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Attorney General Nominee Pam Bondi Faces Confirmation Hearings; Hamas Approves Gaza Cease-Fire and Hostage Agreement. Aired 11:30a-12p ET

Aired January 15, 2025 - 11:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

SEN. THOM TILLIS (R-NC): One was about you being a lobbyist paid for and on the payroll of Qatar. Would you mind going back and repeating what you said in case people did not hear the involvement of your law firm and precisely what you were doing for the government of Qatar?

PAMELA JO BONDI, NOMINATED TO BE ATTORNEY GENERAL OF THE UNITED STATES: Yes, Senator. I was very proud of that work. It was anti-human trafficking in advance of the World Cup. And human trafficking has been something that's been very important to me, my entire career, especially when I was attorney general.

TILLIS: And you also made it clear that you had a number of practitioners within the firm working on it. So this narrative that you were getting $115,000 a month from Qatar is correct or not?

BONDI: Not correct.

TILLIS: OK. Thank you. I want to talk a little bit about -- well, first off, I want to go back. You should be happy that so many comments have been directed towards Kash Patel, whose confirmation I am supporting. In fact, I'm meeting with him today. Because that means they're out of stuff for you.

So if it comes up again, you will once again know that you've got a great reputation and a great resume and they're just trying to find things to put your integrity into question.

You have answered the question repeatedly that you're -- that you will be loyal to the Constitution and you will -- you will live up to the oath, to the Constitution and to protecting the American people.

And I think Mr. Patel, when he becomes here, he'll be able to get rid of the myth in the same way that you did as a lobbyist for Qatar. He'll be able to get rid of that list of the enemies, so they'll be able to deal with the enemies list. And the marketing department for your opposition is going to have to come up with new material because that stuff is getting old.

Section 702. You heard Senator Lee talked about some concerns that he has with 702. I believe it's one of the most important things that you can do early into your confirmation. You will be confirmed, and hopefully with some Democrat support, that there have been dramatic reforms to 702. I've sat through an extensive presentation to try and make sure that the abuses never occur again, and that you have a throat to choke if somebody abuses the protocol that's in place. I believe that we need to codify a lot of that.

As a matter of fact, when I went through it, I felt like there were so many blinding flashes of the obvious. How could this not have already been a part of the approval matrix?

So can you, after you're confirmed, commit that you or a designate will come back and provide for this committee an update on all of the protocols that have changed and recommended legislation for codifying so that when we do go to reauthorization, we'll have what we need to make sure that program stays in place?

BONDI: Senator, I or a designee, will review all of 702 before it terms, of course, in 2026 and come back and report to you on both sides of the aisle.

TILLIS: Thank you. You have a great perspective with your time in the state and working with the Department of Justice. Give me an idea of things that we need to do better in terms of -- and I'm talking primarily in the law enforcement role.

I think many people don't understand the joint task forces, the law enforcement efforts that are going every single day in every one of our states. What an -- what an incredible job they do.

So, can you give me some sense of things that you would look at to say maybe we could do it better from your perspective of having been a prosecutor for -- in Florida?

BONDI: Yes. Thank you, Senator. Yes. Having been a career prosecutor, I think I have a unique perspective because I was a state prosecutor, of course, prior to becoming attorney general.

So I worked on a daily basis with local law enforcement and state and not daily with federal, but I work consistently with state, local, and federal. Then when I was attorney general, I worked with all three as well.

I feel like we have to have better coordination among all our agencies, especially given all the terrorism issues that we've discussed earlier in this hearing. We have to wrap in and communicate better with our local and state law enforcement officers throughout this country.

There are so many great men and women in law enforcement. And we have to -- I don't know exactly how yet, but we have to figure out a better way to work together with the federal authorities.

TILLIS: Thank you. And I'm going to do a second round as well. But I think I also checked the bingo card for election denier. There were some people, you know, that seemed to suggest that you were denying the election.

