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CNN International: Europe Holds Emergency Summit On Ukraine As U.S.-Russia Talks Set For Tuesday in Saudi Arabia; Hezbollah Rejects Israeli Plan To Remain In Lebanon; Netanyahu To Hold Political- Security Cabinet Meeting On Phase Two Of Gaza Ceasefire. Aired 11a-12p ET
Aired February 17, 2025 - 11:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[11:00:00]
LYNDA KINKADE, HOST, "CNN NEWSROOM": Hello, and welcome to our viewers around the world. I'm Lynda Kinkade.
Ahead on CNN Newsroom, U.S. and Russian officials prepare to meet in Saudi Arabia to talk about ending the war in Ukraine. Why is Ukraine not at the table? European allies also left out of court an emergency meeting. We will go live to Paris for the latest. Plus, Hezbollah rejecting Israel's plan to remain in Lebanon with just 24 hours to go to an agreed deadline for their withdrawal. We'll take you live to Jerusalem for a live report. And a deadly storm batters the United States with floods and heavy winds. Now, Americans are preparing for an Arctic blast that could plunge millions of them into freezing conditions.
ANNOUNCER: Live from Atlanta, this is CNN Newsroom with Lynda Kinkade.
KINKADE: Well, this week could mark a crucial moment for Russia's conflict in Ukraine. Right now, Saudi Arabia is preparing to host peace talks between the U.S. and Russia to end the nearly three year- long conflict. But, Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy says that he will not have a seat at that table. U.S. Secretary of State Marco Rubio is in Saudi Arabia where talks are set to begin Tuesday. America's top diplomat is framing the meeting as the first steps of a process to see if Moscow is serious about ending the fighting.
European leaders fear they are being frozen out of peace negotiations and are holding an emergency summit in Paris today over the future of Ukraine and Europe's overall security. UK's Prime Minister Keir Starmer says he is willing to put British troops on the ground in Ukraine to enforce a peace deal if necessary. Russia's Foreign Minister is already implying that Moscow will not make concessions in those talks. Take a listen to Sergey Lavrov's answer to CNN's question in Moscow.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Which territorial concessions, and in general, which compromises is Russia willing to make to achieve such a peace agreement? SERGEY LAVROV, RUSSIAN FOREIGN MINISTER (Interpreted): You want us to have a mere thought of the negotiations on the settlement regarding the fact that some territories still need to be ceded. To cede how, with people, with Russians, without people, with only rare earth metals? If we are still talking about serious diplomacy, it's better to first understand the history of the issue and see why the Russian language is banned in all spheres of life in Ukraine, and why the canonical Ukrainian Orthodox Church has banned them. And here they say the territorial concessions are necessary. For what, so that Russians can now be destroyed like they are now being destroyed in the Kursk region and in other regions of the Russian Federation?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KINKADE: Again, President Zelenskyy will not be at those peace talks in Riyadh, and he is making it clear that he would not accept any decision that's made without Ukrainian involvement.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT (Interpreted): Ukraine will not participate. Ukraine knew nothing about them. Ukraine perceives any negotiations about Ukraine without Ukraine as those with no results. We cannot recognize anything or any agreements about us, without us.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KINKADE: CNN Senior International Correspondent Melissa Bell joins us now live at the Elysee Palace. Good to have you with us, Melissa. So, for the first time, the British Prime Minister is suggesting that the UK is willing to send troops to Ukraine to ensure peace. Who is at this peace summit in Paris right now, and how far will these European leaders go to help Ukraine, given that it seems the U.S. is moving in another direction?
MELISSA BELL, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right. I think that was a great deal of surprise amongst European allies that these talks should be organized as quickly as they've been organized in Riyadh, and that they should have excluded them entirely, and not just the Europeans, of course, but the Ukrainians themselves. Hence this meeting that's taking place here at the Elysee Palace. Several leaders have arrived, Giorgia Meloni of Italy, Keir Starmer of the United Kingdom, a number of other European leaders, the Secretary General of NATO, the presidents of the European Council and Commission, and the idea, with this emergency meeting that, on one hand, French officials have been very keen to suggest is informal. These are kind of meetings that happen all the time, so as not to look too rattled.
But, to be absolutely clear, Lynda, this was only organized yesterday, and has only just begun just now. What we understand is that there has also been a phone call with President Trump by Emmanuel Macron that lasted 20 minutes ahead of this meeting.
[11:05:00] We don't yet know what was said, but one can assume that he will have made the European position clear. They're not happy that they've been excluded from these talks, and they're determined to continue to weigh on the future of Ukraine, not simply by trying to find a way at this meeting, over the next couple of hours, of giving Ukraine some of the much needed security guarantees that it's looking for from its European allies, given its fears too of a peace deal that's being negotiated without them and simply between Americans and Russians.
