Return to Transcripts main page
CNN Newsroom
CNN International: U.S. Warns China Over Taiwan Drills; Canada's Last-Minute Tariff Plea; Florida Holds Special Elections; Trump's First Election Test Of His New Term; Trump To Unveil Liberation Day Tariffs; Canada To Respond To Trump's Tariffs; Justice Dept. Seeks Death Penalty For Mangione; Gen Z Candidate Runs For Office; Democrat Marathon Senate Floor Speech. Aired 6-7p ET
Aired April 01, 2025 - 18:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[18:00:00]
JIM SCIUTTO, CNN HOST: Hello and welcome to our viewers joining us from all over the world. I'm Jim Sciutto in Washington.
And just ahead this hour, the White House warns China over military exercises in the Taiwan Straits surrounding Taiwan, just days after the U.S. defense secretary, Pete Hegseth, vowed to counter China's aggression.
On the eve of President Trump's sweeping tariff announcement, Canada's foreign minister tells me there is still time to change course.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MELANIE JOLY, CANADIAN MINISTER FOR FOREIGN AFFAIRS: We didn't start this trade war, the U.S. administration did. And they can reverse course, but they can only reverse course if the American people themselves say it's enough.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: U.S. Department of Justice says that accused CEO killer, Luigi Mangione. will face the death penalty if he's found guilty of murder. His lawyers called that decision, quote, "barbaric."
And it is election night in two corners of America where key races in Wisconsin and Florida are set to test the Trump agenda. We also hear from a Gen Z Democrat hoping to cause an upset inside the Democratic Party in the midterms. That conversation and plenty more coming up.
We begin with rising tensions in the Taiwan Strait. China has launched large-scale military exercises surrounding the island, deploying ships, aircraft, and artillery. The Chinese military described the latest drills as, quote, "a stern warning and forceful deterrence against Taiwan independence separatist forces."
This comes only days after U.S. Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth vowed to counter China's aggression in the region while visiting U.S. allies. The White House says it is opposing any unilateral actions to alter the status quo with Taiwan. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KAROLINE LEAVITT, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: The president is emphasizing the importance of maintaining peace in the Taiwan Strait, encouraging the peaceful resolution of these cross-strait issues, reiterating our opposition to any unilateral attempts to change the status quo by force or coercion that is directly from the national security adviser.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCIUTTO: Our Ivan Watson has the details.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: This is the first time this year that the Chinese military has conducted these types of maneuvers around the self-governing island of Taiwan. The announcement came from China's Eastern Theater Command saying that this was a serious warning and powerful containment of what it claims is Taiwan Independence separatist forces that all four branches of the Chinese military are involved in these maneuvers.
Now, Beijing, of course, views Taiwan as effectively a renegade province and is very angry about any moves towards autonomy coming from Taiwan. But typically, in the past when it has carried out these types of naval and aerial maneuvers around Taiwan, it has been pegged to some type of event such as the inauguration last year of the Taiwanese president, Lai Ching-te.
This time it, there doesn't seem to be an obvious trigger, but some of the videos that were put out by the Chinese military took direct aim at the Taiwanese president, this one accusing him, depicting him of being a cartoon parasite and accusing him of consorting with foreign powers.
Of course, the Taiwanese government has condemned this. A statement coming out from the head of the National Security Council in Taiwan called this reckless and irresponsible, saying it came without justification and that it violates international law. The Taiwanese defense minister has indicated that it appears there is a Chinese aircraft carrier group operating off the southeast coast of Taiwan right now.
And we've heard from a senior security official in the Taiwanese government suggesting some possible reasons why the officials there think this has been the time for these joint Chinese military maneuvers around the island. And one argument has been that it follows a recent visit by the U.S. defense secretary, Pete Hegseth, to Asia, where he visited the Philippines and Japan, two close allies. And he talked about what he claimed was communist China's threat to the region, and they need to build up deterrence among U.S. allies here in the region.
Ivan Watson, CNN, Hong Kong.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
[18:05:00]
SCIUTTO: What's the significance of these exercises? Joining me now, retired U.S. Army General Ben Hodges. Thanks so much, sir. Appreciate you taking the time.
LT. GEN. BEN HODGES, U.S. ARMY (RET.): Thank you, Jim.
SCIUTTO: So, first on the nature of these exercises, because one commonality among the most recent ones by China is that they are designed, it seems, to surround Taiwan, this boa constrictor scenario that some talk about as opposed to a D-Day sort of invasion that if China were to take military action, it would attempt to blockade and cut off Taiwan to force it into submission. I mean, do you see these exercises as a rehearsal for that kind of operation?