I think that you said that President Biden is our president.

BONDI: President Biden is the president of the United States of America. And President Trump will be the 47th president.

TILLIS: But I think you made a point that, or at least I inferred from a comment that you made a very important point.

[11:35:04]

Folks, there are election improprieties in every election. The matter of -- the question is a matter of scale and whether or not you can prove it. We've seen it in North Carolina and seeing it at other places. It's one of the reasons why I support voter ID, because we want to make elections easy to vote and hard to cheat.

But the fact of the matter is people are cheating. So if anybody on this dais suggests that there aren't irregularities in every election that they need to spend more time at home and really studying the facts.

I don't think though that you've said that Biden is an illegitimate president. In fact, I think you said just the opposite. He is the president of the United States and President Trump will be the next president, right?

BONDI: Yes.

TILLIS: OK. Last thing before the second round. January 6th. A lot of people are going to say, you're going to have a rubber stamp for letting people have pardons or recommending a pardon for people who did violence to law enforcement.

I'm not going to ask you a hypothetical because I want you to be consistent in not answering them. But I have to believe as a member -- I was the last member out of the Senate on January the 6th.

I walked past a lot of law enforcement officers, excuse me, who were injured. I find it hard to believe that the President of the United States or you would look at facts that were used to convict the violent people on January the 6th and say it was just an intemperate moment.

That I don't even expect you to respond to that, but I think it's an absurd and unfair hypothetical here, and you probably haven't heard the last of it.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

(OFF-MIC)

SEN. CHARLES E. GRASSLEY (R-IA): Before I call on Senator Hirono. After her and Cruz's testimony, and then we'll take a lunch break, and that break will be for 30 minutes, and I can't control when my senators come back, but I expect you to be back at after 30 minutes, and I'll be here.

BONDI: Yes, Chairman.

GRASSLEY: And then I may leave the meeting to open the Senate, so whoever's on our side is acting chairman during that period of time.

Senator Hirono.

SEN. MAZIE K. HIRONO (D-HI): Thank you, Mr. Chairman. As part of my responsibility to ensure the fitness of all nominees, I ask the following two initial questions. First, since you became a legal adult, have you ever made unwanted requests for sexual favors, or committed any verbal or physical harassment or assault of a sexual nature?

BONDI: No, Senator.

HIRONO: Have you ever faced discipline or entered into a settlement relating to this kind of conduct?

BONDI: No, Senator.

HIRONO: Ms. Bondi, I am focused on two things in my evaluation of President Trump's -- President-elect Trump's nominees. The first is whether the nominee is qualified and experienced enough to do the job.

The second is fitness to serve, which includes putting loyalty to the Constitution over loyalty to the President. Unfortunately, in my view, many of President Trump's -- President-elect Trump's nominees are lacking in at least one of these categories two requirements.

Ms. Bondi, your experience as a prosecutor is the kind of thing we would expect to see in a nominee for Attorney General, but I do have questions and concerns about potential conflicts of interest, about whether you will keep DOJ's law enforcement responsibilities independent of the President's political whims, and about whether you will let facts and evidence guide your decision.

So, let's start with the importance of facts, which you say is so important. Ms. Bondi, we want an attorney general who bases decisions on facts. So, I want to ask you a factual question. Who won the 2020 presidential election?

BONDI: Joe Biden is the president of the United States.

HIRONO: Ms. Bondi, you know that there is a difference between acknowledging it and you know, I can say that Donald Trump won the 2024 election. I may not like it. But I can say it. You cannot say who won the 2020 presidential election.

OK. It's disturbing that you can't give voice to that fact.

Moving on to DOJ's independence from politics. Ms. Bondi, if you are confirmed as Attorney General, you will take an oath to the Constitution and not to any individual, including the President.

To start, I'd like to know whether you agree with some of the statements President-elect Trump made during the election, during the campaign.

First, are the felons convicted of breaking into the Capitol on January 6th, hostages or patriots? I'm quoting Trump, as President- elect Trump has said repeatedly.