But, there is also the question of what happens should peace return to Ukraine. What kind of peacekeeping force would be involved? Whether Europeans would contribute troops? As you mentioned, the British Prime Minister has said that the United Kingdom would. Poland's Prime Minister has also suggested that it would be keen to provide troops to any such force. Germany, a little bit more hesitant, suggesting that it would only be in the context where that would happen with the United States.
That question of troop contribution to a post-peace deal, Ukraine, is on the table here today for Europeans to figure out what they can provide, but also, and perhaps more fundamentally, given what the last few days have brought in terms of American pronouncements signaling the end of an era when the United States and European security functioned together and within NATO in sort of lockstep.
The suggestions that we've heard signaled that that has come to an end and that Europe really enters a new era where it's going to have to figure out its own security much more clearly on its own. And so, we're also going to have discussion here today in Paris about the defense spending and what European governments are willing to spend on their defense budgets, on their own security, given that change of messaging coming from Washington, Lynda.
KINKADE: And Melissa, of course, this meeting that's happening in Riyadh tomorrow will involve the new U.S. Secretary of State Marco Rubio and Russia's Foreign Minister. What are the biggest concerns for European leaders, given that they and Ukraine and not at that table?
BELL: Well, the fear is that, given how often the -- as a candidate, Donald Trump signaled his desire to get this war over within 24 hours, he said, given the American since he has taken power, the new American administration's signaling on its desire to get the United States out of this war and to bring peace to Ukraine as quickly as they can, the fear from Europeans, and again, going back to those comments made by the U.S. Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth in Brussels last week that he did not see Ukraine being part of NATO in the future. And remember, that wasn't simply the American position thus far. It was considered really a key piece of leverage going into the negotiations, Russia.
So, to your question, Lynda, the fear of the Europeans is not just that Americans are going to negotiate without them. It's that they're going to negotiate badly without them. They fear that the United States will be too keen to get to a peace fast, and that too many concessions will be made to Russia, excluding not just the interests of the six million Ukrainians currently living under Russia rule, but the security interests of Europeans themselves even outside of Ukraine, Lynda.
KINKADE: All right. Melissa Bell for us in Paris. We will speak again very soon. Good to have you there. Thank you.
And as we were just discussing, U.S. Secretary of State Marco Rubio traveled to Saudi Arabia from Israel just as news emerged that Israel plans to keep some troops in southern Lebanon past Tuesday's deadline for them to withdraw. Hezbollah is reacting angrily, saying, if any Israeli troops remain in southern Lebanon after that deadline, it will be a violation of the Lebanon ceasefire, which was agreed to back in November.
Well, there are also concerns about the ceasefire in Gaza amid a delay in talks to work out phase two of that deal. Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu is sending a team to Cairo today to discuss continued implementation of phase one. It appears from his talks with Rubio over the weekend that his top priority is Iran. Mr. Netanyahu is vowing to, quote, "finish the job against Iran" with the support of U.S. President Donald Trump. Israel and the U.S. accuse Iran of trying to build nuclear weapons, a charge it denies. U.S. intelligence agencies recently warned that Israel will likely attempt to strike key Iran in nuclear sites this year, increasing the risk of a wider regional war.
Well, I want to welcome our Nic Robertson, who joins us from Jerusalem. Good to have you there for us, Nic. So, let's start with the Israeli troops in Lebanon who were meant to withdraw by this deadline tomorrow. That's no longer happening. An Israeli military spokesman saying not only will its forces remain in the country, but that it has also killed another Hamas operative in southern Lebanon. Just take us through the details and the reaction you're seeing in Lebanon.
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NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Yeah. What's happening here, and if we sort of back track a little bit to that ceasefire agreement in November, that expired towards the end of January, and Israel asked the mediators in this, the mechanism, as they call it, which is essentially the United States, to help broker this between Israel and Lebanon.
Back in January, they asked for an extension, and they got an extension, and they were asking for another extension, and there was pushback from the White House, and the residual effect has been that Israel is pulling all of its troops out, except those that they say are a small number of these key five mountain top locations that give them visibility along the border. They say that they're doing that to protect their citizens who live just across the border. There were 60,000 who were evacuated, and the IDF says that most of those 60,000 haven't yet gone home.
Now, ask the IDF, as journalists were today, to give more details about when those troops might pull out. How many troops there are there, etc.? They wouldn't give details about that. But, what they did say is, when the Lebanese army is ready, as it already has done in many places along the border, to fill in behind where the IDF pulls out, and the Lebanese army's responsibility, they say, is to keep Hezbollah out and away from the border, which the IDF say the Lebanese army has by and large been doing well. When they're ready to take over these five positions, they will then pull back. But, as you said, very clear pushback from Hezbollah.
The Speaker of the Lebanese parliament, just last week, Nabih Berri, said, when this idea was mooted about the five posts, he said that's not acceptable. He pushed back, not just from him speaking personally, but for the whole of Lebanon. So, it is far from what was agreed, but the Israelis are framing this as something that they have agreement on with the mechanism that seems to imply they're talking about the United States there, clearly not with the Lebanese, though.