HODGES: Yes, I think you've described it well. The blockade sort of scenario seems a more plausible and feasible approach for China should they decide to use force to take over Taiwan. A more straightforward, amphibious operation to invade Taiwan is extremely difficult, and I don't know that they could do that successfully.
SCIUTTO: You heard from the White House today, quite similar language that successive U.S. administrations have used, which is to say, we oppose any disruption to the status quo by use of force. We have not heard President Trump say what President Biden did a number of times, which is that the U.S. would intervene militarily if China were to invade, a step forward from the strategic ambiguity that had been standard prior.
I wonder, is China calculating that Trump, given his broader retreat from military engagements abroad, would not act militarily if China were to take military action itself?
HODGES: Well, I think that's certainly possible. I imagine that Beijing has been watching the last couple of years to see if we were serious in Europe and helping Ukraine to defend sovereignty, to defend freedom of navigation and the Black Sea, for example. So, these are the kind of things that are at stake. Is the United States committed to actually doing that? And we've shown in Ukraine that we weren't necessarily. So, I think that raises the risk of China, perhaps making a miscalculation.
Of course, we've got allies in the region. But you know, when you put tariffs on your allies in the region, that also gives them pause. And then finally, I think that the Signal chat group situation revealed a level of carelessness that I think will also give our allies in the region pause.
SCIUTTO: Yes. Is it conceivable, right, that when we talk of our treaty allies in the region, Japan and South Korea, that they'll calculate the U.S. commitment to the defense is at least not what it used to be and therefore, that they need to take perhaps even the step of acquiring nuclear weapons to defend themselves, that the alliances aren't what they used to count on, so they have to, in effect, be on their own?
HODGES: Well, certainly it's the duty and responsibility of every government in a sovereign nation to protect their people and protect their strategic interests. It's a shame that nations are now starting to calculate that maybe they have to have their own nuclear weapons, whether it's in the Pacific or in Europe. That's the last thing that we want, is to see proliferation.
But at the end of the day, if they are not 100 percent certain that we can provide that deterrent, then of course they will have to find other ways to protect themselves.
SCIUTTO: Indeed. Let's hope it doesn't get to that. General Ben Hodges, appreciate the conversation.
HODGES: Thanks a lot.
SCIUTTO: Well, it is election day here in the United States with the first major contests -- contest since President Trump took office. In Wisconsin, voters will elect a judge to the State Supreme Court in a battle that will decide the court's ideological bend, it's majority. It's the most extensive judicial contest -- expensive rather judicial contest in U.S. history thanks to, well, billionaire Elon Musk. Seen handing out million-dollar checks to voters to try to encourage them to come out to support the Trump-backed candidate. Liberal mega donors, they have also opened their wallets, less so than Musk.
In Florida, you have two Republican leaning districts voting to replace former Congressman Mike Waltz, now the national security adviser, of course, to Trump and Matt Gaetz.
Joining me now is Margaret Talev. She's a senior contributor at Axios. So, let's talk about these two races differently because -- I mean, the Florida races, these are -- they should be fairly solid Republican districts. So, let's start on Wisconsin, much tighter race there. What are the stakes for the Supreme Court in Wisconsin?
[18:10:00]
MARGARET TALEV, SENIOR CONTRIBUTOR, AXIOS: Well, this is a really big deal. Right now, marginally, by little edge liberals -- liberal judges control the majority of the Wisconsin State Supreme Court, and we're watching now nationally and in Washington a case where the balance between executive power and legislative power is off kilter, it's all controlled by the Republican Party. And so, it's now the Supreme Court that is really going to be the final decider and step in to try to push back against the executive branch when Republicans in the same party declined to do it.
SCIUTTO: Yes.
TALEV: So, this is now going to be replicating itself potentially across other states. Wisconsin is a key battleground state. And the question is, if this returns to be a split decision or a conservative majority court, what would that do to issues like abortion, voting, congressional redistricting? And then, on the flip side, if Democrats can prevail in this election, does it give them some sort of a lever or mechanism to push back against some of the changes coming at the federal level.
But it's important for another reason too, and I will say that is Elon Musk, because you have seen this is an unprecedented race. The estimates are now nearing a hundred million dollars, which for a judicial contest --
SCIUTTO: State (INAUDIBLE). Yes. It's crazy.
TALEV: It's insane money. I know we've all lost track of, you know, there's inflation.
SCIUTTO: Everything's insane now.
TALEV: Everything's expensive.
SCIUTTO: But something's more insane than others, right?
TALEV: $30 hamburgers, but a hundred million dollars state judicial race is a really big deal.
