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Donna Shalala is Interviewed about Chanes to HHS; Duffy Prioritizes Areas with High Birth and Marriage Rates; Wall Street Eyes Trump Tariff Threat; A Third Trump Term. Aired 6:30-7a ET

Aired March 31, 2025 - 06:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[06:30:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PETER NAVARRO, WHITE HOUSE SENIOR COUNSELOR FOR TRADE AND MANUFACTURING: For America.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

AUDIE CORNISH, CNN ANCHOR: We're just days away from what President Trump calls liberation day. This week he plans to impose a 25 percent tariff on imported cars, car parts, as well as so-called reciprocal tariffs, something his advisers are framing as tax cuts.

Good morning, everybody. I'm Audie Cornish. I want to thank you for joining me on CNN THIS MORNING.

It is half past the hour here on the East Coast. As you're heading out the door, here's what's happening right now.

Global markets selling off as President Trump prepares to impose those sweeping new tariffs on countries around the world. Looking at U.S. futures, the Dow, Nasdaq and S&P 500 are all in the red just hours before the opening bell on Wall Street.

And a line of dangerous storms caused this damage in Indiana. That system is actually moving east today. So far at least two people were killed in storm-related incidents over the weekend. And right now much of Louisiana to Tennessee is under a tornado or severe thunderstorm watch.

In France, French far right leader Marine Le Pen now banned from running for public office after being found guilty of embezzlement. That happened just a short time ago. A Paris court found Le Pen and several others used parliament money to pay staff. She denies any wrongdoing. She had been seen as the frontrunner for France's 2027 presidential race.

And turning back now to Washington and, quote, "a silly new bureaucracy." That's what my next guest is calling the big overhaul coming to Health and Human Services. That department cutting 10,000 jobs. It's also consolidating many departments. And Donna Shalala, former HHS secretary under President Clinton, says this insults a generation of patriotic federal workers.

Donna Shalala joins me now.

Welcome to CNN THIS MORNING.

I want to start with your op-ed, where you describe it as silly. You've been approached in the past about reforming or making changes to the department. Why do you think these changes are silly?

DONNA SHALALA, FORMER SECRETARY OF HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES: Because they're structural and they're going to slow down both the approval of drugs, all of the programs at NIH. There's no question that you don't start with structure. You start by trying to improve the programs that you have.

And this reorganization makes no sense. It was done from the top down without consultation with the people that really understand the programs. It's very disappointing and it's very dangerous.

The resignation of the head of vaccines at FDA is also dangerous. He was a very -

CORNISH: I want to talk about that. Ms. Shalala, hold on one second -

SHALALA: Yes.

CORNISH: Because you mentioned this stepping down. You're referring to Doctor Peter Marks.

SHALALA: I am.

CORNISH: He was actually given the choice to resign or be fired. Now, in his resignation letter, he wrote that, "it's become clear that truth and transparency are not desired by the secretary, but rather he wishes subservient confirmation of his misinformation and lies."

In the meantime, Republican Senator James Lankford was asked about all of this, and here's what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JAMES LANKFORD (R-OK): I am concerned. I'm concerned twofold. One is, if he's making that strong of a statement coming out on it, it's pretty clear why RFK Jr. actually released him and said, hey, there's a real difference of opinion of where things will go on this. But there's a lot of other scientists that are still there. There are other scientists that are joining in. He has been - RFK Jr. has been clear he supports vaccines and especially the childhood schedule on this. The president has been very clear on his support of vaccines.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: There's a lot to unpack in what Lankford said there, but I want to get to the idea of, there's other scientists who could be involved in this. How do you hear this kind of, I don't know, sort of sweeping response to what we're looking at? SHALALA: Well, RFK Jr. has not been clear about vaccines. He has not been clear about managing the measles outbreak that's occurring in this country. And we start with measles. What happens if we have a polio outbreak? Because he has said it's up to parents, but he has not encouraged parents to get vaccines.

His mother got him vaccinated. He got his own children vaccinated. Why would anyone in a leadership position in this country want any child to get sick from something that we already know the science and we can prevent it?

So, you don't start with structural reorganization. You start by looking at the programs and seeing if you can make them better. Structural reorganization will simply slow down the process of science.