KINKADE: And just quickly, Nic, we know that Netanyahu is holding this security cabinet meeting right now to discuss the second phase of the ceasefire with regards to Gaza. He has vowed to finish the job, but there is a lot of skepticism as to what that means, given his stated goal of wiping out Hamas. What are the expectations?
ROBERTSON: Yeah, and I think Prime Minister Netanyahu has come under a lot of pressure from U.S. officials this weekend, not just Marco Rubio, in the more than three hours of meetings they had together, but Steve Witkoff, the President Trump's special envoy to the Middle East, both appearing to pressure Netanyahu to a move to phase two. Look, phase two discussions, which is that phase, much harder than phase one, which is the phase that allows the two sides to get to the end of the war, and that's a problem for Netanyahu, because there are members of his government that are saying, no, continue the war. They want to continue the fight against Hamas.
So, there is that sort of internal political dynamic that appears perhaps to have been part of the reason that Prime Minister Netanyahu hasn't accelerated the phase two talk so far, but he is saying that after the discussion tonight of the security cabinet, the mediators that he has already sent to Cairo to have discussions on phase one, he will allow them to talk about phase two.
But, as you absolutely rightly say, the two positions are completely opposed. President Trump, Prime Minister Netanyahu, say absolutely Hamas has no place in the future of Gaza, not militarily, not politically. And Hamas are saying, actually, we're not going to put down our weapons. We are part of the future. We're not leaving, two diametrically opposed positions. How do you get to a phase two agreement that's literally supposed to come into play in just a couple of weeks when that distance exists? It's very hard to see how that's going to be achieved, but that's where things stand right now.
KINKADE: Nic Robertson staying across for all of it from Jerusalem. Good to have you with us, as always. Thank you.
We're staying on all these developments. Our next guest says Benjamin Netanyahu is hoping to extend phase one of the Gaza ceasefire and thereby put off phase two indefinitely. Gregg Carlstrom is a Middle East Correspondent for The Economist. He is also author of "How Long Will Israel Survive?: The Threat From Within". Good to have you with us. GREGG CARLSTROM, MIDDLE EAST CORRESPONDENT, THE ECONOMIST, & AUTHOR,
"HOW LONG WILL ISRAEL SURVIVE? THE THREAT FROM WITHIN": Good to be here.
KINKADE: So, let's start on phase one and phase two, whether or not that will even happen, because right now, we know that an Israeli negotiating team is on its way to Cairo to discuss how to simply keep phase one on track in terms of this ceasefire deal with Gaza. Meanwhile, Netanyahu, this hour, is holding a cabinet security meeting about the second phase of this deal.
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Do you see a second phase even coming into existence? What do you see? How do you see this playing out?
CARLSTROM: I'm skeptical, Lynda, of getting to phase two. I think phase one was easy in a way, because the incentives on both sides were aligned. Israel wanted a deal that would get some of its hostages out of Gaza. Hamas wanted a deal that would give it a break from fighting. So, it's easy to get to an agreement when both sides have their own reasons to want that agreement.
The problem with phase two, as Nic said, they want different things. Israel wants to remove Hamas. Hamas obviously doesn't want to be removed, but it's also a question of the political incentives, I think, for the leadership on both sides, for Netanyahu, this worry about what it will mean for his governing coalition, and for Hamas, a worry, at least amongst some members of the Hamas leadership, that if they go to phase two, if they release the remaining hostages, they're effectively giving up the last of their leverage over Israel, and once they do that, they have nothing with which to prevent Israel from resuming the war at some later date. So, how do you craft some kind of an agreement that satisfies those competing demands on both sides? That's very, very hard to do.
KINKADE: And that's key here, really, that leverage they've got with those hostages, which is the reason we're seeing this drip, drip, drip of hostage release deals, only a couple, maybe three every Saturday we've seen for the last few weekends, three hostages released in exchange for hundreds of Palestinians that have been held prisoner by Israel. If Hamas is to give away to send back all those hostages as part of this second phase, then what?
CARLSTROM: They're hoping for some sort of an internationally guaranteed agreement whereby there would be parties, perhaps the United States, perhaps Arab countries, that would guarantee that Israel wasn't going to resume the war. And I think there is reason to be skeptical of that. I mean, the ceasefire in Lebanon, going back to the Israeli withdrawal from there, that was meant to be guaranteed as well by a group of five countries that were meant to oversee compliance, but they have not been able to, or are not willing to push the Israeli government to withdraw.
And I think, we've seen in Gaza. We've been talking for more than a year about this question of the day after of what's going to happen after the war, who is going to control Gaza, and there still are no good alternatives. There are no good proposals, be it from Western countries or from Arab countries, or who is going to govern Gaza after the war. And so, I think the idea that you're going to have some internationally guaranteed agreement that would bring in a new administration, but also give Hamas guarantees, it's, I think, unfortunately, quite unrealistic.
