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Isa Soares Tonight

Senators Grill Trump Defense Pick Pete Hegseth At Confirmation Hearing; Qatar: Israel And Hamas Nearing A Ceasefire-Hostage Deal; Protesters Gather In Tel Aviv Calling For Release Of All Hostages; Hopes Rise For Gaza Ceasefire-Hostage Deal; Dangerous Winds Returns to L.A.; Millions Of Hindus Gathering At Religious Festival. Aired 2-3p ET

Aired January 14, 2025 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:00:00]

ISA SOARES, HOST, ISA SOARES TONIGHT: Hello and a warm welcome, everyone, I'm Isa Soares, very good evening. You have been watching our special

coverage of the Senate confirmation hearing for Defense Secretary nominee Pete Hegseth. Hegseth, who is a former "Fox News" host as well as a

decorated combat veteran has faced, as you've been seeing here on our air, some 4 hours and 50 minutes or so, of really intense questioning.

He has called today the most important deployment of his life, those were his words. And as you've been watching here on CNN, has been grilled on a

possible invasion of Greenland, the military's combat readiness, women in combat roles and comments he's made previously on this, as well as ending,

quote, "wokeness within the ranks", plus sexual assault and substance abuse allegations that have been leveled against him, which he denies. Here's a

short clip.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. TIM KAINE (D-VA): Many of your work colleagues have said that you show up for work under the influence of alcohol or drunk. I know you've denied

that. But you would agree with me, right? That if that was the case, that would be disqualifying for somebody to be Secretary of Defense.

PETE HEGSETH, NOMINEE FOR U.S. SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: Senator, those are all anonymous false claims, and the totality --

KAINE: They're not -- they're not anonymous. The letter is on the record --

HEGSETH: We see here --

KAINE: They're not anonymous on the record.

HEGSETH: People who --

(CROSSTALK)

HEGSETH: Freedom --

KAINE: We've seen records with names attached to them, concerned vets for America and "Fox News".

HEGSETH: Attributing to me been --

KAINE: One of your -- one of your colleagues said --

HEGSETH: Working hard every day --

KAINE: One on behalf --

HEGSETH: My mission --

KAINE: One of your colleagues --

SEN. MARKWAYNE MULLIN (R-OK): You've got a man who has literally put his butt on the line. He served 20 years in the service, multiple deployments,

has heard the bullets crack over the top of his head, has been willing to go into combat, been willing it seemed. Friends die for this country, and

he's willing to still put himself through this.

His wife is willing to still stand beside him, knowing he wasn't perfect, knowing that all this was going to be brought up and he's still willing to

serve the country. What other qualifications does he need?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SOARES: Well, lots to discuss with CNN Politics senior reporter Stephen Collinson. And Stephen, it's certainly intense questioning as we heard for

the past four hours. He was defiant throughout. How do you think he fared?

[14:05:00]

STEPHEN COLLINSON, CNN POLITICS SENIOR REPORTER: I think that President- elect Donald Trump will be very happy with the way he fared, because he showed the qualities that Trump is looking for. Trump isn't necessarily

looking for a national security expert. He's looking for someone who will fight Democrats, who will fight what he perceives as wokeness and diversity

in the military, and will stand up for Trump.

And that is exactly what Hegseth showed. On the other hand, I think a lot of the questions did raise fresh questions about his qualification for the

job in any conventional sense. Clearly, some of the issues that he raised on policy that he was asked about, for example, he was asked about ASEAN,

the Association of Southeast Asian Nations, and he thought that South Korea was a member of that.

Given that Asia is perhaps the most likely place that U.S. forces might tumble into a war, that seems to be a slightly worrying admission on issues

like whether he would accept an order from President Trump to invade Panama or Greenland, or to order American troops to shoot protesters in the legs

on U.S. soil.

He couldn't give any answers. He didn't really have any answers on Ukraine. So, I think what it shows us is that this is a political appointment, he is

being appointed --

SOARES: Yes --

COLLINSON: To fight culture wars in the Pentagon rather than necessarily for the duties that we expect of a U.S. Defense Secretary.

SOARES: And as we've heard for the past four hours, a lot of the questioning on both sides was very much along partisan lines. I mean, the

clips we just played just show that on what each side wanted to focus on. I heard Sir Roger Wicker; chairman of the committee, he was saying, you know,

this was a tour de force, a takedown.