[06:35:01]

And that's not what we want to do. And you don't fire people willy nilly, thousands of people, and expect the department to be able to produce a better quality for the American people. The department's about health and safety and the future. And RFK Jr. is focusing on structure.

CORNISH: Ms. Shalala, I want to jump in here - one of the things people are going to say that you may - there's backlash to this approach. That I understand. There have been many years when HHS could have been changed for more efficiency, right. And you also have a huge constituency of voters out there who believe that they don't trust the current public health establishment.

How do you get them back? Because arguably there - we wouldn't be in this position if they didn't have real concerns.

SHALALA: Look, we politicized the Covid vaccine. That's what caused a lot of the dissatisfaction with the public health. But people trust the Medicare system. They trust the Medicare - the Medicaid system. So, most of public health, most of what the department does is, in fact, in Medicare and Medicaid, the children's health insurance program. These programs are trusted by the American public. That they don't trust public health as such, it doesn't it - it doesn't mean that they don't trust the programs of the department. They trust Head Start. They trust childcare. They trust the National Institutes of Health, which is - drives the economy in this country. You can't pull the rug from under these programs and expect Americans to be healthier and, frankly, safer in the future.

CORNISH: Donna Shalala, former health -

SHALALA: And that's exactly what this administration is doing.

CORNISH: I want to thank Donna Shalala, former Health and Human Services Secretary.

All right, so I want to move on to another area of the government, right. Like, if you want better roads in your state, what we're hearing now is, have more babies. The transportation secretary, Sean Duffy, asked his department to prioritize communities with marriage and birth rates higher than the national average when awarding grants. A CNN investigation found that red states would benefit the most under this plan.

Joining me now for the group chat, Stephen Collinson, CNN politics senior reporter, Michael Warren, senior editor at "The Dispatch," and Joel Rubin is back, he's the former deputy assistant secretary of state during the Obama administration.

So, it may be weird that I'm talking about this with a group of men, but it - there are actually a lot of men behind this movement, which is known as pronatalism. Elon Musk is one of them who says there's a population crisis around the world. People need to do more to have children. And they want this to be reflected in policy in the U.S. About 70 percent of the states President Trump won actually had above the national birth rate. That was back in 2023, compared to just 15 percent of states that Kamala Harris won.

OK, Mike Warren, have you heard about this movement and what do you think about seeing it actually play out in policy?

MICHAEL WARREN, SENIOR EDITOR, "THE DISPATCH": Oh, absolutely. And look, this is not new in the sense that there have been efforts, particularly in tax policy, to try to encourage people to have -

CORNISH: Yes, childcare tax credit.

WARREN: Exactly, childcare credit.

CORNISH: Yes, exactly.

WARREN: Childcare, tax credit, all - or really any tax credit. I just finished filing my taxes yesterday. I get a tax credit for the number of kids that I have. So, that's not new.

What I find kind of odd about this is going through sort of the depths of transportation policy in order to sort of privilege this sort of thing.

CORNISH: Yes, to be fair, Sean Duffy has nine kids.

WARREN: Yes.

CORNISH: He's long talked about birth rates. Here's how he describes the issue.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEAN DUFFY, TRANSPORTATION SECRETARY: I think it is a crisis. And again, if you look at what's good for countries, societies is, to reproduce, to have kids. That shows that you're healthy, you're strong and you're patriotic.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: What do you make of seeing this play out in policy?

STEPHEN COLLINSON, CNN POLITICS SENIOR REPORTER: Well, if you get on a plane and you fly somewhere, planes don't - just don't go to places where there are high birth rates, right? So, as a way of making transportation policy, this doesn't seem to make a lot of sense.

Now, you could argue, OK, a town say in Texas has got a higher birth rate. So, we should plan ahead and think about the transport needs for that town. That seems great. But this seems to be about ideology.

Now, one - one answer to the question of, there aren't enough people is to encourage more immigration. So, it seems like two of the administration's priorities are actually working against each other here.

CORNISH: It's interesting that you - you went in that direction.

Joel, how - how are you hearing all of this? Because we're - we're having the - we've always done it with kids. It's a thing. And this looks suspiciously partisan.