KINKADE: The new U.S. Secretary of State Marco Rubio will meet with the Saudi Crown Prince in Saudi Arabia. He talking about the Gaza ceasefire. Is the U.S. really serious about taking control of the Gaza Strip, and is that likely to come up in that conversation?
CARLSTROM: I'm not sure anyone knows the answer to that, to be honest. I mean, I speak to some people in Washington, not all of whom are Trump supporters, who say, listen, don't take this seriously, this crazy idea of taking over Gaza, of ethnically cleansing two million people. This is not meant to be a serious proposal. It's meant to coerce Arab states into coming up with their own coherent plan for who is going to govern Gaza after the war. And certainly, if you listened to Rubio, to Steve Witkoff, the President's Middle East envoy, they have not been enthusiastic in their support for this idea. They almost seem to be walking it back or distancing themselves from it.
So, there are some people who argue this is just a negotiating ploy, but at the same time, it's something the President has come back to over and over again in his public comments. It doesn't just seem to have been an off-the-cuff comment, and there are concerns, I think, both amongst Israelis and Palestinians, that these comments might, on one hand, give Netanyahu an excuse not to go to phase two of the ceasefire. He can say it's a moot point. There is no need to discuss a permanent end to the war, because Gaza is about to be de-populated. And it also might make Hamas reluctant to negotiate, because they're going to say, well, if the end point of this is expelling two million people from Gaza, there is no reason to negotiate anything.
So, whatever he might be trying to achieve by pushing regional parties to come up with a plan, there is also a good chance this winds up being, I think, counterproductive.
KINKADE: Gregg Carlstrom, great to get your analysis. Thanks so much for joining us.
Well, the Vatican is reporting that Pope Francis has a polymicrobial infection of his respiratory tract. He was admitted to hospital in Rome last week for tests related to bronchitis, and the Vatican now says those tests indicate a, quote, "complex clinical picture".
We want to bring in CNN Vatican Correspondent Christopher Lamb for the latest. He joins us in Rome outside the Gemelli hospital. Good to have you there for us, Christopher.
[11:20:00]
So, a complex clinical picture, perhaps not unusual for someone in their late 80s, but this is the Pope we're talking about. What more can you tell us about his condition? CHRISTOPHER LAMB, CNN VATICAN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Lynda, the Vatican explaining today that the situation of -- for the Pope is much more complex than initially stated. The Vatican saying that this infection is a polymicrobial one, which means there are a complex of factors involved in it, including viral and bacterial and perhaps other factors, although the Vatican not saying what those are.
This is the fourth day of Pope Francis hospitalization. He came here on Friday to the Gemelli hospital, behind me, because he was having serious difficulties breathing. He was having problems speaking for long periods of time. Indeed, on the day that he was hospitalized, I saw the Pope, and it was clear at that moment that he was finding it difficult to talk, and in recent weeks, he has been asking aides to read his addresses, and he has clearly had breathing problems.
Now, we don't know how long the Pope is going to stay in hospital. The Vatican has not given a clear timetable. But, the Wednesday general audience that the Pope holds each week has been canceled. He did not lead the weekly Sunday Angelus prayer for only the second time in his almost 12-year pontificate, and the doctors are saying that he needs to rest and try to recover.
But, clearly, with this update from the Vatican, a more complex picture is emerging, and the Vatican saying further that the treatment has been amended. This is the second time that the treatment that the Pope is undergoing has been shifted. So, another sign of the complexity of the situation and the severe infection that the Pope is battling. Lynda.
KINKADE: We wish the Pope all the very best.
Christopher Lamb, good to have you there for us in Rome. Thank you.
Well, still to come, the U.S. agency that controls air traffic is on the radar for a potential overhaul. A team of engineers from Elon Musk's SpaceX now plan to visit the FAA Air Control Command Center. We will have details on that next. Plus, another agency, the U.S. Department of Education, is telling schools nationwide they could lose federal funding if they don't comply with a new directive. So, what is it and why it's likely to face legal challenges? We'll have that story next.
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KINKADE: Welcome back. The Trump administration has begun firing hundreds of probationary workers at the Federal Aviation Administration, according to their union. At the same time, the FAA is getting ready for an inspection of its Air Traffic Control Command Center.
[11:25:00]
Elon Musk's SpaceX engineers will visit the facility Monday, as the newly appointed Transportation Secretary calls for assistance from American high tech companies. The overhaul comes after that fatal collision near Washington, D.C.'s Reagan airport. CNN's Pete Muntean has the latest.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PETE MUNTEAN, CNN AVIATION CORRESPONDENT: The latest development is now engineers working for Elon Musk will be visiting the FAA's Air Traffic Control Command Center on Monday. That, plus these firings, are truly uncharted territory for the Federal Aviation Administration, which oversees an air travel system that is stressed to the max right now. Remember, the FAA's air traffic control equipment is aging, and the system that delivers mandatory pilot safety alerts failed just days after that crash that killed 67 people over Washington, D.C. It hasn't even been three weeks since that crash, and DOGE has had its eye on the FAA ever since.
