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CNN This Morning

Questions Mount Over Cause of Downed Azerbaijan Jet; Republicans Feud Over Visas & Foreign-Born Workers. Aired 6-6:30a ET

Aired December 27, 2024 - 06:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

DANNY FREEMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT/ANCHOR: It is Friday, December 27. Right now, on CNN THIS MORNING.

[06:00:18]

A second black box recovered as new questions swirl about Russia's involvement in possibly downing a jet in Kazakhstan.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VIVEK RAMASWAMY (R), FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: What I think is we need to replace the H-1B lottery system.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FREEMAN: And culture wars. How a discussion about immigration and visas turned into a referendum on American culture, sparking a MAGA civil war.

And later --

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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm feeling devastated. Kind of in shock.

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FREEMAN: Shock at a wildlife sanctuary. The bird flu killing 20 big cats. And experts still don't know how it got there.

Then later, who wants to be a billionaire? The Mega Millions jackpot now over $1.15 billion. And that drawing is tonight.

It is 6 a.m. here on the East Coast, and we have a live look right now at beautiful Miami, Florida. I'm sure it's nice and warm down there.

Good morning, everyone. I'm Danny Freeman in for Kasie Hunt. It is so lovely to have you with us this morning.

We begin here. Azerbaijan Airlines suspending flights from its nation's capital to seven cities in Russia. That's according to the government-owned Azerbaijani press agency, after a passenger jet crashed in Kazakhstan on Christmas day.

Now, a U.S. official is telling CNN that early indications suggest a Russian anti-aircraft system may have downed the plane, adding that it may have been a case of mistaken identity in which poorly trained Russian units have fired negligently against Ukraine's use of drones.

But a second black box was actually recovered from the downed plane. Authorities hoping it will provide insight into just what led to the disaster, which claimed the lives of at least 38 people.

But officials in the region are urging not to speculate about the crash until the investigations have wrapped up.

CNN's Bianna Golodryga has more.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BIANNA GOLODRYGA, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR (voice-over): As investigators race to determine the cause of the deadly Azerbaijan Airlines plane crash, early indications suggest that a Russian anti- aircraft system may be responsible.

A U.S. official told CNN the aircraft was traveling from the Azerbaijani capital of Baku to the Russian republic of Chechnya when it attempted an emergency landing in Kazakhstan.

The crash occurred shortly after Ukraine fired drones nearby at Southern Russia, possibly leading Russia's defense systems to inadvertently strike the aircraft, the official said.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE)

GOLODRYGA (voice-over): Video from on board the flight shows panicked passengers praying and holes visible in the body of the aircraft. The source of the apparent damage has not been confirmed.

The airline and Russia's federal air transport agency initially told local media the aircraft crashed after it collided with a flock of birds, an account disputed by Ukrainian counter disinformation official Andriy Kovalenko.

Russian state media also reported that the plane had been rerouted due to heavy fog around Chechnya's capital. Several investigations have been opened, including one by a joint commission involving representatives from Kazakhstan, Azerbaijan and Russia.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): The commission's task is to fully investigate the matter, the causes, and all the details of the accident and to inform both me and the people of Azerbaijan.

GOLODRYGA (voice-over): The Kremlin expressed condolences for those impacted by the crash and urged against speculation into the cause until the investigations have concluded.

Of the 67 people on board, 29 survived, including two children, authorities said. In Azerbaijan, a day of mourning was declared for the dead. Some relatives of the survivors remain on edge, waiting for news on loved ones' recovery. UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): I don't know what to say,

honestly. I spoke with my son today. Thank God his condition is good. If everything goes well today and tomorrow, he will come to Baku. Let's see what happens next.

GOLODRYGA (voice-over): For many families of the at least 38 people killed in the crash, answers can't come soon enough.

Bianna Golodryga, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FREEMAN: Joining me now, CNN global affairs analyst Kim Dozier.

Good morning, Kim. Thank you again for being with us. Can you just walk us through what it would mean for Russia if it does turn out they had something to do with this?

KIM DOZIER, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: Well, it is a reputational black eye that, once again, in Russia's conquest of Ukraine, it has apparently accidentally shot down an airliner or at least caused it to crash.

Of course, the first time this happened was back in 2014, when Russian irregular forces shot down a Malaysian airliner, number 17, with a Buk missile, and the Hague has prosecuted and sentenced three Russian men over that downing.

