Yes, it is a truly autocratic moment. And here's the good news. The local stations have seen through this threat.

They have ignored the threat. They have continued to carry the ad. And as you said, they're legally bound. Local stations have to carry political ads, even ones they believe are false or disgusting. I will give an example from earlier this week. ABC's "The View" had to run a commercial paid for by a fringe presidential candidate.

It's an anti-abortion ad that compares the hosts of "The View" to Nazis. It also attacks some of our colleagues here at CNN. CNN came out and called the ad deplorable and antisemitic. But the point is that ABC had to run the political ad. That's the law.

So it is so striking that the Florida Department of Health was trying to violate essentially that law. And that's why the FCC commissioner, the person who actually oversees government licensing of stations, came out and said the Florida proposal, the Florida letter, the legal threat is against the First Amendment, Pamela.

BROWN: And you mentioned autocratic.

Something else that certainly rings of being autocratic is the Republican presidential nominee, Donald Trump, saying that CBS should lose its license because of how it edited its recent interview with Kamala Harris. Tell us about that.

STELTER: Yes, I think some of these editing screw-ups are legitimate.

BROWN: Yes.

STELTER: And they do cause a less trust in the media. Trump is complaining, in some ways in a legitimate way, that CBS was stitching together parts of the Harris interview on "60 Minutes."

[11:55:00]

But the much bigger problem here is that Trump is saying that all CBS stations should lose their licenses. He's also saying other broadcast networks, other local stations should lose their government licenses because he says they're all corrupt.

That is firmly in an antidemocratic mode to threaten station licenses. We have seen this from Trump before, but I would argue, Pamela, he's becoming more explicit and more extreme about it as the campaign rolls on as we head toward Election Day. It is absolutely out of the norms of the First Amendment and of American democracy to say that stations should lose their licenses because Donald Trump doesn't like the content.

BROWN: Yes, seriously. And that also prompted a very sharp rebuke as well from the FEC (sic)...

STELTER: From the FCC, yes.

BROWN: ... saying that it will not revoke licenses because a political candidate disagrees with or dislikes the coverage.

Brian, thank you so much.

STELTER: Here's the thing though, Pam.

BROWN: Yes?

STELTER: If Trump chooses a different FCC chair, theoretically, they could take away licenses.

BROWN: There you go. Yes, that's a very important final word there, Brian.

Thank you so much. Great to have you on.

STELTER: Thank you.

BROWN: And thank you all for joining me on this Friday. I'm Pamela Brown. You can follow me on Instagram, TikTok and X @PamelaBrownCNN.

Stay with us. "INSIDE POLITICS," with Jessica Dean, starts after a short break.