Now the concern is that when these federal workers return from the long weekend on Tuesday, they could be barred from FAA facilities. The workers impacted here are members of a union called PASS. That is the Professional Aviation Safety Specialists union, part of the AFL-CIO. Union President Dave Spero tells me, between 200 and 300 FAA workers started receiving firing notices from the Trump administration late on Friday. These are the workers who help maintain the critical infrastructure that keeps the air traffic control system operating. He says, not only were these workers fired without cause, but that this was hardly a surgical move by the Trump administration that is dangerous to public safety and especially unconscionable in the aftermath of the crashes that have been grabbing headlines over the last month.
It's important to note here that these are probationary employees, meaning they've been on the job for less than a year, so, the next generation of FAA employees at an agency that has a hard time keeping up with retirements and attrition. So far, the FAA has not returned my request for comment. But, we do know this from Transportation Secretary Sean Duffy, who announced the visit by Musk's team. He posted on X that President Trump is ordering a new air traffic control system and called for help, not just from private industry, but any high tech American developer in overhauling the FAA.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KINKADE: Our thanks to Pete Muntean there.
Well, the Trump administration's Department of Education is threatening to end federal funding for any school that takes account of race in its decisions affecting students. The department's acting Assistant Secretary for Civil Rights wrote a letter Friday to education officials across the U.S. The letter says schools have, quote, "toxically indoctrinated students with a false premise that the United States is built upon systematic and structural racism and advanced discriminatory policies and practices."
As CNN Rene Marsh reports, the broad directive is almost certain to face legal challenges.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
RENE MARSH, CNN U.S. NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: From pre-school to colleges and universities, the Trump administration's Department of Education is threatening schools across the country to stop considering race in almost every aspect of student life, or face losing federal funding, and they are giving these schools 14 days to do it. It's outlined in a letter that the agency sent out on Friday night. It states that if a school treats a person of one race differently than it treats another person, that violates federal law.
Now, this pertains to admissions, hiring, promotion, compensation, financial aid, scholarships, prizes, administrative support, discipline, housing, graduation ceremonies, and all aspects of student academic and campus life, according to this letter. And this mandate is the Trump administration's sweeping interpretation of the Supreme Court's 2023 ruling in Students for Fair Admissions vs. Harvard, which specifically struck down affirmative action in college admissions. Now, the administration is trying to use that ruling to justify extending it to any and all race conscious spending activities and programming on school campuses.
Now, this will certainly face legal challenges. We're already hearing from Democratic members of Congress, Senator Patty Murray saying in a statement, "There is simply no authority or basis for Trump to impose such a mandate. In fact, federal laws prohibit any President from telling schools and colleges what to teach, including the Every Student Succeeds Act that I negotiated with Republicans." Again, the legal fight likely to end up in court on this policy.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KINKADE: Our thanks to Rene Marsh.
Well, still to come, America's top diplomat is in Saudi Arabia preparing for tomorrow's crucial discussions on Ukraine. Details ahead on how European leaders are reacting to President Trump's push for peace talks.
[11:30:00]
Plus, large parts of the U.S. dealing with deadly massive flooding, and on top of it, the central U.S. is preparing for an Arctic blast. We'll have that coming up next too.
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KINKADE: Welcome back. You're watching CNN Newsroom. I'm Lynda Kinkade. Here are some of the international headlines we're watching today.
Germans will vote next Sunday in what's expected to be a closely fought election with immigration and the economy two of the top issues. The four main candidates to be chancellor took part in a TV debate for the first time Sunday. The conservative Christian Democratic Union party leads the polls. CDU leader Friedrich Merz says he will move to Germany to the right, promising to crack down on immigration and cut taxes, but he rejects the hardline positions of the far right Alternative for German party. The AfD is second in the polls.
Health officials in West Texas are struggling to contain a measles outbreak. The number of cases doubled in the past week to 48, mostly involving children from ages five to 17. The outbreak is in a county where a relatively high proportion of school age children have not received the measles, mumps, and rubella vaccine. Measles is a highly contagious, airborne illness. In some cases, it can result in blindness, pneumonia, swelling of the brain, and more rarely, death.
The U.S. Department of Agriculture has issued a conditional license for a bird flu vaccine to use in chickens. It comes amid an outbreak that's devastated poultry flocks, contributing to the rising price of eggs. It's a type of vaccine that previously has not been used because it brings possible complications, but the urgency of combating bird flu has increased, as the disease spreads to other animals. More than 150 million birds have been affected since the current outbreak began in 2022.