Just tell -- on the Democrat side, though, just give us a sense of what we heard, because they really pushed him on his views about women in combat,

in particular Elizabeth Warren pushing him on that because he previously had said that women should be barred from combat roles. How did he explain

himself because quite a turnaround?

COLLINSON: Well, he turned around to some extent. In the past, he said that women shouldn't be involved in combat roles. He showed some contrition in

this hearing. He said that women were a vital part of working on the battlefield, and he said that women should be allowed in combat roles just

as long as they are as capable as men -- in not so many words, in terms of the actual hand-to-hand fighting.

So, I think he left himself a little bit of an out there on the issue of whether women were as capable as men in close-fighting. But certainly, he

did pull back on that. And one of the reasons for that was because he got a lot of concern from Iowa Senator Joni Ernst, who is herself a veteran, who

before Christmas was making it clear that she was wondering whether or not, she would vote to confirm Hegseth.

She came under an exceeding amount of pressure, especially from the conservative media and outside groups. During this hearing, she seemed a

lot more accommodating towards Hegseth. They had several meetings, and it seems to me that she's going to be willing to vote for him, which really

helps his chances of confirmation in a full Senate vote.

SOARES: Stephen Collinson, I appreciate you being with us to talk us through what we heard the past four hours or so. Thank you, Stephen.

COLLINSON: Thanks.

SOARES: Our other top story this hour, and we take you to Qatar where we are waiting for news of a ceasefire as well as hostage deal between Israel

and Hamas. Qatar says the two sides are the closest they've been in months, their words. And an Egyptian official tells CNN, they're now waiting for

Hamas to respond. And that answer really could come at any time.

And sources tell CNN that Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu will hold an urgent meeting with his security officials to discuss the deal. The

draft agreement calls for a phased-end to the fighting, in the first phase, an initial 42-day ceasefire. Hamas is expected to free, as you can see

there, 33 hostages in exchange for the release of hundreds of Palestinian prisoners.

Then a second phase of negotiations will end the war -- to end the war will begin. And that is according to Israeli sources. In Israel, meantime,

protesters and as well as hostage families have been gathering in hostage squares. You can see there, and in Gaza, Palestinians are also hoping for a

deal to end more than 15 months of deadly conflict, which has decimated their homes as well as their lives in Gaza.

Officials from the Trump and the Biden administrations have been working with mediators, we understand in Doha. Earlier, U.S. Secretary of State

Antony Blinken said he's confident that a deal will happen. Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANTONY BLINKEN, SECRETARY OF STATE, UNITED STATES: Our intensive efforts have brought us to the brink of full and final agreement. On Sunday, the

United States, Qatar and Egypt put forward a final proposal. The ball is now in Hamas' court. If Hamas accepts, the deal is ready to be concluded

and implemented. I believe we will get a ceasefire.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[14:10:00]

SOARES: Jeremy Diamond joins us from Tel Aviv with more. Jeremy, I mean, we have been here before, but does this time feel different to you? Just give

us a sense of where you are and the mood on the ground as we see this optimism about the ceasefire and hostage deal.

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: Well, Isa, as you can see behind me, thousands of people have come out to what has become known for

the last 15 months as hostage square here in Tel Aviv. And tonight, at this moment where Israel and Hamas appear to be on the cusp of a ceasefire and

hostage release deal, these people have come out here to show their support for that deal, of course, but also really to be together in this moment of

incredible hope and opportunity, but also uncertainty.

You know, in speaking with people here tonight, you get the sense that they are only just beginning to allow themselves to feel that sense of hope, to

feel that sense of optimism that this time, this deal may actually be the real one, may actually be the one that gets across the finish line, and

that for so many here, gets their loved ones to come home after 465 days of captivity and counting.

I spoke tonight with the uncle of Yarden Bibas, who you may remember as being the father of those two red-headed babies, Kfir and Ariel. It has

been six months since they saw a video of him alive in Gaza, a hostage video that Hamas released. His uncle told me that tonight he is feeling

frightened, very frightened, he said, of the possibility that these talks could collapse, but also, of course, about what kind of state they will

actually come back in if indeed he comes back alive.

What kind of mental condition, what kind of physical condition that nearly 500 days of captivity may actually do to a person. And so, with that hope

and optimism, there is also the concern about what kind of condition these hostages will actually come out in. Keep in mind, last time we saw hostage

release deal at the end of November of 2023, it had only, and I say only relatively to now.