SCIUTTO: Yes.
TALEV: But also, because the U.S. Supreme Court has declined to block Elon Musk from giving money to voters. He's not giving them on condition that they vote a certain way. He's giving the money yes so that people become actively engaged in these contests. But obviously, the goal is to try to get the outcome he wants, which is the conservative justice. SCIUTTO: And listen, it's been notable that Democrats deliberately tying the Republican-backed candidate to Elon Musk, knowing that Musk might drive Democratic voters the other way.
TALEV: That's a real -- and that's the other interesting thing to watch is, do the U.S. -- do the concerns across America about federal cuts, DOGE, what Musk is doing, could there be a backlash against that or is it ultimately going to help the conservative candidate?
SCIUTTO: OK. Let's talk about these districts down in Florida, because there has been some Republican anxiety at least about -- I don't know if so much about losing these districts, given how --
TALEV: It's the margin of --
SCIUTTO: -- but it's more about the margin and whether that's going to be a bellwether.
TALEV: That's right. So, these are two very red districts, one that had been represented by Mike Waltz, the other by Matt Gaetz, controversial figure in his own right. I think Gaetz's district has been plus 37 red. And Waltz's district around plus 30 red. So, no one thinks that the Republican is going to lose.
But the Democrats outraced the Republicans in these cases. And there's a margin that people will be looking for. If it -- let's say instead of plus 30, it was plus 15.
SCIUTTO: Right.
TALEV: That would be a really big deal potentially. Same with the other district, but does it portend anything about what's going to happen in the midterms, we don't know.
SCIUTTO: And by the way, you know, there've been a lot of races with a lot of money thrown at them where the money didn't necessarily --
TALEV: Absolutely true.
SCIUTTO: -- you know, solidify the outcome. So, we'll see that as well.
TALEV: Absolutely.
SCIUTTO: Margaret Talev, thanks so much.
TALEV: Thank you.
SCIUTTO: Still ahead, we are a day away from President Trump's sweeping tariff announcement. I'm going to speak to the Canadian foreign minister, Melanie Joly, about how Canada plans to respond, and its implications as well for the relationship between the U.S. and Canada.
Plus, the Trump administration is seeking the ultimate punishment for the man accused of killing United Healthcare's CEO. The latest developments in Luigi Mangione's case, that's coming up too.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[18:15:00]
SCIUTTO: Welcome to that back. This time tomorrow we will finally know the details of President Trump's much touted and much feared tariff plan. The president's announcement sets to take place in the White House Rose Guard, it's being called Make American -- America Wealthy Again. That's despite warnings from economists, virtually across the board, that actually reciprocal tariffs against trading partners will make things more expensive for Americans and also make a U.S. recession more likely.
Trump says he has finally settled on his tariff plan, though the White House says he's still working through the numbers with his advisers. White House Secretary Karline Leavitt says that whatever the plan of action, the tariffs are, in the administration's view, necessary and long overdue.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LEAVITT: The president will be addressing the decades of unfair trade practices that have ripped our country off and American workers off. It has hollowed out our middle class. It has destroyed our heartland. And the President is focused on re-shifting our global economy to ensure that America is, once again, the manufacturing superpower of the world.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: The White House says the tariffs announced tomorrow will take effect immediately. U.S. stocks finished Tuesday sessions mostly higher despite these new uncertainties. U.S. Senate Democrats are challenging Trump's sweeping 25 percent tariffs specifically on Canada announced back in February. They're set to hold a vote this week aimed at scrapping the national emergency grounds that underpins Trump's tariffs. They said the president overstated the fentanyl emergency on the northern border in order to give him legal cover for those tariffs.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. TIM KAINE, (D-VA): The president has justified the imposition of these tariffs on, in my view, a made-up emergency. Fentanyl is a real emergency in this country. Let's be clear about that. Fentanyl is a real emergency, but as President Trump's national security national adviser Tulsi Gabbard testified before Mark's Intel Committee last week, the fentanyl emergency is for Mexico and China. It's not from Canada.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: President Trump is now demanding that all Senate Republicans vote against the measure and keep the national emergency grounds in place. In a Truth Social post, he said, a victory would be, quote, "devastating" for the Republican Party and for the United States.
The measure, however, we should note, is mostly symbolic because it is highly unlikely to be taken up by the Republican controlled house. Earlier I spoke to Canada's Minister of Foreign Affairs, Melanie Joly, about the broader trade war, as well as news that the heads of Mexico and Canada discuss tariffs in a phone call today, suggesting that two countries might offer a joint response to Trump's reciprocal tariffs. Have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MELANIE JOLY, CANADIAN MINISTER FOR FOREIGN AFFAIRS: Well, we've been working together, the foreign minister of Mexico and I have been in close contact for many weeks now. It's been more than 90 days that we've been dealing with different executive orders coming out of the White House that are affecting our economies.