Well, U.S. Secretary of State Marco Rubio and other top U.S. officials are in Saudi Arabia, as they prepare to meet with a Russian delegation tomorrow. Well, they will discuss how to end the nearly three-year conflict in Ukraine. Before those discussions happen, European leaders are in Paris today holding an emergency summit on Ukraine and the continent's security.
CNN Senior White House reporter Kevin Liptak is tracking this crucial moment and is following the story from our Washington D.C. bureau. Good to have you with us, Kevin. So, the U.S. has said it will potentially support a deal where Ukraine is forced to give up a sizable amount of territory. Right now, the U.S. seems to be prioritizing its one-on-one talks with Russia.
[11:35:00]
What's been said about the criticism with regards to the Trump administration having these sort of talks without consulting all relevant parties?
KEVIN LIPTAK, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Well, when you listen to some of Trump's advisors, they suggest that these talks, which are slated to begin tomorrow in Saudi Arabia, are just the beginning, and we heard from the State Department spokesman just a few hours ago, who said that the goal of these talks was to discern whether Russia was serious about reaching peace in Ukraine, and that they would move forward from there to start negotiations in earnest.
But, in some ways, that does contrast which -- with the way that President Trump is describing these conversations. He has instructed his teams to, in his words, start negotiations immediately to begin -- bring this conflict to an end. And certainly, he has made very explicit that he wants this war to end very, very quickly.
So, you do hear sort of two separate things from two sides of the Trump administration. It was interesting to listen to Secretary of State Marco Rubio this
weekend describe why President Zelenskyy and why Ukraine will not be at the table for these specific talks. Listen to what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MARCO RUBIO, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: If it's real negotiations and we're not there yet, but if that were to happen, Ukraine will have to be involved, because they're the one that were invaded, and the Europeans will have to be involved because they have sanctions on Putin and Russia as well, and they've contributed to this effort. We're just not there yet.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LIPTAK: Now, President Zelenskyy has said very specifically that these talks will not yield any results if Ukraine is not represented at the table.
And no matter how you look at it, this is a difference from how the Biden administration was approaching this conflict. President Biden said repeatedly that nothing about Ukraine would be discussed without Ukraine partaking in those talks. Zelenskyy is concerned when he is watching these talks unfold about the security guarantees for his country. That has been something that he said are necessary if he is to discuss a brokered end to this conflict.
The other question, and you heard Rubio reference it there is, what role will the Europeans play in these talks? We heard Rubio, elsewhere in this interview, say that if the opportunities present themselves, that a broader conversation, in his words, could be had between the U.S., Ukraine, Russia and the Europeans.
But certainly, when you look at what President Macron is doing in Paris today, they aren't waiting for that opportunity to arise themselves. They are discussing amongst themselves how to proceed. We also learned that Macron spoke to President Trump just before that conversation was set to begin. Of course, the conflict in Ukraine is just one of the two conflicts that Rubio will be discussing in Saudi Arabia. The other, of course, is the conflict in Gaza. Overshadowing all of that is President Trump's plan, as he stated two weeks ago, to clear out Gaza, remove the Palestinians, and redevelop it. What Rubio, I think, is looking to ascertain from his counterparts in Saudi Arabia is what their plan would be to redevelop the enclave and bring the fighting to an end.
KINKADE: A lot to stay across. Kevin Liptak for us in D.C. Good to have you with us. Thank you.
Well, I want to get some more perspective from Matthew Schmidt, who is a former Professor of Strategic and Operational Planning for the U.S. Army Command and General Staff College. He is currently an Associate Professor of National Security at the University of New Haven. Good to have you with us, Matthew.
MATTHEW SCHMIDT, ASSOC. PROFESSOR OF NATIONAL SECURITY, UNIVERSITY OF NEW HAVEN: Good to be here, Lynda.
KINKADE: So, Donald Trump campaigned that he would end Russia's war in Ukraine on day one of entering office. It's now been several weeks. There seems to be more confusion than ever as to how that could happen, especially given Ukraine is not at the table of these talks, certainly not front and center of negotiations. Right?
SCHMIDT: Right. I think it's important to remember that this started when the Ukrainians revolted against a corrupt and traitorous government that was handing away their sovereignty to Putin. And what's happening now by not putting Ukraine in these talks is essentially the achievement of Putin's original aims, which is to control the political future of Kyiv. If you're not in these shaping talks, setting the rules of the negotiation, then you're really not setting the way the game is going to play out. These are the important talks.
KINKADE: Yeah, exactly. Russia, of course, was isolated, but Trump does like strong man. He -- not only is he willing to have his team hold these bilateral talks with Russia, he wants to normalize relations with Russia. He wants to bring Russia back into the G8. Ukraine's leader was asked about Trump's talks with Putin. I just want to play some sound of what he had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KRISTEN WELKER, NBC NEWS MODERATOR, 'MEET THE PRESS': Do you think President Trump is negotiating in good faith?
ZELENSKYY: I hope so. I hope so. Yes, I count on it.