It had only been, you know, 50 or so days of captivity. And now, we are talking about more than 465 days, months on end, without seeing sunlight

for many of these hostages. And so, again, there is that concern, but also very much a hope tonight that this deal can actually get across the finish

line. Isa.

SOARES: And I can't imagine how nerve-wracking, how painful and hard these 465 days have been for these families. But we also know, Jeremy, that only

33 hostages will be released. Do we know at this stage, Jeremy, at what point these families will find out if their loved one or loved ones will be

part -- will be coming home?

DIAMOND: Well, certainly, the families are aware of a list of 34 hostages that was circulating in recent weeks that appears to be the basis for the

33 who will get out, plus, one additional hostage whose body was recovered last week by the Israeli military. But of course, even those families are

not giving themselves the chance to hope that they will actually see their loved ones until they actually see them cross into Israeli territory, get

on a helicopter and be reunited with their families at one of the hospitals here in Tel Aviv.

In terms of the order of the release, if you think back to last year when we saw that initial week-long ceasefire, it was day-by-day as family

members found out, and it may very well be a similar situation here. The only real indicator that people have is the fact that this first stage of

33 will be women, children.

It will also include those female soldiers who were taken captive from a military base right along the Gaza border. Men over the age of 50 years old

as well as those hostages who have been deemed to be ill or severely wounded. And so, that will give the families some sense. It will also be

very clear to the families of male Israeli soldiers who are being held by Hamas, as well as the families of many of the younger men, that they will

not be seeing their loved ones released in this first stage of the deal.

And that's also why tonight we are hearing calls from the hostage families for this to be a continuous deal for Israel to see through the six-week

ceasefire, and immediately enter that second phase of this deal that could see the remainder of the hostages released, and also, of course, an end to

this war in Gaza.

SOARES: Indeed, hanging on to hope. Jeremy Diamond for us in Tel Aviv there, thanks, Jeremy. Well, as Jeremy Diamond was just saying there,

Israeli officials says the first phase of this potential deal would be the release of hostages who have been held captive by Hamas.

[14:15:00]

That's more than a year or so, 251 people were taken from Israel in October the 7th in 2023, 157 hostages have been recovered, but 94 people are still

in Gaza. Of those taken by Hamas on October the 7th, at least, 34 hostages are believed to be dead. Israeli officials say Hamas is expected to release

33 hostages during the first phase, and at the same time, hundreds of Palestinian prisoners are said to be released from Israeli jails.

And protesters being gathering, you saw there, Jeremy, surrounded by people, also gathering earlier in Tel Aviv, calling for the release, not

just of the 34, but of all hostages. And some are holding signs, bearing photos of the hostages, others read stop the bloody war and everyone is a

humanitarian case.

And for about 15 grueling months now, the hostages' family have been pressing the Israeli government for their loved ones to make a safe return

home.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GIL DICKMANN, COUSIN KILLED IN HAMAS CAPTIVITY: We are still waiting and we are demanding from Prime Minister Netanyahu, from Qatar, from President-

elect Trump to agree upon all the stages of negotiation and get all the hostages back. We don't want more hostages left behind, and we don't want

to hear about more hostages being killed in captivity like my cousin.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SOARES: Let's bring in Alon Pinkas; a former Israeli Consul General in New York, a well-known face here on the show. Alon, really great to have you

back on the show. As you heard there from our Jeremy Diamond, we're hearing optimism, hope, the closest they've been in months is what we've heard so

far. Is this it? What are you hearing? What is your sense?

ALON PINKAS, ISRAELI DIPLOMAT & FORMER ISRAELI CONSUL GENERAL IN NEW YORK: Well, Isa, it's -- you know, the cliche is we've been there before and

we're disillusioned and surprised for the worst when deals did not materialize. There is a sense now that the convergence of the U.S.

political timetable, meaning Donald Trump's inauguration next week and Qatar's mediation efforts have brought together the situation to a point

where there is a place for optimism.

Now, you've heard Secretary of State Blinken saying that he believes there will be a deal and it depends on Hamas. You can infer from that, that he

knows for a fact that Israel already agreed to this. Today, Qatari sources said that Hamas is on the verge of agreeing to it. So, we should know in

the next 12, 24 hours where this is headed.

So, yes, there is a sense of optimism, but people are not allowing themselves to be -- you know, too happy because they have seen this and

been disappointed deeply before.