[06:40:05]

JOEL RUBIN, PRESIDENT, WASHINGTON STRATEGY GROUP: It looks highly partisan. First of all, how would you implement it? What's the timeline for it? When do they start the clock? Is it the day Donald Trump was inaugurated? Is it nine months after that?

And I think that what we're looking at here is an attempt to shift the entire population of the United States to try to bias and push towards red states, quite frankly, whiter states, and to try to move in that direction to depopulate from immigration. Immigration is the lifeblood of this country.

CORNISH: Yes, but to challenge that, so many Democrats, especially in progressive circles, have talked about, what does it mean to have a family?

RUBIN: Yes. Yes.

CORNISH: There's a lot of conversation about being childless by choice.

RUBIN: Yes.

CORNISH: There is a perception that maybe culturally, Democrats aren't exactly selling the idea of family.

RUBIN: Yes, you know - you know, but that's everyone's choice. And that's the right as an American to choose what kind of family and how large a family you want. And I personally - we have three kids, three daughters. I love having three. It's - it's - it's wonderful. But I don't think that the way I choose to live needs to be forced on other people, and certainly not by the government telling people how many babies to have. CORNISH: Last word to the other person with three kids on the panel.

Unless you have three kids? Oh, OK. Yes, yes, no, we're - we're in the two club. All right.

(CROSS TALK)

WARREN: Exactly. Well, look, it just - it just seems odd. If we're talking about implementing policy, transportation policy, because of population growth expectations, that seems fine. I do agree, this seems ideological. And it seems like often the Trump administration is trying to implement social change through government. That's certainly kind of new for Republicans.

CORNISH: Right. Well, and also what they accused past Democrats of doing.

WARREN: Absolutely. Of course.

CORNISH: I don't want the group chat to go anywhere. We have more to discuss ahead.

So, on CNN THIS MORNING, we're going to be talking about a tense moment at Reagan National Airport. A United Airlines flight striking a kite while trying to land.

Plus, President Trump set to impose auto tariffs this week. And he says he doesn't care if car prices go up for you.

More from the group chat after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:46:08]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I love Tesla.

REPORTER: Which one did you buy?

REPORTER: Which one did you buy?

REPORTER: Which one did you buy?

REPORTER: Wait, Mr. President, which - Mr. President, which car are you going to buy?

TRUMP: The one I like is that one.

REPORTER: And how does this work? So -

TRUMP: And I want that same color.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: President Trump joked about buying a Tesla. Meanwhile, can you afford a new car? On Sunday, President Trump told NBC News in a phone interview that he, quote, "couldn't care less" if his auto tariffs caused prices to rise because people will buy more American- made cars.

Some of the president's supporters claim his tariff threats are nothing more than a negotiating ploy.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JAMES LANKFORD (R-OK): I feel like in some ways in the economy this is kind of like a kitchen remodel or a bath remodel. There's a bit of a mess at the beginning, but everybody has a long-term look of where we're headed. It's going to be noisy for a little while, but we all know where we're headed, trying to reduce the prices for Americans and increase jobs.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: OK, bringing the group chat back.

Look at your eyebrows. Kitchen remodel. Do you buy it? Because, by the way, if anyone's remodeled their kitchen, I haven't, but I have friends who have, and they're still traumatized. It's a lot of pain.

WARREN: Exactly. It feels more like taking your old house and then just ripping it all the way down to the studs and rebuilding it and trying to do that, and doing it with less money.

CORNISH: So then, what do you make of the way Langford was explaining it? Like, what is that messaging?

WARREN: I think that messaging is, you know, he's like blinking in morse code, please do not actually do these tariffs. I think there's a lot of terror. And you can see, "The Wall Street Journal" had a great story about this where the automakers had this meeting with Donald Trump in which he basically said, make sure you keep your prices low. So, when he says he doesn't care about prices, I think he does, but it's a - it's a contradiction -

CORNISH: He's saying, it's not my gig to fix that. That's what they need to do.

WARREN: That's what he's trying to say.

CORNISH: OK, I know, Stephen, you have talked about whiplash, the uncertainty. What - what do you make of this general approach? Because I know the markets don't like it because they just don't like not knowing what's going to happen.

But how do you see this moment and him calling it liberation day and the way he's trying to talk about it?