But it was an introduction call. It was the first time the prime minister of Canada -- Prime Minister Carney and President Sheinbaum were talking and we're both very important trading partners. Mexico is the second biggest trading partner to Canada, but also, we're part of the USMCA, this trade agreement that is also so key right now and that we need to see whether we can continue to work on to keep it strong.
And this is certainly a message that we wanted to make sure that the Mexican government heard from their Canadian friends.
[18:20:00]
SCIUTTO: As you know, the prime minister, Carney, he warned that the old U.S. relationship that Canada had with the U.S. is over stating, quote, "The U.S. is no longer a reliable partner." I wonder, what does that mean exactly? How will the trading relationship change between the U.S. and Canada, but also, the defense partnership?
JOLY: Well, we didn't launch a trade war against the U.S. The U.S. decided to put 25 percent tariffs against all our products in their first executive order. Then went after us by putting 25 percent tariffs on our steel and aluminum. Then went after us, putting 25 percent on our auto sector. And now, we're looking at potentially being vulnerable to reciprocal tariffs.
Meanwhile, we wanted to make sure that we were sending a clear message that we were retaliating. And at this point we've put $60 billion worth of tariffs against products in Canada. And also, we have a hundred billion dollars more of potential counter tariffs against the U.S. So, on American products in Canada.
Canada is the biggest client of the U.S. Jim, you've asked me that question in the past. You know, when you're in business, and I know many people watching us right now are in the business sector, you treat your client -- your best client well. And so, our goal is to make sure that we end this trade war, that we get to a common understanding that this is hurting our -- Canadians and Americans, their wallets and nobody's winning from it.
But at the same time, of course, we want to make sure that we work with the White House. Of course, we want to make sure that we find an off ramp. Of course, we're willing to have discussions, and that's my goal, working with Marco Rubio. But also, this is the goal of the prime minister, talking to the president, and as well the secretary of commerce and the minister of international trade here in Canada.
SCIUTTO: But the prime minister's words speak to something more lasting here. And it's not just him who's saying this, it's many Canadians themselves, right, who are quite voluntarily stopping buying U.S. products or canceling visits to the U.S. I wonder who will Canada look to to be a more reliable trading partner if the U.S. is no longer that reliable partner?
JOLY: Well, we understand that we're now in an era of protectionism, and our entire country has been built on free trade amongst our provinces, but there's been many bearers to commerce within Canada, and we think that we can really do a better job at supporting ourselves inside our country. We're also looking, of course, at Europe.
Canada is the most non -- well, most European country, of all the non- European countries, Jim. We're definitely looking at Japan and South Korea and looking at Asia. We're, of course, looking at Mexico. But fundamentally, Canadians have really good relationship with Americans. We're your best friends. We're your best neighbors. Your best allies. And so, we want to make sure that while we're putting maximum pressure on the Trump administration to make sure that they're backing off on their trade war, that we can find a way to find a solution.
But on the security side, we know we need to invest more in our own industry. We need to rely more on our defense sector. We need to create jobs at home. We need to defend our own Arctic, and that's also the job we will be doing.
We're now in campaign mode here, back home in Canada. So, we need to make sure that we have a strong mandate on the part of Canadians to make sure that we're sending also a message to the American administration that we stand up for Canadians.
SCIUTTO: It sounds like you're leaving the door open to some sort of reconciliation here. Do you have some hope, some optimism that perhaps President Trump will back off some of the worst trade threats because that's not -- that doesn't seem to be the signals coming from the White House?
JOLY: I am the -- I'm in charge of diplomacy in Canada. My job is always to make sure that we put maximum pressure, that -- when I say maximum pressure, that we use all the tools in our toolkit to ultimately have this trade war end.
But at the end of the day, we know there's going to be a negotiating table. That's the case in every war, including trade wars. And in that sense, we need to send a clear message now to Canadians, to Americans, and this is my way to make sure that, ultimately, we get to a good position at the negotiation table. That's why we're keeping our counter tariffs in place. That's why also we're the only country on Earth that has put so much retaliatory tariffs on the table.
[18:25:00]
Of course, we're talking with other countries. Of course, we're talking to the E.U. Of course, we're talking to Mexico. Of course, we're talking to Japan and South Korea. Because what we're seeing right now is all these different tariffs are affecting, ultimately, jobs here at home, but also creating inflation across the board in many economies. And first and foremost, in the U.S.