SOARES: Yes, cautious optimism. I mean, I heard an interview, Alon, today on the radio with a hostage family member who basically said that the deal

-- that this deal was the same that was on the table earlier in the year, right? That so many --

PINKAS: Oh, yes --

SOARES: Lives, she said, could have been spared on both sides. She made this very clear. So, what is attractive about this deal now? I know you

wrote an editorial in "Haaretz" saying the Gaza ceasefire and hostage deal is the same one from eight months ago. So, why did --

PINKAS: Yes --

SOARES: Netanyahu accept it now? Try and answer that question. Why did he accept it now? Is Trump a factor here?

PINKAS: Well, the only factor is Trump. Look, Mr. Netanyahu has been prosecuting this war without clear and coherent and attainable political

goals since day one. There were military goals. Yes. There was a -- there were military objectives attainable? Yes. There were no political goals. If

you recall, in December of '23 and again in January of '24, and again in March of 2024, President Biden three times presented a post-war Gaza

political framework that began with a ceasefire and a hostage deal.

One -- in one of those instances, he was actually candid enough, President Biden, to say this was presented to me and agreed to by Prime Minister

Netanyahu, who less than 48 hours reneged on it. So, Mr. Netanyahu at first wanted to protract the war, you know, putting a floating around all these

cliches about total victory and eradication of Hamas and obliteration and annihilation, et cetera.

Then, as we got nearer to the American election, he thought he could milk this war for his own political reasons. Once Mr. Trump won in November, and

said and made it clear three times that he wants this wrapped up before he enters the White House on January 20th.

[14:20:00]

Then Mr. Netanyahu was under severe -- under serious pressure given also, Isa, that the outgoing dismissed since Defense Minister Yoav Gallant, as

well as the top echelon of the IDF, the Israel Defense Forces, have told Netanyahu time and time again that the war exhausted its usefulness. That

given --

SOARES: Yes --

PINKAS: What the military objectives are, this needs to stop. Now, there's one more thing, why are the families somewhat agitated? Well, we know why

they're agitated --

SOARES: Yes --

PINKAS: I mean, no one can fathom what they're going through because no -- because many of them are skeptical, as are many in the public, that there's

going to be a phase two. No one knows --

SOARES: Yes --

PINKAS: That the ceasefire --

SOARES: This --

PINKAS: Will hold.

SOARES: And this was going to be my question, I'm glad you brought it up. You were talking about milking the war, right? This is only -- if this gets

approved, this is only, Alon, the first phase of the ordeal. Already we've heard far-right Minister Itamar Ben-Gvir trying to scuttle it, right?

Trying to bring down -- collapse the government.

One, do you think that he can scuttle this deal? And what does it mean for the second phase? Because, I mean, the idea that phase one will lead to

phase two, I mean, that's a big question mark here.

PINKAS: A huge question mark. And it's a great question -- I'm sorry, it's a great question, Isa, that you asked because this is what I suspect Mr.

Netanyahu is going to say to his right wing, Messianic ministers in order to placate them. He's going to wink at them and say, don't worry about it,

guys. The ceasefire will not hold.

We've got to agree to this. There's going to be a phase one. There's no need for an unnecessary drama. Don't make anything that's irreversible

politically -- there -- this won't last because the ceasefire won't last. He's going to try and use the same language when speaking to what I would

imagine, would be -- and upset President Trump sometime in the next 2-3 months and say, well, you know, I did what you asked me. I tried my best,

but you know who we're dealing with. It's Hamas.

So, the idea that this ceasefire will hold for 42 days to allow for the beginning at least, and the completion and eventually of the -- of the

second phase, remains in serious doubt. And what really upsets people is that this deal, almost verbatim, Isa --

SOARES: Yes --

PINKAS: Is the deal that could have been struck in March and May and again in July.

SOARES: And if we look back at the numbers, thousands of lives could have been spared on both sides if this agreement --

PINKAS: But I'll tell you, worse than that, if --

SOARES: Yes --

PINKAS: If the 20th amendment to the U.S. constitution did not determine the 20th of January as inauguration day, but rather said it would be the

9th of January, then scores of people on both sides --

SOARES: Yes --

PINKAS: Would be alive.

SOARES: Alon Pinkas as always, thank you --

PINKAS: It's that date, the 20th.

SOARES: That dictates -- there seems to be dictating this, isn't it? Thanks very much, Alon, appreciate --

PINKAS: Yes --

SOARES: It as always, your analysis. Well, for months --

PINKAS: Thank you --

SOARES: You're very welcome. And for months and months, the people of Gaza have gone to bed each night wondering if they will make it to the morning

alive. A ceasefire would, of course, bring relief from the relentless Israeli bombings that have created -- well, look at the screens,

apocalyptic scenes like the ones you're looking at.