[06:05:15]

This time around, this plane was approaching Grozny at the time when there was also reportedly a Ukrainian drone attack in the area, and apparently it was waved off, told not to land there, and sustained some sort of damage, possibly from shrapnel from a nearby anti- aircraft munition.

And that may have caused its hydraulic systems some damage that then led to this crash, but that is all being investigated right now to see if Russia really is responsible.

Kim, I want you to take a listen to what one Republican congressman said about these new developments. Take a listen.

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REP. RYAN ZINKE (R-MT): This is not the first commercial aircraft that, if the reports are true, that Russia did down it. If the reports are true, it's not the first one they did.

So again, it's a -- it's a sitting malting (ph) pot -- a melting pot without an answer. Unless we have clear -- clearly defined objectives. What's our plan?

You know, my position is, I don't think Ukraine is ready for NATO. They'd have to do a massive political reform that they're not willing to do. (END VIDEO CLIP)

FREEMAN: So that's GOP Congressman Ryan Zinke there. Just what's your reaction to his statement there?

DOZIER: Well, it represents one part of the Russia -- of the Republican Party that both thinks Russia has engaged in aggressive practices, both by invading Ukraine and also by carrying out a number of sabotage operations and disinformation operations across Europe, especially since its 2022 invasion of central Ukraine.

But there's also the wing of the party that believes that Ukraine itself triggered this Russian invasion by signaling that it wants to join NATO.

Now, the process of joining NATO means that you have to have both a professional military, and all NATO members have to vote to include you in. So, that's a long process. And Zinke is referring to the fact that that's going to take some time.

But it also points out the political headwinds that the Trump administration is walking into. You know, Russia is waging this war and trying to win as much territory as possible before Trump takes office. And this civilian airliner downing could be part of that.

FREEMAN: Kim Dozier, thank you, as always, for breaking down the big picture of what may be happening amidst this tragedy. Thank you. Appreciate it.

DOZIER: Thanks.

FREEMAN: And coming up on CNN THIS MORNING after a devastating loss, where do Democrats go from here?

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We need bold, younger generation of leaders.

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FREEMAN: The fight to chair the DNC in full swing as candidates lay out their vision for the party.

Plus, feeling lucky? More than $1 billion could be yours if you get the golden ticket in tonight's Mega Millions jackpot.

And valuing mediocrity over excellence. It's a fierce debate inside the Republican Party that's happening right now over American culture.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BEN SAVAGE, ACTOR: My baseball team came in last.

RIDER STRONG, ACTOR: They actually gave you a trophy for that?

SAVAGE: Well, they wanted everybody to feel a sense of pride and achievement.

STRONG: Where's his head?

SAVAGE: I smashed it off with a hammer.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

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[06:12:55]

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DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT-ELECT OF THE UNITED STATES: We will follow two simple rules: buy American and hire American.

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FREEMAN: That was President Donald Trump during his first inauguration nearly eight years ago, vowing to hire American as a cornerstone of his administration.

But now, just weeks away from his next inauguration, his base and his newer Silicon Valley supporters seem to be feuding over hiring migrants in high-skill positions.

On the one hand, you have the DOGE, leaders Elon Musk and Vivek Ramaswamy, who are coming out in defense of tech companies bringing in foreign engineers.

Ramaswamy writing in part, "The reason top tech companies often hire foreign-born and first-generation engineers over," quote, "'native' Americans isn't because of an innate American I.Q. deficit (a lazy and wrong explanation). A key part of it comes down to the c-word: culture. A culture that celebrates the prom queen over the math olympiad champ, or the jock over the valedictorian will not produce the best engineers."

Ramaswamy goes on to blame '90s sitcoms like "Boy Meets World" and other media for celebrating average, saying, we need less of this.

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SAVAGE: This is me, Mr. Average. My room here is a shrine to my mediocre life.

STRONG: Oh, let's stop right there, OK? You don't have a mediocre life.

SAVAGE: There's nothing about me that separates me from anybody else.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FREEMAN: And a little bit more like this from the 2014 movie "Whiplash."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BEN KINGSLEY, ACTOR: Say it louder!

MILES TELLER, ACTOR: I'm upset, Carl.

KINGSLEY: Start practicing harder, Neiman.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FREEMAN: And cue the MAGA backlash. Prominent Trump's [SIC] allies like Matt Gaetz, Ann Coulter, Laura Loomer, they all jumped on to criticize Ramaswamy's position.

Coulter claims, "Tech wants indentured servants, not 'high-skilled' workers."