And that's my message to Americans watching us right now, is tariffs are attacks on you, your family, and have -- affecting also your wallets, of course.
SCIUTTO: Before we go, when we last spoke, you said that if Trump were to impose these sweeping tariffs, the U.S. and Canada would be in a trade war. And I wonder, are you in a trade war now?
JOLY: Of course, we are. We are. They've imposed executive orders against us. And that's why you've been hearing me using the term, Jim. And we didn't start this trade war, the U.S. administration did. And they can reverse course, but they can only reverse course if the American people themselves say it's enough. That they want to make sure that they -- we get to a good place and we're able to, ultimately, get rid of these tariffs and also have a better relationship between Canada and the U.S. We've never seen this in decades. We were caught by surprise by this intention of launching this trade war. But we're a strong country, we're proud people, we're hardworking, and we always defend ourselves and we will continue to defend ourselves in the context of this trade war.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCIUTTO: There you have it from the Canadian foreign minister, the U.S. and Canada, neighbors, treaty allies now in a trade war. We'll have more news after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SCIUTTO: Welcome back to CNN Newsroom. I'm Jim Sciutto. And here are more international headlines we're watching today.
[18:30:00]
The White House has confirmed that Donald Trump will visit Saudi Arabia next month. It'll be the first foreign trip of Trump's second term. He may also stop in Qatar and UAE. Saudi Arabia was the first country the U.S. president visited during his first term back in 2017. The Saudis have been hosting talks between Russia, Ukraine, and the U.S. aimed at reaching a ceasefire.
As rescue efforts enter their sixth day, hopes of finding more survivors are fading after that just devastating earthquake in Myanmar. So, far more than 2,700 people are confirmed dead. This according to Myanmar's military government. More than four and a half thousand others are injured. Experts say the final death toll could take weeks to emerge.
In Malaysia, a massive fire broke out in a suburb outside Kuala Lumpur due to a burst gas pipeline. This is video which went viral on social media, wow, showing a literal towering inferno, almost a mushroom cloud shape there. Nearby homes had to be evacuated. Three gas stations near the fire site were closed as a precautionary measure. Malaysia's National Oil Company, Patronus, says an investigation is underway into what exactly caused that massive fire.
The U.S. Justice Department is now seeking the death penalty for Luigi Mangione. He's the man accused of killing United Healthcare CEO Brian Thompson in New York back in December. The attorney general, Pam Bondi, says, quote, "I have directed federal prosecutors to seek the death penalty in this case as we carry out President Trump's agenda to stop violent crime and make America safe again."
In response, Mangione's lawyer has issued a statement saying, quote, "By seeking to murder Luigi Mangione, the Justice Department has moved from the dysfunctional to the barbaric."
CNN Legal Analyst Michael Moore joins me now. Good to have you, sir, as always.
MICHAEL MOORE, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Good to be with you. SCIUTTO: I wonder of course it's Mangione who's accused of murder here, is the death penalty warranted for the crime based on what we know?
MOORE: Yes. Yes. I'm glad to be with you. This is a unique case because you really have two competing jurisdictions, the State of New York, where the maximum penalty would be life imprison without the possibility of parole. And now, you see the federal government wanting to come in and go after the death penalty.
And frankly, you know, while the crime is horrific and the laying in weight and the efforts that the defendant went through to try to track this individual down are terrible and they're recorded on videotape, this seems to be a little bit of a stretch on the department's part to exercise its ability to use the death penalty, and it seems almost as if it's a tip of the hat to the Trump campaign agenda, and that is to use, to the maximum extent possible, the federal death penalty. That's different.
We saw in the Biden era, you remember, the end of the Biden's term, he commuted many death sentences and sort of reserved the death penalty for people like terrorists and of the worst of the worst. But what we're seeing now is sort of the effort by the department to reach and grasp by calling this a federal offense because a telephone he used or -- and there was some interstate stalking, they're claiming, as well as the use of a gun. So, now, they've decided that that will be the qualification and what's needed for them to get in the middle and to seek a death penalty as opposed to deferring to the home jurisdiction of New York State.
SCIUTTO: Now, there's a long way to go there to get into trial. I mean, of course, the question is whether he's ultimately convicted. But if he were to be on to -- ultimately convicted, could a jury or a judge consider a lesser sentence?
MOORE: That's always in the province of the fact finder, and that is to make a decision on whether or not the death penalty should be imposed. The problem is oftentimes that the evidence that comes before that fact finder can be so egregious and sometimes presented in a way that tends to, you know, slam it, frankly. Sometimes that can affect how that jury would make a decision.