But for so many Palestinians, life as they knew it is gone. Many won't have homes to return to after the war, but they're still determined to reclaim

whatever may be left. Our Paula Hancocks looks at what may be ahead for the people of Gaza the day after a ceasefire.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PAULA HANCOCKS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): This is the closest these girls can get to going to school in Gaza, trying to teach each other in a

school building-turned displacement center, desperate for an end to the war, which abruptly stopped their education, their safety, their normality

15 months ago. Saba Ahmed Abu Huda(ph) remembers her friends, girls, she says, were killed in Beit Hanoun at the start of the war.

"We used to play together", she says. "Make lunch, do our homework and study. We did everything together. I'm sad I won't find them when I go

home." Noor(ph) is 12 years old and has been displaced. She says, seven times during this war, she wants to go home to see what happened to her

school friend, who she hasn't heard from for a year after her home was destroyed.

"I just want to go home", she says. "I want my belongings, my toys, my memories." Northern Gaza has been decimated by Israeli airstrikes in recent

months. There's no guarantee Noor's(ph) family will have a home to go back to. Abdulrahman Salama(ph) digs through the rubble of his home in Khan

Younis, hoping to find a blanket or a mattress, anything to help his family living in a tent by the Winter sea.

[14:25:00]

"There are no memories", he says. "Our life has vanished. There's no future." He calls negotiations lies, saying "we celebrate a little until we

see a drone strike, an artillery shell hit with a quadcopter shoot at us."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (SPEAKING IN FOREIGN LANGUAGE) --

HANCOCKS: Abu Samir(ph) walks through his neighborhood, a place he says residents no longer recognize. He asks about the day after. "Let's say a

truce happens", he says and the residents of this area return. Where do they go? Is this area fit for humans to live in? Ahmad Salama(ph) tries to

repair one room in his destroyed home, mixing sand and water to make clay. He says he kept waiting to do this, thinking negotiation would work, but he

now needs to move his family from a tent on the coast which collapses every time it rains.

"They say the same thing every time", he says, "but nothing happens. We want anything. Anything is better than this." With 90 percent of the

population displaced, the dream of going home is prevalent even when they know their home is likely just rubble. Mohammed Abu Ubayd(ph) knows her

house is unlikely to have survived in the largely leveled city of Rafah in the south.

"I swear when the ceasefire comes", she says, "I will celebrate and rejoice and I will not sleep all night. We hope that this cloud of despair finally

lifts. Hope and despair go hand-in-hand in Gaza. "A ceasefire has been close before, and yet the bombs still fell. Paula Hancocks, CNN, Abu Dhabi.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SOARES: And our thanks to Paula for that report. And still to come tonight, much more, of course, on the confirmation hearing for Donald Trump's pick

for Defense Secretary. Senators have been grilling Pete Hegseth about his plans for U.S. national security. We'll bring you the very latest. Plus, it

has been a critical day for firefighters in Los Angeles.

We'll tell you about the new threat that they are facing. Both those stories after this short break. You are watching CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:30:05]

SOARES: We're to take you back to Washington D.C. now, and that contentious hearing for Donald Trump's choice to lead the Pentagon. Pete Hegseth, a

decorated military veteran as well as former Fox News host, has been getting public support from a number of Republicans during the confirmation

hearing with the Senate Armed Services Committee.

It lasted about four hours. And so, for us, 15. He's also getting -- been getting some questions on issues like national security from some

Democrats. Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. MAZIE HIRONO (D-HI): Would you use our military to take over Greenland or an ally of Denmark?

PETE HEGSETH, U.S. DEFENSE SECRETARY NOMINEE: Senator, one of the things that President Trump is so good at is never strategically tipping his hand.

And so, I would never in this public forum give one way or another direct - -

HIRONO: Oh, that's --

HEGSETH: -- what orders the president would give me in any context.

HIRONO: That sounds to me that you would contemplate carrying out such an order.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SOARES: Just some of the questions he was peppered with. Lauren Fox joining me now from Capitol Hill. And Lauren, we're seeing that several people

telling CNN that Team Trump feels good, I think, about the hearing. What are we learning?