[11:40:04]

Do you agree with his characterization of the felons that I referred to?

BONDI: I am not familiar with that statement, Senator.

HIRONO: I just familiarized you with that statement. Do you agree with that statement?

BONDI: I'm not familiar with it, Senator.

HIRONO: No answer. He has also said, illegal immigration is poisoning the blood of our nation. He said that in December 2023. Do you agree with that statement?

BONDI: Senator, I am not familiar with that statement. But what I can tell you is I went to the border a few months ago. I went to Yuma, Arizona. And what I saw at that border was horrific, Senator. It was horrific.

HIRONO: Ms. Bondi that ...

BONDI: I went to a rape crisis center.

HIRONO: That is not my question.

BONDI: If I could finish. I went to a rape crisis center. Well, I'm not familiar with the statement. But I went to a rape crisis center. I met with border patrol agents. I'm sure you've been to the border as well (inaudible) ...

HIRONO: Ms. Bondi, I want to get to my next question. So, I believe that you responded to a question from Senator Whitehouse. And let me get your response again. You said that the White House, if I'm putting words in your mouth, correct me. Oh, you said that the White House will play no role in investigative or charging decisions in the DOJ.

Is that correct?

BONDI: Senator, what I said is that it is the Department of Justice's decision to determine what cases ...

HIRONO: What ...

BONDI: ... will be prosecuted.

HIRONO: What role will the White House have in investigative or prosecutorial decisions of the DOJ?

BONDI: It is the Department of Justice's decision, Senator. HIRONO: So that sounds to me that you're saying that the White House will not have any kind of role. Meanwhile, though, you have a -- an incoming president who said, I have the absolute right to do what I want to do with the Justice Department. And in fact, President-elect Trump considers the DOJ to be his law firm.

I ask you this, if President-elect Trump asks, suggests, or hints that you as Attorney General should investigate one of his perceived political enemies, would you do so?

BONDI: Senator Hirono, I wish you had met with me. Had you met with me, we could have discussed many things and gotten to know you ...

HIRONO: I am listening to you now. Could you respond to the question?

BONDI: Yeah, you were the only one who refused to meet with me, Senator. But what we would have discussed is that it is the job of the Attorney General to follow the law.

HIRONO: I'm very happy to listen to your responses under oath, Ms. Bondi. So, I think it's really important to us that the Attorney General be independent of the White House and you have a president- elect who considers the agency's office his law firm.

I would like to know whether if the President suggests hints, asks that you as attorney general should investigate one of his perceived enemies? You do.

BONDI: Senator, I certainly have not heard the President say that. But what I will tell you is two-thirds of Americans have lost faith in the Department of Justice. And its statements like that, I believe...

HIRONO: Ms. Bondi...

BONDI: ... that make people continue to lose faith. If I am confirmed as Attorney General, it will be my job...

HIRONO: Getting my time. Next question...

BONDI: ... to not only keep Americans safe.

HIRONO: You're not responding.

BONDI: But restore integrity to that department...

HIRONO: Why don't we move on (inaudible)...

BONDI: ... and that's what I plan on doing every single day as Attorney General.

HIRONO: On August 25th, 2025, on Fox News, you said, when Republicans take back the White House, the Department of Justice, the prosecutors will be prosecuted. The bad ones, the investigators will be investigated.

Ms. Bondi, is Jack Smith one of those bad prosecutors that you will prosecute as AG?

BONDI: Senator, you hesitated a bit when I said the bad ones. Every decision...

HIRONO: I'm (inaudible)...

BONDI: ...will be made...

HIRONO: ...in the eyes of the beholder. I'm just asking whether you would consider Jack Smith...

BONDI: Senator...

HIRONO: ... to be one of the people. How about Liz Cheney?

BONDI: Senator...

HIRONO: How about Merrick Garland?