And again, it wouldn't mean that he would not be entitled to certain appeals if he were convicted, and he certainly could go through the regular process. But defending a death penalty case is much different than just defending what I would call a state murder case. And that's -- again, that's what he's facing here.
You just don't always see this type of parallel proceeding going on where you have essentially the same crime, but they're seeking different penalties for the same defendant from the same crime. And so, that's -- it's very different., I think, that when you have cases involving some civil rights claims and otherwise, the federal government has sort of an exclusive providence and jurisdiction to proceed on those cases.
[18:35:00]
This is different when you have one homicide charge, but yet, each sovereign, that is the State of New York and the United States government, are seeking different penalties.
SCIUTTO: OK. I want to move on to another story, this, the deportation of a Maryland father. The White House press secretary says and the White House now admitting that he was deported to El Salvador as a result of, quote, "a clerical error." Have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LEAVITT: The error that you are referring to was a clerical error. It was an administrative error. The administration maintains the position that this individual who was deported to El Salvador and will not be returning to our country was a member of the brutal and vicious MS-13 gang.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: The trouble is, that was not proved in a court of law. I mean, the White House still claiming it, his lawyers deny it and it has never been proven in court. In your view, is this, in effect, an extra judicial deportation?
MOORE: Yes. I think this is one of the most shameful things that the administration has done, and I can assure you that the gentleman and his family, but certainly, the guy who's sitting down there locked up like a zoo animal in that prison doesn't see it as just a clerical error.
You know, without getting into whether or not he did anything wrong ever in his past life, there has been no finding in a court of the United States that he is a member of some vicious gang. In fact, his deportation was stayed for a period of time because they thought he might be threatened by somebody.
And so, this -- you know, this goes against everything that our country stands for as far as due process. And you know, just to be clear, non-citizens are also entitled to due process. The 14th Amendment to the Constitution separates out rights and then uses specific language as it talks about citizens and people. And people, it talks about, the 14th Amendment have a right to due process.
And so, this is not a good day for the administration. And I expect you will soon see that this case will become sort of the poster child for those other potential deportees, if you will, that they will come in and say, look, one of the things that the courts are expecting us to show is that there's some irreparable harm in order to have the -- this action stopped on an emergency basis.
And here you have now judge evidence of irreparable harm. And that is that they made a typo error or a clerical error or whatever they're calling it at the time to deport this fellow. And now, they're saying they just can't get him back.
SCIUTTO: Yes.
MOORE: So, it's not like they can take the fight out and rub over their typo, right? They say that essentially, we made a mistake, we screwed up, but now we do nothing about it. Good luck to you. And that's going to be a problem I think for the administration going forward. I think you're going to see a lot of judges grab hold of that and say, if the administration can't get it right, and they have no way to guarantee as to they can fix a wrong, then we're not going to let him continue down this path.
SCIUTTO: Yes, it's a good point about that, irreparable harm, potential irreparable harm finding. Before we go, I wonder what recourse this man and his family have now. He's in this horrible prison. The administration said it has no authority to bring him back even though they made a mistake. What do they do now?
MOORE: Yes. I -- you know, they can try to do some emergency relief to try to get some type of order in place, to require the administration to essentially present his body. It's called a habeas corpus. They can -- I don't mean in death, I mean, that they have to bring him forward from the jail and require the administration to come forward to do that. And I think a court would likely do it. The problem is that he's not being held in the United States.
And so, everything we're doing that the administration would be required to do, they have to do in a foreign country. And that's part of this game that's been played and this cleverness that they thought they had come up with by shipping people off. Well, now, they've lost control of.
And again, it doesn't get into whether or not there are some people who should be deported, but this is the problem that you have when you sort of have incompetence and an amateur hour in this type of activity. You just -- you can't take something this serious and do it without recourse and say, oh, well, I'm sorry we messed up. There's just nothing we can do to help you. I think it's unlikely (ph), remember the government also enjoys some immunity. And so, it'll be a tough road to get much relief for this family.
SCIUTTO: Seeming disregard for the 14th Amendment. Michael Moore, thanks so much for joining.
MOORE: Glad to be with you, Jim.
SCIUTTO: Well, we do have some news in on a story we've been covering, this related to a different case. Mohamed Mahmoud Khalil 's legal case will now be heard in New Jersey. This is the Palestinian activist that the Trump administration wants to deport as well.
[18:40:00]
A judge rejected the government's attempts to move the case to Louisiana where he is now being held. The former student activist is a legal resident of the United States, therefore, with rights to due process, among other things. He was arrested in New York City, briefly held in New Jersey. The judge ruled his case should be heard in New Jersey because that's where he was when a motion challenging his detention was filed. We will continue to follow all these cases closely.