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. I mean, obviously, one of the big objectives for Pete Hegseth today was to remain calm and collected

under pressure. Repeatedly, he was peppered with questions about his past, including an alleged sexual assault, which he has denied on multiple

occasions. He was never charged with sexual assault, we should note.

But you know, Democrats also peppered him with questions repeatedly over past comments that he made, about the role that women should serve in

combat. He clarified past comments saying that his view now is that women can serve in combat roles if they meet the same standards as men. He did

not clarify precisely what those standards were.

But time and time again, you also just heard from Democrats of frustration with the fact that despite the fact that Hegseth met with the top Democrat

on the committee, Jack Reed, he did not meet with several other Democrats who had requested meetings with him, including Gary Peters and Elizabeth

Warren.

Meanwhile, all eyes were on Senator Joni Ernst. She's a Republican who serves on that committee. She's a veteran herself and a sexual assault

survivor who had initially said she had a lot of questions for Pete Hegseth before her initial meetings with him. She subsequently had two different

meetings with Pete Hegseth.

And she said during her time of questioning with him today at the committee hearing that they had had several frank discussions, and she asked Hegseth

to repeat on the record that that is, in fact, what had happened behind closed doors. But then her subsequent questions were much friendlier. They

both agreed on his evolved view on women serving in combat. And again, I just think that speaks to the fact that Hegseth seems like at least with

the Republicans on this committee. He is in a good position to get support next week and get at least sent to the United States Senate's floor.

SOARES: Yes, certainly fell along partisan lines from what I saw. Lauren Fox, appreciate it. Thank you, Lauren.

And still to come tonight, Israel and Hamas are both signaling they are ready for a Gaza ceasefire and hostage deal. We'll have the latest on a

potential breakthrough. That is ahead for you.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:35:00]

SOARES: Back now to one of our top stories this hour. A source tells CNN Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu will hold an urgent meeting with

top security officials on a potential deal for Gaza's ceasefire and hostage release.

Qatar, which is hosting indirect negotiations, says a draft agreement is now in the hands of both Israel and Hamas. Multiple parties said the two

sides are closer than ever to an agreement, their words. An Egyptian official tells CNN Hamas hasn't yet responded to the draft deal, but Qatari

spokesperson says an announcement could be coming soon. Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAJED AL-ANSARI, QATARI FOREIGN MINISTRY SPOKESPERSON (through translator): Today, we are the closest point to reach a deal than in any time in the

past months. Any talks about the time of implementing the ceasefire will depend on its announcement, which we hope it will be sooner than later. But

as mentioned earlier, this is a negotiation and is still a fluid state.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SOARES: Well, the agreement calls for a phased end to the fighting that has decimated Gaza and killed tens of thousands of Palestinians in the first

phase, an initial 42-day ceasefire. Hamas is expected to free 33 hostages in exchange for the release of hundreds of Palestinian prisoners.

Demonstrators have been out tonight, you saw the top of the show, in the streets of Tel Aviv calling for the release of all hostages in Gaza. Some

have been chanting, there'll be no victory without the last hostage. Others are carrying signs saying, stop the bloody war.

Joining us now is H.A. Hellyer senior associate fellow at the Royal United Services Institute for Defense and Security Studies. A well-known face here

on this show. H.A., great to have you back on the show.

H.A. HELLYER, SENIOR ASSOCIATE FELLOW, ROYAL UNITED SERVICES INSTITUTE: Thank you.

SOARES: Look, I think from what you've seen -- you've been hearing it, too, optimism, it seems from both sides on a deal and it's certainly, from what

we've been hearing, feels closer than we've ever been. But I know there's a lot of fragility around this. But I did see something that you tweeted, you

said, it is only a ceasefire if Israel commits to stopping the war and withdrawing troops. Otherwise, this is purely PR.

So, let me ask you this, from what you have seen so far and what you're hearing, you understand of the deal, the details of these negotiations, is

this a ceasefire deal or is this PR?

HELLYER: Well, thank you, Isa, for having me on the program. It's always a pleasure to be here. The truth is, I think that it will be incredibly

likely that within the next two to three days tops, we will see the signing of a deal. That deal will come in three phases. I find it incredibly

unlikely that we're going to go beyond phase one of that deal.

Phase one will include the exchange of prisoners. Phase one may involve some redeployment of the IDF, but within Gaza. But in terms of a commitment

to have some sort of binding process that leads to the end of the war and not the resumption of hostilities, I find that very dubious for anybody to

take seriously.