Gaetz said tech bros joined MAGA for economic reasons, and they didn't ask them to engineer an immigration policy.

Loomer went a step further, claiming Ramaswamy, quote, doesn't "even know what MAGA immigration policy is."

Now, President-elect Trump has yet to weigh in one way or another on this latest skirmish amongst his base. But at times on the campaign trail, he seemed to hint at backing both sides of the argument.

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[06:15:09]

TRUMP: I will protect our workers. I will protect our jobs. We will build American; we will buy American; and we will hire American.

What I want to do and what I will do, is you graduate from a college, I think you should get automatically, as part of your diploma, a green card to be able to stay in this country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FREEMAN: All right. Joining me now to talk about this is our phenomenal panel this morning. We have Stephen Collinson, CNN politics senior reporter; Leah Wright Rigueur, CNN political analyst and historian; Jamal Simmons, CNN political commentator and former communications director for Vice President Harris; and Lance Trover, former spokesperson for Doug Burgum's presidential campaign.

Welcome to you all. We have a full house. I love it here, and I'm excited about this topic.

Stephen, let's start with you. What do we make of this online argument breaking out into the open between Trump's base and these Silicon Valley types like Musk and Ramaswamy?

STEPHEN COLLINSON, CNN POLITICS SENIOR REPORTER: I think it's a pretty fascinating glimpse at the fissures in this rather unique coalition that Trump put together in the election. On the one hand, you have the new addition of Silicon Valley pioneers

and businessmen, billionaires, many of them. And then you have that stretching across right to the traditional Trump working-class, grassroots MAGA base.

And that's something the president-elect is going to have to deal with during his administration.

I think that there is -- there is a need for a discussion about whether the U.S. education system is turning out enough science and technology graduates that can filter into the Silicon Valley industries.

I just think that the way that Ramaswamy approached it was not very artful, and it does show some of his rawness as a politician.

It's not necessarily contradictory that you can discuss the Trump administration's desire to crack down on border issues and undocumented migration, and consider the need to get more highly- skilled immigrants into the country.

You know, immigration legislation has been trying to do that for years but has always failed, because this issue has been so politically polarizing. But it's just the way that this was brought up, I think.

And you saw that on social media, as you mentioned. It's going to be very divisive in the Trump coalition.

FREEMAN: Lance, I'm going to jump over to you. I'm curious. You know, with this Trump coalition actually growing and expanding this year versus 2016, certainly versus 2020, was this -- was this conflict inevitable, really, between multiple sides, especially some folks who are, frankly, new to the Republican world, like someone like Elon Musk?

LANCE TROVER, FORMER SPOKESPERSON FOR DOUG BURGUM'S PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN: Yes. Look, I mean, immigration is -- is a -- is an interesting issue here in America. A lot of people have a lot of different opinions.

I agree with Stephen. I mean, I think the comments by Vivek Ramaswamy were inartful at best.

Look, this H-1B visa program, I think, many people would argue, has been abused by corporations to get these blanket exemptions out there. And I think the problem is it's taking jobs away from many Americans and particularly minorities.

And I think if you look at what the voters spoke to, I think their first and foremost priority is, one, stopping the flow of illegal immigration in this country, getting the border closed and under control; and then asking ourselves, OK, who's coming into this country? Why are they coming into this country? How long are they coming into this country?

That, to me, is the voters' first priority when it comes to that. And then we can have this discussion about H-1B visas as we go along.

But right now, the No. 1 priority is that and getting some of these illegal immigrants who have come in over the course of the last several years out.

FREEMAN: I love these moments, because when somebody tweets, everyone has to tweet.

Nikki Haley also jumped into this battle, slamming Ramaswamy over his comments on American culture, writing, quote, "There is nothing wrong with American workers or American culture. All you have to do is look at the border and see how many want what we have."

Leah, I'm going to toss it to you on this one. Was Nikki Haley being on the same side as Matt Gaetz and Laura Loomer part of your "end of 2024 bingo card"?

LEAH WRIGHT RIGUEUR, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST AND HISTORIAN: Actually, it was. And let me tell you why.

Vivek Ramaswamy and Nikki Haley have a very contested relationship. It's often gotten ugly at different points in time, but particularly on the campaign -- campaign trail.

Nikki Haley has come after Vivek before because of attacks, she said, on her children. Vivek has called her a fascist. They have been going at it for quite some time.

And I think part of the -- part of the tension here, too, is that, as Nikki Haley has fallen out of favor with the MAGA base, one of the people that she has kind of pointed to is taking -- essentially, taking her place is somebody like Vivek Ramaswamy.