[11:40:00]
I think he is really a little bit scared about President Trump, and I think the President has this chance that he is strong, and I think that really he can push Putin.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KINKADE: I mean, you can certainly see the worry in Zelenskyy's eyes, but he is saying that he is hopeful. By contrast, we've heard from European leaders who say they're worried. They are concerned that Donald Trump might be making a dirty deal with Putin. What could that entail?
SCHMIDT: It could entail really subjugating Ukraine to Putin's political power, especially if that money that is sanctioned in Europe, that 300 and some billion dollars, doesn't come back to Ukraine, especially if war crimes trials aren't somehow put in place. There is some kind of sanction for the taking of Ukrainian children. These are all things that I think are unlikely to happen, because Putin will refuse them, and the interest here on the American side is for the American President to pull out some deal, to look like he is gone to the table and created this settlement. Right? This is as much about what the optics are for Washington as anyone else, KINKADE: And the U.S. is being criticized right now for making these unilateral decisions and these conversations with regards to not only the future of Ukraine, but also the future of Gaza. Can any real peace be achieved without key stakeholders at the table?
SCHMIDT: No, absolutely not. You have to get to the root of the problems here, and you simply can't do that if you don't have the people that have been involved in these wars, that have been suffering the losses, able to come together and establish a just peace. Unjust peace is peace -- and unjust won't last. It's just that simple. We know that from history. And so, you can stitch something together here. You can say you've ended a war, but you're just pushing the problem down several years.
KINKADE: And European leaders right now had to scramble to hold this emergency meeting in Paris, because they too have been left out of the talks regarding Ukraine. We've heard from the British Prime Minister, who said that Britain would be willing to send in peacekeeping troops. We've also heard from Poland, are willing to do the same. Just how far do you think some of these European nations will go to help Ukraine going forward?
SCHMIDT: I think they'll go quite far. I think that they see this as an investment in their own security. The problem is, is that, as you see major NATO countries doing this unilaterally, it's fundamentally weakening the fabric of the alliance, as an alliance, as an institution, which I think is part of Washington's goal here, but it's also part of Moscow's goal. If they can split the alliance and force countries to make these individual choices, then they weaken the total strength of the group.
KINKADE: Matthew Schmidt, great to get your analysis. Appreciate your time. Thank you.
SCHMIDT: My pleasure.
KINKADE: Well, the death toll rises following the powerful storms in the southern and eastern parts of the United States, and more severe weather is on the way.
CNN Meteorologist Derek Van Dam is tracking the forecast. Derek.
DEREK VAN DAM, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Yeah. Lynda, the Arctic air is descending over the areas that have been hit hardest by this weekend's flash flooding. To make matters worse, a snow storm is coming for the same areas. I'll break it down in detail coming up after a short break.
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[11:45:00]
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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) TONY ROBERTS, CORONER, HART COUNTY, KENTUCKY: And it had rolled over
upside down. Rescuers did rescue the seven-year-old out, didn't rescue her, but retrieved her out of the vehicle, but could not get to the mom because the water was coming up so fast.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KINKADE: Well, that was Hart County Coroner talking about Saturday's tragic accident, a mother and her seven-year-old daughter killed after their vehicle was swept away by flooding. 11 people have died in Kentucky after torrential rain swept in. Another person was killed in Georgia and another in West Virginia.
The deadly winter storm swept across the U.S. over the weekend, hundreds of thousands of households losing power. Another round of brutally cold temperatures is forecast, as well as an Arctic blast taking aim at the south, central and northeast of the U.S.
For more on the impact of that weather system, I want to go to our Danny Freeman, who is in Salem, Virginia. We can see those flood waters behind you, Danny, and certainly, those floods have devastated several states, and we've heard those horrific stories of people being swept away in the flood water. What can you tell us?
DANNY FREEMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, Lynda, and I'm glad you put it that way, because this really is a multi-state disaster over here, not just Virginia, where we are right now, but also in Kentucky, also Tennessee having a tremendous amount of flooding issues. And of course, we just learned in the past hour or so that one person died in West Virginia.
I want to show you where we are right now, and just kind of the intensity of what we're talking about. We're in Salem, Virginia, right outside of Roanoke. This is the Roanoke River right here. The bridge we're standing on right here, Lynda, was, over the weekend, completely covered by this water. You can see, actually, there are icicles where the water was formed over the weekend. City crews just came by to remove parts of this railing of this guard rail that were damaged because the water and debris were coming over the side here. They've been working to clean up. Thankfully, Virginia was not as hard hit as some of the other states
that we've been talking about. Virginia had about 200,000 customers lose power, as you noted. They had about 150 water rescues. But, as of this point, we have not heard of any death or injury here.