[14:40:00]

Based on all the statements that we've seen from the Israelis within the Israeli press, I find this very, very unlikely. And also, it doesn't match

with all the movements that we've seen on the ground over the past more than a year, the Israelis haven't simply bombed -- they have bombed most,

if not all of the territory of Gaza, wreaking destruction on so much of the territory, but they've also set up new infrastructure and they've

permanentized a lot of the military presence in the territory, and that hasn't changed, and I don't think it's going to.

So, is a PR? I think a part of it -- a very big part of it is PR. The return of the prisoners -- hostages, prisoners on both the Palestinian and

the Israeli sides I think it's something that a lot of people, both in Palestinian communities as well as Israeli communities, will take very

seriously. And I think that's completely natural and in keeping with that part of it.

But in terms of ending the wall and withdrawal and committing to that, I don't see that happening. I haven't seen any evidence for it, in which case

this isn't a ceasefire, it's a pause in order to complete a hostage negotiation.

SOARES: Yes. And I was speaking to Alon Pinkas, who I know, you know, just at the top of the show, and of course, from some of the hostages, the fear

is they're calling for all of them to be returned home because that is their fear, they fear that this will be phase one and then phase two -- I

mean, phase one may not necessarily lead to phase two. And that is the biggest concern. But that speaks to the politics of what we're likely to

expect between President-Elect Trump and Prime Minister Netanyahu. And indeed, the pressures within his own government here, H.A.

HELLYER: The pressures are parts of it, but to be quite honest with you, I think it's a very small part of it. In the sense that the Israeli

government has made it very clear, with or without that element of the far- right, which of course is very significant and substantial in Israeli politics, that they do not intend on leaving Gaza.

So, it's not simply, you know, one or two bad apples trying to push. Of course, the official policy of the Netanyahu government is that they're not

going to settle Gaza. But there hasn't been any stated declaration from the Netanyahu government that they're going to stop people from settling there

either. OK. So, that's one thing.

But when it comes to withdrawing troops on the ground, no, they've made it very clear that they will maintain, quote/unquote, "security control" of

the entirety of the territory, even in this ceasefire deal that's being proposed in the three phases, this talk of buffer zones. These buffer zones

would remain under direct immediate Israeli control and it reduces the territory of Gaza. And that's presuming that everything, quote/unquote,

"goes well" according to the phases.

SOARES: Yes.

HELLYER: So, I really think people have to be very, very clear that if there's going to be any genuine ceasefire, it will require a huge amount of

American pressure on the Israelis to actually enforce a move to phase two and phase three. Without one, it's not happening.

SOARES: I'm glad you brought it up. Are we likely to see that pressure from the upcoming administration? And I don't know if you know this, but do we

have any news on this front in terms of who will implement these phases? Who will be overseeing the implementation of these phases, H.A.?

HELLYER: So, the mediators have -- I won't say they leaked, but this has been reported in the press that there will be different parties, including

Egypt, the United States, I think Qatar was mentioned as well, in terms of being involved in monitoring the process, but it doesn't matter.

Enforcement is enforcement.

And the only power that the Israelis will listen to in terms of enforcement is the United States, and there's absolutely no reason for anybody to

assume that the Trump administration is going to force Israel to have a different policy on phase two and phase three.

On the contrary, we've actually seen reports in the Israeli press over the last 24 hours that suggests that Trump has already -- or at least the Trump

in -- the incoming administration has already made it clear to Netanyahu that if once phase one gets underway, so a deal has, quote/unquote, "been

agreed," if once it gets underway, he decides that no, actually, he's got to continue the war, that the Trump administration would back him.

Again, these are unconfirmed, but they're in the Israeli press. And I think that we have to take those sorts of things as indicative, at least, of a

certain type of mood.

[14:45:00]

You keep in mind that when it comes to the Trump administration, the figures that have already been announced as part of his incoming

administration, when it comes to the subject of Israel, are certainly not people who are on the left, are certainly not people who are talking about

a two-state solution or the removal of settlements or applying accountability to the Israelis because of the war, nothing like that.

On the contrary, the talk is far more radical in that regard. A two-state solution out the window. Annexation of the West Bank. Not even calling the

West Bank, calling a Judean scenario And those are Trump officials coming in. So, I think people should be realistic about what to expect

SOARES: And these are some of the points that the secretary of state, Blinken, brought up when we heard from him today. H.A., always appreciate

hearing from you and getting your analysis. Thank you very much.

HELLYER: Thank you so much.