COLLINSON: You know, the damage that's being done is almost as much being done because no one knows what's going to happen. Trump says one day we're going to have reciprocal tariffs on everybody. The next day he says, I'm going to let some countries off. That level of uncertainty hurts the markets but more fundamentally.

So, there's nothing wrong. And it is quite laudable the fact that the president is trying to respond to these areas of the country that were hollowed out by globalization. The question is, is the way to do that, to recreate the economy of the 1950s, a quarter of the way into the 21st century, when the economy is now not based on manufacturing, it's based on services, it's based on AI. Perhaps you use tariffs to promote AI industries of the future.

CORNISH: All right, now you're getting ahead of where they are, though, because they're still talking manufacturing.

Stephen brings up globalization, which I think for Democrats, like the legacy of that lives on, right, in angry constituencies?

RUBIN: Yes. And absolutely there is a need for the industrial center of the country to get the support that it has to have to - to reindustrialize, to get the investments working for the workers there. But this is chaos. This is uncertainty. I'm thinking about it as, let them eat cake day on April 2nd rather than liberation day. President Trump was not voted in to raise prices, but that's what's going to happen. Ninety percent of global trade is going to be affected by these tariffs. There is no clear plan for how to get Americans to buy American cars now. Where did that come from?

CORNISH: Right.

RUBIN: Where's the legislation for that? So, this is chaos.

CORNISH: Or you have the idea of what is an American made car when so many foreign manufacturers here and so many parts come from other places.

RUBIN: That is right.

CORNISH: I want to play one other piece of tape for you. It's from a car dealership owner. And the reason why I want to say this is because we are hearing so many descriptions of tariffs. Tariffs are actually going to make you money. Tariffs are going to give you jobs. Tariffs are actually revenues. Here is how the average person hears it who actually sells a car.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE GLASSMAN, OWNER OF CAR DEALERSHIPS AROUND DETROIT: And the manufacturers, it's going to cost them more money.

[06:50:04]

And there's no way that I foresee them not passing those costs on to me and ultimately to the consumer.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: We are going to pay - both of you with the hands. We - we are going to pay this. WARREN: Yes.

CORNISH: How many times can you tell people something else if what they're hearing in their neighborhoods is that we're going to pay this?

WARREN: I mean there is so much consensus on this among people who study the economics of tariffs.

CORNISH: So, why do they keep trying to spin it into something else?

WARREN: Because it sounds good. But that's also a misunderstanding of manufacturing in this country. For instance, there is still a lot of manufacturing in this country. There's also just a lot of cross trade. You know, one small part that gets traded to another country that can build, you know, a bigger part that then comes back to this country for a car part. That's what - that's sort of the legacy of globalization. And that's something that you don't hear from sort of anti-globalists in both parties, that it's a global economy and all this stuff works together in one system.

CORNISH: Last word to you, Joel, on this topic.

RUBIN: To use the president's term, this does not pass the common sense test.

CORNISH: Oh, OK. Mic drop.

Stay with me, you guys, because it is ten minutes to the hour. I want to give you a little bit more morning roundup. Some stories that you need to know to get your day going.

So, Elon Musk flexing his billions, handing out $1 million checks to two voters in Green Bay, Wisconsin, ahead of tomorrow's critical Supreme Court race there.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ELON MUSK, PRESIDENT TRUMP'S ADVISER: I feel like this is one of those things that - that may not seem that it's going to affect the entire destiny of humanity, but I think it will.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Musk handed out those checks ahead of voting day, he said, because it was in appreciation of two people who signed a petition against activist judges. Well over $80 million has been spent on Tuesday's race.

In New Mexico, the Republican Party said someone started a fire deliberately at their Albuquerque headquarters. It says the phrase ICE equals KKK was also spray painted on the wall. Fire officials, along with the FBI and ATF, are investigating.

And U.S. Bank believes one of its executives was on board a small plane that crashed into a home in Minnesota over the weekend, setting it on fire. The executive is presumed dead, along with five others on board. A person inside the house escaped without injury.

And another scare near Reagan National Airport. A United Airlines flight from Houston apparently striking a kite while landing over the weekend.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNITED PILOT: At the beginning of the runway there is a kite being flown. United 654.