Her argument has been that he does not fully understand what it means to actually be part of this conservative movement, because if you think about Vivek Ramaswamy's actual history and longer trajectory, he is very transactional.

[06:20:09]

He is relatively new to the conservative movement and certainly new to the MAGA movement. That was Laura Loomer's point. That was several other of the kind of high-profile MAGA people who jumped into this conversation.

But I would also point out that this larger conversation, as our other panelists have -- have pointed out already, but as this larger conversation comes to a head, it does highlight tensions, preexisting tensions that have come to the fore, but that were hidden for a long time as people rallied around Donald Trump to elect him to office.

Perhaps more importantly, a lot of businesses have -- actually, this is why they are putting their hat in with Donald Trump, because they want to offset this kind of pro -- anti-immigration, pro-business bent on the base. And that's where the tensions really arise from. Jamal, I'll give you the last quick word right here. Other strange

bedfellows, perhaps? Governor Jared Polis, Bill de Blasio, both siding with the DOGE bros here and actually agreeing with Vivek and Elon. Are we going to see more strange bedfellows in this coming year?

JAMAL SIMMONS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: We are going to see a lot of strange bedfellows, because what's happening is the MAGA coalition is built on a fault line of anxiety, and you've got cultural anxiety on one side and economic anxiety on the other side.

And the problem that the two of those things are grating against each other. They cut against each other. So -- so, to deal with the cultural anxiety, it's really about white -- traditional, white, Christian, heterosexual male culture, being able to kind of be dominant in America.

On the other hand, in the economic side, you've got to have more diversity. You've got to have more immigration. You've got to go out and recruit engineers from different places. Because the truth is, we do need more engineers as global competition for engineers is taking place in the country.

So, if we don't have more talent in the United States and get the talent, more skills, and have that talent come from more communities, it's going to be pretty tough for America to compete on the global scale.

So, we've got to solve that. But it cuts right against that traditional cultural anxiety that a lot of the folks who joined up with the MAGA coalition are feeling, and it's hard to reconcile those two things.

FREEMAN: I think we're going to see these -- these kind of debates quite a lot in the year to come.

All right. Panel, all stay right where you are. Don't go anywhere. Because after the break on CNN THIS MORNING, we're going to talk about a lot more, including severe storms marching across the Southeast.

Multiple tornadoes spotted in Texas. That's just one of the five things you have to see this morning.

Plus, from LeBron making history to Simone's Olympic comeback, athletes just made 2024 a stellar year for sports fans. We're going to look back at the biggest moments, right up ahead.

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[06:27:01]

FREEMAN: It is 26 minutes past the hour right now, and we have five things you have to see this morning.

First, severe storms pummeling Southeastern Texas, spawning rare winter tornadoes. This funnel right here -- cloud was spotted just South of Houston on Thursday. And this waterspout also forming in Harris County. No injuries, though, were reported.

And a woman crashes her car into a building in Washington, D.C., sparking a fire you see right there. The driver was momentarily trapped until first responders got her out safely. Fortunately, no one was inside the building, which is home to two daycare centers.

And if this doesn't scream Wisconsin, I don't know what does. You're looking right there at firefighters pulling a deer to safety after it fell through ice in a river.

The animal was dried off and quickly went on its way.

Love that.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Toledo wins it in overtime!

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FREEMAN: This is wild. The thrilling but confusing end of a bowl game match-up between Toledo and Pittsburgh. Toledo thought they won two different times in overtime, but a flag and a replay review extended the game twice.

Toledo was eventually able to officially celebrate after the sixth overtime.

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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Two-thirty a.m., she came pawing at the door, ringing the doorbell, which was Christmas Eve.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FREEMAN: OK, this story is crazy. A four-year-old dog missing since December 15th returns home on Christmas Eve. It's a Christmas miracle, but the pup walked up to her porch and rang the doorbell -- you saw it right there -- letting her family know she was home for Christmas.

Love that. Smart dog. Good dog.

All right, next on CNN THIS MORNING, a bird flu outbreak ripping through a big cat sanctuary as fears of a new pandemic grow.

Plus, the DNC, they're looking for a new leader as the party tries to pick up the pieces after Republicans sweep the White House in Congress.

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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I feel that, in order for the Democrats to rise like a phoenix from the ashes of our electoral defeat, we need to look at more than just the outer issues. (END VIDEO CLIP)

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