BONDI: ... I am not going to answer hypotheticals. No one has been prejudged or nor will anyone be prejudged...

HIRONO: I am asking whether...

BONDI: ...if I am confirmed.

HIRONO: These are the kind of people, these are in fact the people that you would prosecute.

GRASSLEY: OK. Your time is up. Would you like to...

HIRONO: My time is ...

GRASSLEY: ... would you like to respond?

HIRONO: Mr. Chairman. She is clearly not going to answer that question, so let me get on to...

GRASSLEY: Would you like to respond...

(CROSSTALK)

HIRONO: I do have questions for the second round.

GRASSLEY: You'll have a second round. Would you like to speak before I call on Senator Cruz?

HIRONO: No, sir. Thank you.

GRASSLEY: OK. Senator Cruz.

SEN. TED CRUZ (R-TX): Thank you, Mr. Chairman. General Bondi, welcome.

[11:45:02]

Thank you for... BONDI: Thank you.

CRUZ: ... your long career in public service, and thank you for your willingness to take on this incredibly important office. You know, I have to say, I don't know that there is a more important position in this new administration than the position to which you have been nominated. Attorney General of the United States. I thought the exchange just a moment ago with Senator Hirono was illustrative. She asked you how you would respond if the President asked you to

target his political enemies. It's rather striking because it's not a hypothetical it has happened over the last four years. And I think perhaps the most tragic legacy of the Biden-Harris administration has been the politicization and the weaponization of the United States Department of Justice. And we don't need to ask hypothetically because Joe Biden publicly mused and allowed the New York times to report it. Calling on Merrick Garland, why will he not prosecute Trump more quickly?

And Merrick Garland, sadly, he sat in that chair and promised to be apolitical, and he broke that promise almost the instant he walked into the Department of Justice. If you look on the west pediment of the Supreme Court of the United States, just above the entrance, there's a simple yet profound forward phrase, equal justice under law. We have seen over the last four years, a Department of Justice that systematically targeted the political opponents of Joe Biden and Kamala Harris, and that systematically protected his friends and allies. And it is tragic to see the loss of confidence in the American people, in the Department of Justice, and in the FBI.

I would note, I don't think there's an institution in America who has lost more respect from the American people than the FBI has in the last four years. That is a grotesque violation of the obligation of the Department of Justice and the FBI.

So, I want to start with just a very simple if you are confirmed as Attorney General, will you pledge to fairly and faithfully uphold the law regardless of party?

BONDI: So, help me God.

CRUZ: Amen. Look, I want to be clear for folks at home. I don't want a Republican Department of Justice. I don't want a Democrat Department of Justice. I want a Department of Justice that follows the damn law. And I think the American people do too. That shouldn't be too much to expect.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

PAMELA BROWN, CNN HOST: The breaking news coming into CNN, a senior Biden administration official confirming that Hamas has agreed to a hostage release and cease-fire deal.

I want to go straight to senior White House correspondent M.J. Lee with the latest -- M.J.

M.J., what can you tell us about this deal that Hamas has agreed to? All right, M.J. cannot hear us. I'm going to go to Alex Marquardt.

This is a massive deal weeks in the making, Alex.

ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: It certainly is, if not longer, Pam.

We have been waiting for more than 13 months since the last cease-fire deal and since the last time there was an exchange of hostages and prisoners for this moment. It appears that this deal is imminent, if not done already.

We're reporting that Hamas has agreed to the deal. There was certainly an expectation from the Israeli side that they would agree to a deal, all of this, of course, brokered after intensive negotiations with the mediators, the United States, Qatar and Egypt.

So, this is obviously extremely welcome news, after some 14 months of fighting. And what we expect to happen, if indeed this deal goes into effect, is that over the course of some six weeks, we would see more than 30 Israeli hostages released by Hamas and other groups who are holding them in Gaza.