DCA TOWNER: Use caution for a kite around short final. We just got a report there is two of them. One is like a bright yellow one.

BLUESTREAK PILOT: Even better.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: The plane landed safely with 131 people on board.

And then there's this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (January 20, 1945): At the White House in Washington, crowds gather for the inauguration of Franklin D. Roosevelt as president of the United States for a fourth term.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: So, FDR, who served for four terms - of course the Constitution has changed to not allow that to happen anymore - but will that change with President Trump? Trump told NBC News he wasn't joking when asked about seeking a third term, adding, "there are methods to it."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REPORTER: Will you clarify, are you planning to leave office January 20, 2029, or are you saying you might not?

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Go ahead, any other questions?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: The group chat is back.

I know you have talked about the idea that Trump doesn't exactly fear the Constitution, or making changes to it, or challenging it. So, how do you hear this?

COLLINSON: Well, the way that FDR got a third and fourth term was by not talking about it because he wanted to be acclaimed. Trump seems to be the exact opposite. He can't stop talking about it. I think one reason for that is, it enhances the idea that he's this great political figure and multiplies his power. Let's - CORNISH: So, do you think it's just bluster?

COLLINSON: Well, let's put this in context. They just pulled Elise Stefanik's nomination to be U.N. ambassador because they were frightened that they couldn't win her seat, which Trump won by 24 percentage points or 24 points five months ago. So, maybe talk of a third term is perhaps a little premature.

CORNISH: OK, because you're - you're saying political gravity is still real.

I want to bring it over to this side of the table.

Are you guys - we're past the era of, do we take it seriously or not seriously, right? Greenland's taking threats seriously. Canada is taking threats seriously.

WARREN: Yes, but, I mean, the method for doing this is amending the Constitution. I don't think we're at a position where we're going to be amending the Constitution. The 22nd Amendment makes it clear that a president can only serve - can only be elected to two terms. But -

CORNISH: Ah-hah, but wait, Mike Warren-

WARREN: Yes.

CORNISH: OK. Steve Bannon, the architect of all things - things had this to say about the idea.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEVE BANNON: I'm a firm believer that President Trump will run and win again in 2028.

[06:55:03]

CHRIS CUOMO, NEWS NATION: You know he's term limited. How do you think he gets another term?

BANNON: We're working on it. And I think we'll have a - I think we'll have a couple of alternatives. Let's say that. We'll see. We'll see what the definition -

CUOMO: Don't be mysterious because it's going to make people say -

BANNON: We'll see what the definition of term - we'll see what the definition of term limit is.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WARREN: I mean, OK, I would love to hear what his other definition of term limit is.

CORNISH: I mean, I think we might.

WARREN: I mean - this is ridiculous. CORNISH: What are you hearing, Rubin?

RUBIN: Well, you know, Vladimir Putin did this with Dmitri Medvedev about a decade and a half ago where he sat to the side, became prime minister. Medvedev stayed in for a term, and then Putin came back. Who knows what chicanery can happen. Donald Trump could be vice president on ticket in - in a few years and then not be elected to the office of the president for a third term, but then could come in if the president quits.

CORNISH: OK, gentlemen.

RUBIN: There are a lot of ways around this.

CORNISH: You're shaking your head. You're bringing up Russia. Both of those things sort of make sense in the context, I think.

But here's what I'm going to throw out there. If you are basically making all the lawyers around who might challenge you in the future take a seat, if you're saying all the judges are activists and shouldn't be listened to, and if you have complete and total control of the law enforcement mechanisms of this country, how does that not raise concerns, especially in progressive circles, that we are looking at someone who is laying the groundwork to even talk about this.

WARREN: I mean, I think everybody should be concerned and we should take it seriously in the sense that I imagine there are people in the White House talking about this right now.

CORNISH: They must be, yes.

WARREN: But I - I would say, for instance, this vice president, this idea that Trump could be vice president. I think if you look at the 12th Amendment, for instance, it would make him essentially ineligible to be vice president. So, for this scheme to work, you would have to go through - jump through so many hoops. I think Stephen's point about the political environment in four years is something to consider.

CORNISH: Oh, say more. Or even now, right? Those -

WARREN: Exactly. Exactly. So, I just think - I think this is something to take seriously. But I think we should also be realistic about all of the roadblocks in between that and this.