This also just in to CNN. Sources tell CNN that a senior Russian official is expected to visit Washington for talks with the Trump administration this week. The visit of negotiator Kirill Dmitriev will mark the first time a senior Russian official has visited Washington for talks since Russia's full-scale invasion of Ukraine in 2022. Sources say he will meet with President Trump's top envoy to Moscow, Steve Witkoff, for talks on strengthening relations between the two countries as President Trump seeks to end the war in Ukraine. Russia, we should note, still has not signed on to a ceasefire there, though Ukraine has agreed to abide by it.
Coming up how one Gen Z candidate is connecting with voters and what she says about the current democratic leadership. Our conversation just after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SCIUTTO: Another election day here in the U.S. Some U.S. voters heading the polls for the first time Since Donald Trump was re- elected. My next guest is thinking a few steps ahead. She's running for office in 2026. Kat Abughazaleh is running as a Democrat in the race for Illinois's Ninth Congressional District. She is going to challenge the Democratic incumbent. Her pitch, Democrats are not doing enough to push back on President Trump. Take a listen to one of her campaign videos.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KAT ABUGHAZALEH, DEMOCRATIC CONGRESSIONAL CANDIDATE: Unfortunately, this party has become one where you have to look to the exceptions for real leadership. As the majority, work from an outdated playbook. We need a makeover, which means we need a vision that's bigger than what we've been told is possible. That means standing up to authoritarians, not shrinking away when the fight gets tough.
And while current Democratic leadership might be fine cowering to Trump. I'm not.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Abughazaleh is betting big on her own media savvy, born in 1999. She's part of Gen Z, which grew up on platforms such as YouTube and TikTok. She's also an experienced media professional in her own right working for Media Matters and the online publication, Mother Jones. Kat joins me now from Chicago. Thanks so much for joining.
[18:45:00]
ABUGHAZALEH: Hi Jim. Thanks for having me.
SCIUTTO: So, first, I wonder, when you speak to voters in the Ninth District there, Democratic voters or perhaps independents, how do they see Democrats' efforts to challenge the Trump administration so far? ABUGHAZALEH: Oh, everyone I've talked to has been incredibly disappointed. In fact, I think that when we're talking about what Democrats are doing, we really need to point to Cory Booker as an anomaly. Right now, he is about to break a record for the longest speech on the Senate floor, a record that's been held by Strom Thurmond, who railed against the Civil Rights Act for decades.
I think a lot of people understand that the Democrats can't get through a ton of progressive or even liberal legislation right now, but the idea of just rolling over, of just letting Trump do whatever he wants, of letting Americans get hurt so that hopefully people will vote for you in 2026, it's disgusting.
And Cory Booker even admitted these flaws of the Democratic Party, saying that they have failed the Democratic people, that they have -- or that they've failed the American people, that they've come up short. And I think that's what a lot of Americans are asking, just bare a minimum, publicly stand up for us, publicly stand up to Trump and acknowledge when you've fallen short. So, that way we can be better. And that's what I want to do.
SCIUTTO: Two big issues drove a lot of voters in the last election cycle, immigration and inflation. And granted every cycle is different. But I wonder how do you plan to address or to convince voters on those two issues?
ABUGHAZALEH: Yes, I think this system isn't working for a lot of people. One of our main issues on our website is just as basic existence, because you should be able to afford housing, healthcare, and groceries with money left over, enough to save and then also go to the movies or take your kid to the zoo. That's like a very low bar.
And yet, I heard from so many people that it's unrealistic that we couldn't get there. And I ask why. And it's because this system is built to cater to billionaires and corporations. We need to tax billionaires. We need to tax corporations. We need to tax wealth. And in a lot of cases, for example, Medicare for All, these types of systems would actually be cheaper for the average American. They would be cheaper for the country as a whole.
When you look at our healthcare system, people are paying so much more in prices of medication, in prices of surgery, but you also have people that won't go to the hospital or won't go to the doctor and then can't work anymore because they can't afford healthcare, so they can't contribute to the economy. So, I think what a lot of people would call progressive, I would just call basic economic common sense.
SCIUTTO: How about on the culture of war issues, for lack of a better term, which did drive some voters, perhaps not all of them, and even Democrats acknowledged that particularly that there was that clip of Kamala Harris talking about transgender surgery for prisoners, which they acknowledge in some states really hurt them. That is one sign of a social issue that drove some voters. Do you believe that Democrats went too far left on some social issues and to win in the next cycle, you and others have to bring it back to the middle, in effect, soften a progressive or woke, as it's called by Donald Trump, some of those issues and move towards the center?