I don't think we had the exact number of Palestinian prisoners who would be released by Israel. And then there are all -- there are a bunch of other different elements that would go into effect. Palestinians would be allowed to go home in the Gaza Strip. More humanitarian aid would get to go in.

But I think the point here, Pam, is that, after weeks of feverish work on the U.S. side with both Biden administration officials and officials from the incoming Trump team working in coordination with each other, they and the other mediators have managed to get the Israelis and Hamas, it appears, across the finish line, where we are going to get a truce, a pause in this fighting.

[11:50:12]

One thing I really want to emphasize is, this does not mean the end of this war. This means a break in this war. Hopefully, this break will last at least six weeks, if not longer. Hopefully, all of these people will come home who are supposed to come home.

But there are big questions about what would happen after this first phase of a cease-fire, which, as it stands now, and this plan has been in place for quite some time since President Biden laid it out in May, this is expected to last around six weeks. So we're still waiting for final word, I believe, from all of the parties, but this certainly seems imminent, if not a done deal already.

BROWN: I want to go back to M.J. Lee at the White House. I believe we're reconnected.

M.J., what can you tell us about this plan?

M.J. LEE, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Pam, according to a senior administration official telling CNN, it is done, it is confirmed, meaning that Hamas has given that final green light, agreeing to the cease-fire and hostages release deal that had been on the table for a while.

And based on all of our reporting, we knew that this really was the final step that all of the parties were waiting for, that it really came down to this group agreeing to the parameters that everybody else had agreed to.

Part of the reason we have been so cautious in our reporting all of this time is precisely that, just that, in the end, it came down to Hamas giving this final green light. And when we have spoken to at least U.S. officials involved in these discussions and with knowledge of the situation, they have always pointed to the fact that it was impossible to make any kind of predictions with certainty, because, at the end of the day, they were dealing with Hamas.

But, again, here we have a confirmation from a senior administration official that Hamas has finally given the green light and there is a deal for a cease-fire in Gaza and for the hostages to be released. This is a deal, as you were talking about just now with Alex, that has been elusive for the Biden administration and for the U.S. for so many months.

We had that initial cease-fire back more than a year ago, around Thanksgiving, two Thanksgiving ago, when a number of hostages came out. That cease-fire ended up being temporary, only lasting a number of days. And, really, since then, U.S. officials have been working to get a second part of the cease-fire in place.

But it had been so, so challenging. There were so many moments throughout the last year-plus where we reported that things looked like they were maybe getting close, that we had reason for optimism, based on our sources and our reporting.

But even in these final days, everybody we had talked to were so careful to almost not get their hopes up too much. I think we should spend a good deal -- amount of time talking about Donald Trump and the incoming president's desire to get this done that had been really so decisive in the end in helping to get this across the finish line.

BROWN: Certainly.

And just for our viewers just to remind you in terms of the numbers, Hamas and its allies hold 94 people taken from Israel on October 7, 2023. The majority or civilians; 34 are confirmed dead, but the number is almost certainly higher than that; 81 are men and 13 women. And there are two under the age of 5.

And, of course, there's going to be phases, as Alex had laid out. Some will be released in the first phase during the expected cease-fire.

I want to go straight to Jeremy Diamond, who is on the ground there in Israel, to get the Israel part of this, because there's a process in Israel, right, Jeremy? Walk us through that.

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, that's exactly right, Pam.

And, first of all, I think it's important to note that, for the last two days, the Israeli government, Israeli government officials who I have been speaking with have been saying, this is in Hamas' hands. We need Hamas to say yes in order to get to a deal. And that is indeed what has now happened.

And so, for all intents and purposes, we do indeed now have an agreement between these parties to go into a cease-fire that is expected to last six weeks, during which you will see 33 Israeli hostages released, hundreds of Palestinian prisoners released from Israeli jails, in exchange, the much-needed entry of humanitarian aid.

But the process that now needs to happen here in Israel in order for this deal to actually become a reality, this agreement will now go from the Israeli prime minister. He will take this agreement before his Security Cabinet, which is a smaller group of his governing coalition, some of his top ministers primarily involved in security affairs.