SOARES: And still to come tonight, we are live in Los Angeles tracking, of course, the new threat firefighters are now facing. We'll bring you the

very latest.

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SOARES: Welcome back, everyone. Today is going to be a critical day in the battle to stop the Los Angeles wildfires. Officials are expecting high

winds over the next 24 hours and new smaller fires are breaking out. The wind could hurt fire crews on really two fronts. It risks finding the

flames and shifting them in new directions. It can also ground firefighting aircraft, which, of course, crucial to getting these deadly blazes under

control.

The Palisades and Eaton Fires already among the worst in California history, and they are still burning, believe it or not. There are at least

24 confirmed deaths with dozens more missing and about 88,000 people have been ordered to evacuate.

Let's get more from our Stephanie Elam who's been doing, her and her team, terrific work on this story. Stephanie, I mean, serious concerns over these

hurricane force winds. Give us a sense of what you are seeing on the ground and what we expected to see you believe from officials in the coming hours,

they're preparing for this.

STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes. Isa, a one good thing, as I can say, is that they expect strong winds, but not to be nearly as strong as

those hurricane force winds that we saw last week, which is the good news.

The bad news is, you're right, if it gets above 30 miles per hour, then those aircraft will be grounded. And over the weekend, we saw that made a

huge difference in knocking down front of the Palisades Fires because they were able to attack it from the air. It makes all the difference. With one

drop of one of those planes, they could drop 4,000 gallons of fire retardant.

[14:50:00]

They can drop anywhere between 700 and 1,500 gallons of water from some of the helicopters. So, it's important to be able to do that.

So, this is why people are being warned to evacuate, be prepared to evacuate because it's not just these fires, it's the Palisades Fire, the

Eaton Fire, other little fires that have popped up, it's that these -- another fire could pop off when these winds pick up. And so, they want

people to be prepared to get out when officials tell them to.

This is the aftermath. This is just one block here in Pacific Palisades. It's now a beautiful blue day. So, you don't see -- it doesn't -- you know,

it sits differently with the eye when you see it now, because it's such a juxtaposition when you see such damage up against this pretty blue day, and

I can see out to the ocean on one direction here.

But this is why they want people to heed these warnings. Take them seriously, because you look at these cars that are burned out and you can

just see how quickly it goes. And, you know, you talk about the Eaton Fire is now the second most destructive fire and the fifth deadliest, according

to CAL FIRE.

So, this fire, the Eaton Fire on the east side of the city, has burned more than 14,000 acres and 7,000 structures and has killed 16 people so far. But

then you look at the Palisades Fire where I am, this is the fourth most destructive and the 14th deadliest, but it's 23,000 acres and it has

destroyed 5,000 structures. And they do believe that eight people have been killed here.

So, just in perspective, the Eaton Fire just by size is more damaging. But at the same time, when you are people who live here and you just look

around and you see all of this damage everywhere, on both sides of the street, block after block after block, it's hard to see how -- where do

they begin and how long it's going to take to begin to recover and repair?

And they're trying to make it easier for people here by cutting back some of the red tape to make it easier for these people to start to rebuild,

once they can. But first, we need to get out of the fire threat and we need to get these fires knocked down. And they continue to put more resources to

do that.

SOARES: And it's just so striking seeing those charred homes, of course, against that stunning blue backdrop. Of course, and like you said, and like

we've been hearing officials, the worst is not over. Of course, they're still wanting to contain this. Stephanie Elam, to you and your team, thank

you very much.

And still to come tonight, millions of Hindus are traveling to one of the biggest religious ceremonies in the world for a special ritual in the Holy

Rivers. That's next.

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[14:55:00]

SOARES: Millions of Hindu devotees are coming together at one of the world's largest religious gatherings. They are celebrating the beginning of

the Maha Kumbh Mela in India. 400 million people are expected to attend this sacred picture festival, which happens every 12 years and lasts about

six weeks.

Attendees, you can say, will bathe in the confluence of three holy rivers to purify their sins and get closer to spiritual liberation. And this

morning, many Hindu holy men bathed naked in the waters as part of the key moment at the start of the festival. The festival was recognized by UNESCO

in 2017 as an intangible cultural heritage of humanity. Beautiful scenes to be seen there out of India.

And that does it for us. A very busy night here on the show. Do -- thank you very much for your company. In the meantime, do stay right here.

Newsroom with Jim Sciutto is up next. I shall see you tomorrow. Bye-bye.

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