CORNISH: Yes. But we were talking during the break about how there's always a kind of a fringe legal theorist out there who's got a thought.

COLLINSON: Right. And look at all the fringe legal theorists that convinced Trump and people in the White House that he could actually challenge his loss after the 2020 election.

CORNISH: Yes.

COLLINSON: But this idea -

CORNISH: Which he did, many times, yes.

COLLINSON: Right. So - but this idea that some vice president is going to win the presidency, J.D. Vance, for example, and then decide, oh, yes, I don't want to be president, I'm going to step down so Trump can be president again, doesn't seem very likely.

CORNISH: Really? Given the loyalty around him?

COLLINSON: No.

WARREN: I mean, but what you're - when you're president, you're just going to step aside for - for Trump? Give me a break.

RUBIN: You know, like (INAUDIBLE) - yes, (INAUDIBLE) he's doing is he's freezing the field. He's making it clear that he wants to be the leader in a few years. And everybody's going to have to decide if they're loyal to that. And I guarantee he's going to have a lot of tests coming up on that question.

CORNISH: OK, I don't want to belabor this because you guys are going to tell us what to keep an eye on this week. I want to start with you.

RUBIN: Sure. On Saturday, April 5th, a big grassroots mobilization is happening amongst progressives and Democrats. This is really a sign that energy and -

CORNISH: Isn't that the Bernie Sanders thing? This is another thing?

RUBIN: No, it's not, although it's certainly building off of that momentum. It's a sign the grassroots across the country are fed up with what they see coming out of Washington and they're going to make some strong statements, in particular focusing on health care, Social Security and Medicare, about keeping - Trump keeping his hands off of those programs.

CORNISH: Can I ask, do you know who's organizing it?

RUBIN: It's a whole mixed group.

CORNISH: IT's a coalition.

RUBIN: It's like literally it's going to be a total mixed bag of every issue under the sun.

CORNISH: OK.

Mike Warren.

WARREN: Tomorrow there's some elections, actually.

CORNISH: I heard.

WARREN: Yes.

CORNISH: Yes. WARREN: There's not just the Wisconsin supreme court election. There's a couple of special elections for House seats. Michael Waltz's House seat and Matt Gaetz's House seat. These are Republican seats. Democrats have raised a lot of money for those seats. I'm not expecting Democrats to actually win those elections, but I do want to look at the margins. And, of course, what happens in that Wisconsin supreme court race as well. Is that an indication that Trumps political position is weakened?

CORNISH: So far the indication has been money, right, that the Democratic Congressional Committee has raised a fair amount.

WARREN: Money. Oh, yes. And they've raised a lot of money as well. And Elon Musk is - has backed that in the supreme court election as well. I just want to see what those final margins are.

CORNISH: Yes.

WARREN: And what does that tell us about the political environment?

CORNISH: Stephen, I always want to know what you're looking for.

COLLINSON: Marine Le Pen, the leader of the far right in France -

CORNISH: Yes.

COLLINSON: Was just found guilty of embezzlement. She was banned immediately from running for re-election. The question is, does that rule her out of the 2027 presidential election in France when she has her best chance that she's ever had for what used to be the national front, now it's the national rally of winning. I think you're going to hear her forces say it's a hoax, just like they tried to do to Trump. They're trying to stop her running. And its going to be interesting to see how someone like the vice president plays into this.

CORNISH: J.D. Vance.

COLLINSON: J.D. Vance.

CORNISH: Because he has been vocal about the politics in Europe, and going there.

COLLINSON: Right. And - right. And he's been trying to undermine the more mainstream parties in favor of the populist parties in France. So, I'm going to be looking to see what he says about that, too.

[07:00:00]

CORNISH: Do you have - do - are we going to learn more about that? We only have a verdict so far today.

COLLINSON: There's a verdict, but she was banned in the interim from running for election. The question is, does that last until the 2027 election in France?

CORNISH: All right, you guys, thank you so much for sticking around. We talked about a lot today. We covered a lot of ground for a Monday. I hope you feel like you're ready for the week.

I want to thank you for waking up with me. I'm Audie Cornish. And "CNN NEWS CENTRAL" starts right now.