They will then give an up-or-down vote on this. If it is approved, it will then go to the full Cabinet for approval. And only then will the Israeli government be able to officially sign off on this deal and begin marching towards implementation.

[11:55:09]

There is one additional hurdle before implementation, and that is giving the individuals who were impacted by those Palestinian prisoners who will be released the opportunity to petition the Supreme Court against their release. That is largely a formality.

The Israeli government has enormous leverage, and the prime minister, in particular, has enormous freedom to release those prisoners as it relates to security matters. So that will likely be a 24-hour period that will go by. And that likely takes us most likely to Sunday, which is what I have been told is the most likely date when this deal will actually be implemented on the ground.

That will mean that we will see the first Israeli hostages in more than a year be released as part of a diplomatic agreement here for these hostages to come out of Gaza. You will see the release of Palestinian prisoners from Israeli jails.

And, in addition to that, of course, you will see Israeli jets, Israeli troops on the ground lower their weapons, and for the first time in over a year, you will finally see the guns be silenced here, and the people of Gaza will finally get a much-needed reprieve from the military assault that they have been undergoing over the last year.

BROWN: All right, thank you so much, Jeremy.

I want to go to CNN foreign policy reporter Barak Ravid.

What can you tell us about this deal and when the Hamas prisoners will be released, those held hostage, I should say, and the Palestinian prisoners as well? What more can you tell us about this deal?

BARAK RAVID, CNN POLITICAL AND GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: So, I think one of the most important things that our viewers need to know right now is that there are seven Americans held by Hamas in Gaza.

Two of them are expected to be released in this initial phase of the hostage deal. One of them is U.S. citizen Keith Siegel, that a video of him from captivity was aired a few months ago, and he is in the list for this first phase.

Another U.S. citizen is Sagui Dekel-Chen, another U.S. citizen who is on the list of the 33 hostages expected to be released in this initial phase. And I think what is very interesting is that this deal has been in the making for months, since President Biden laid out his plan, his proposal last May, and U.S. negotiators, Qatari negotiators, Egyptian negotiators, Israeli negotiators have been working on this for months.

I think the breakthrough came when the deal with Hezbollah on the cease-fire in Lebanon happened, because then Hamas in Gaza understood that it has been left alone and that no one is coming to save them. And since then, what I hear from Israeli news officials is, since then, they saw a change in how Hamas is negotiating this deal, and this is how we got to this point.

BROWN: What about Donald Trump's role in all of this? Of course, he had been saying that he wanted a deal made by the time that he was inaugurated, of course, coming up. And he is a popular political figure there in Israel.

Tell us more about that. And, also, it is worth noting here, Barak, that this comes against the backdrop of the U.S. assessment from Secretary Blinken that Hamas has recruited almost as many new militants as it has lost.

RAVID: Yes, so, first, about Donald Trump, I think Donald Trump was an important factor in this deal. His involvement, I think, was the 5 cents to the dollar that was missing.

I think his public statement threatening that there will be hell to pay in the Middle East if there is no deal was extremely important. I think the fact that he and the Biden administration -- I think Joe Biden and Donald Trump did something that I think no U.S. presidents and president-elect ever did.

They worked together during the transition period on a huge diplomatic deal and got it. Biden's envoy Brett McGurk and Trump's envoy Steve Witkoff sat together in the meetings in Doha in the negotiations. They were together in the meeting with Netanyahu and his negotiation team. They were together in a meeting with the emir of Qatar just the other day.

And I think that, because of both sides working together, both sides of the incoming administration, the outgoing administration, working together, this is something that made this deal possible.

BROWN: All right, Barak Ravid, thank you so much for bringing us the latest there.

Again, we are learning the Israeli government and Hamas have agreed to a hostage release and cease-fire deal. Of course, we're waiting to learn more details of that.