However, in Kentucky, as you noted, we confirmed with the governor earlier today that there have been 11 deaths and there were over 1,000 water rescues over the weekend too, specifically, in Kentucky. The governor of Kentucky speaking in a press conference just moments ago, saying that this is still, at this point, a search and rescue operation. Now, the good news for much of the region is that a lot of the water levels have been receding, including right here in Virginia, this Roanoke River. You can see, it's much lower than it was certainly during the height of the flooding.
However, particularly in Kentucky, the water levels from some of the rivers are still of concern right now. So, local and state officials are really urging residents in these areas to not drive through flood water if you see it. Don't try to get through it. Don't try to brave it, because that's, unfortunately, what has resulted in a lot of the deaths and injury that we have seen across this multi-state area.
And the last thing I'll note, Lynda, for you, is that it's windy out here, it is cold out here, and it's a preview of what is going to come in the next couple of days, more storms and more winter weather. Lynda.
KINKADE: Yeah. Danny, I'm wondering about how the states and authorities are preparing for that another winter storm system that's moving through, given that they are still trying to clean up after the last one.
FREEMAN: Listen, it's a very intentional effort. The public officials here, again, from all the different states in this area, say that they are prepared. They're ready. But, it's not just what's coming in a few days, Lynda, which is, again, that cold, wintry weather, which I know you're going to speak with Derek Van Dam about in just a second, but it's also what has happened prior to this flooding, especially in these areas of southwestern Virginia and eastern Kentucky. A lot of these communities are still facing the impacts of Hurricane Helene, which came through this area not too long ago. So, it's clean up, and then these floods, and then the preparation for more storms ahead, Lynda.
KINKADE: All right. Danny Freeman in Salem, Virginia. Good to have you there for us. Thank you.
Well, I want to bring in CNN Meteorologist Derek Van Dam. He joins us from the Weather Center in Atlanta. Good to see you, Derek. So, we're going to get another blast of this Arctic cold air. Just how cold are we talking?
DAM: Yeah. This is going to be an Arctic air mass that's going to descend over some of the hardest hit areas which you're seeing flood across this multistate impact region -- impacted region that Danny just pointed out so rightfully.
[11:50:00]
So, this is out of Tennessee and levee broke. It resulted in this flooding of the neighborhood. You can see just the water creeping up into these homes and just causing so much havoc. And I picked out this image in particular. This is out of the state of Virginia. This is called a swift water action area, right? So, this is an area where the first responders stage themselves along the sides of a river or a slide of a flooded area. They're on dry ground. But, here is the boat launch that they have. So, they bring their personnel out to do wellness checks, to do the swift water rescues, and then they bring those people back to dry land where they're located here. So, this is a staging ground for these first responders, and that is how they get to people so quickly, along some of those overturned river banks.
So, what's coming? It's the cold air, and this is going to make matters that much worse, and it's going to work in unison with a winter storm at the same time. So, notice the area that we're talking about here, Kentucky, Tennessee, Virginia, West Virginia, the areas that have been hardest hit by the flooding, could have record low temperatures over the coming days. In fact, we've got this Arctic air mass that's descending. We've got extreme cold alerts in place for many throughout the central parts of the country, but believe me, it is heading eastward. And preemptively, we've already have winter storm watches over much of the state of Kentucky, where we're reporting some of the deaths out of this recent flood event. And then, that is just going to complicate efforts there.
So, right now, we have five river gages across the state of Kentucky that are under major flood stage. So, current active flooding. That is why the governor of Kentucky talked on our TV station just a few moments ago, and in the press briefing that he gave that this is still an active search and recovery effort because of what is actually happening on the ground right now. The rivers are still cresting. They are still flooding. And then, to complicate matters worse will be the Arctic air and the additional snow that will fall on top of these flooded areas. That is going to make this a very difficult circumstance for the people ahead. But, look at that Arctic air, Lynda. This is really going to be a difficult next couple of days.
KINKADE: Yeah. We wish them all the very best. Stay warm as well. Derek Van Dam, thank you so much.
Well, still ahead, one more thing. Saturday Night Live celebrates 50 years on TV. Some of the highlights you don't want to miss, right after this short break.
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KINKADE: Before we go, one more thing. The U.S. TV series Saturday Night Live celebrated its no-holds-barred comedy routines during its 50th anniversary celebration.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Rudy, you're America's mayor. You're beloved all across the country. This is your big shot. What are you going to do with it?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Simple. I am throwing away my shot. Election comes, but (inaudible) is going to rise up.
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[11:55:00]
KINKADE: From ridiculing former Trump attorney Rudy Giuliani and other politicians to reviving popular SNL skips. The program also honored its legendary cast members and featured a wacky tribute song by alum Adam Sandler. Take a listen.
(VIDEO PLAYING) KINKADE: Well, SNL's 50 the Anniversary Special was part reflection,
part reunion, and part celebration that began Friday night with a concert.
Well, thanks so much for spending part of your day with me. I'm Lynda Kinkade. Stay with CNN. One World is up next, and I'll be back in two hours with much more news.
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