ABUGHAZALEH: Yes, absolutely not. Democrats deciding that trans people are the reason they lost the election in 2024, it's ridiculous. It's offensive. And frankly, they are contributing to Trump's authoritarianism.
The transgender community, the queer community as a whole, but particularly the trans community, have been often the first targets in authoritarian and fascist regimes, and that's happening right now. And people like myself, people in my line of work studying, researching and attacking fascism have been warning about this for years, and Democrats didn't listen.
A lot of people stayed home in 2024, and a lot -- fewer people voted against Democrats because of woke than I think a lot of people assume. A far bigger issue is that we aren't giving people something to vote for. So, many more people stayed home in 2020 of pretty much almost all demographics because they didn't feel represented by either candidate. They didn't feel listened to by either party, and it isn't because of vulnerable communities, it's because these are parties being led by people who are out of touch and people that don't listen to their constituents.
SCIUTTO: Kat Abughazaleh, we appreciate you coming on. I also wish you good luck as you begin your race for the Ninth District there in Illinois.
ABUGHAZALEH: Thanks so much, Jim.
[18:50:00]
SCIUTTO: Well, we were speaking just there about Senator Cory Booker. He is still going in that speech on the Senate floor. He's now been speaking for nearly 24 hours straight, railing against the Trump administration. In particular, it's cuts to the federal government, actually, that is Senator Chris Murphy there right now.
It's now this -- he's asking a question of Senator Booker. It is now the second longest Senate speech on record. This goes back to 1900. It comes at a time when Democrats are under fire in some quarters for not taking a tougher stance, as we were just hearing there, from a candidate to be against President Trump.
Next, lost in the forest. That is Nottingham Forest. New disappointment for Manchester United in England's Premier League.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SCIUTTO: Well, Robinhood himself would've been proud. Underdogs Nottingham Forest have swiped an impressive win against Manchester United in the Premier League. Don Riddell was following all the action. And I know times have been a little tough for a Man United, we should note, but great win for Nottingham Forest.
DON RIDDELL, CNN WORLD SPORT: Yes. You know, Jim, times have been even tougher for Nottingham Forest. I mean, many people around the world are big fans of Manchester United and everything that they've achieved over the years, but, ManU not so hot these days.
Nottingham Forest, back in the day, in the '70s and '80s were on top of the football game in Europe. They were back-to-back European Cup winners, but they've been in the wilderness ever since. Now, though they are having just this extraordinary and totally unexpected resurgence.
They're third in the Premier League. They're looking like they could return to European football next year for the first time since the early 1980s. And this was an absolutely brilliant goal coming in the fifth minute against Manchester United in the Premier League on Tuesday night.
Anthony Elanga racing the length of the field scoring against his former club. That turned out to be the decisive goal and a one-nil. But Forest had to ride their luck a little bit because right at the end, United's defender Harry MaGuire got a shot on target. Murillo managed to just clear it off the line, giving Forest that crucial one- nil win and three points.
Just get this for context. This is the first time that Nottingham Forest have done the double over Manchester United in the league since 1992. In a separate competition, they are also into the semifinals of the FA Cup for the first time since 1991. And as we say, they are looking like they could get themselves into the Champions League next season.
They've been third in the Premier League table since I think the end of December. So, it's not as if they've just suddenly come out of nowhere to be one of the contenders this year. They have been up there all season.
And if we can just show you the Premier League table, you will see that they are ahead of the likes of Chelsea. They are ahead of the likes of the four-time defending champions Manchester City. And Forest now have just eight games left to go. If they can end in the top four, then they will be in the Champions League or the European Cup competition as it used to be known back in the days when they were playing it.
[18:55:00]
They really have been one of the great stories in English football this season, and to think that last season they were almost relegated from the Premier League, they managed to hang in there by the skin of their teeth. And now, if that was lucky, this is no fluke. They're a great team to watch and they're just a fabulous story unfolding.
SCIUTTO: Good game for them, no question. Don Riddell, thanks so much.
Well, finally, it is April Fool's Day here in the U.S. and we wanted to share one prank, Flightradar24 had a lot of fun tweeting about the return of the Concorde, claiming their most attractive journey was a supersonic flight from Paris to New York. That said, we should note, the Concorde hasn't flowed flown since 2003. Fooled a lot of people. There were a lot of other good ones today too. Thanks so much for your company today. I'm Jim Sciutto in Washington, D.C. Please do stay with CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:00:00]
