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The Situation Room

Interview with Rep. Hakeem Jeffries (D-NY); Interview with Houston, Texas, Police Chief Art Acevedo; White House Announces Immigration Bill; Shifting Vaccine Timelines; Texas Blackout; White House Says, Weather Causing Delays in Vaccine Shipments and Deliveries; NASA's "Perseverance" Rover Lands on Mars in Major Step Toward Search for Signs of Life. Aired 6-7p ET

Aired February 18, 2021 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[18:00:00]

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: Welcome to our viewers here in the United States and around the world. I'm Wolf Blitzer in THE SITUATION ROOM.

We're following breaking news on the winter weather crisis in Texas. The governor, Greg Abbott, says he just signed a major new disaster declaration and is awaiting approval by President Biden. He says 325,000 homes in Texas are without power for a fourth straight day.

But massive outages are easing, with electricity restored to some two million homes. Abbott now says he takes responsibility for the power debacle, pledging to reform the independent organization that operates the state's power grid.

Meantime, the winter misery is spreading across the nation. In the South, more than 22 million people are under a hard freeze warning tonight. And 100 million Americans in all are under some kind of winter weather alert from the South up into the East Coast.

Let's go straight to our national correspondent, Camila Bernal, in Dallas for us.

Camila, Texas is still suffering -- you know that better than I do -- with a water crisis, in addition to remaining power outages.

CAMILA BERNAL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Wolf, there's still a lot of problems here in Texas, but, nonetheless, Governor Greg Abbott now taking responsibility for the current status of the organization that manages the grid here.

In addition to that, he's promising or essentially saying that he hopes and anticipates that, by end of the night, all Texans would have power. But for people who are having to deal with this mess, they simply need to see it to believe it.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

QIANA ABRAMS, TEXAS RESIDENT: This is what we came back to. Our whole apartment! Look at the -- you all, I cannot believe this.

[16:05:01]

BERNAL (voice-over): Anger boiling over, as Texans endure more pain.

Millions are now facing a new problem, major water disruptions, this woman's apartment in Dallas flooded.

ABRAMS: And now we aren't got (EXPLETIVE DELETED). Everything that we brought here, we don't have nothing, you all.

BERNAL: Broken pipes, failing systems piling on to the pain Texans have felt since Sunday.

The White House has declared states of emergency for Texas and Oklahoma, with 22 million from Texas to Louisiana now under hard freeze warnings.

PHILIP SHELLEY, TEXAS RESIDENT: We're just left sitting in a cold dark room in the middle of the night with a crying baby and an in-pain wife. And that's what hurts the most, is, there's nothing we can really do besides sit and wait.

BERNAL: Texas Governor Greg Abbott pledging to reform the organization that runs nearly all of the state's power grid, known as ERCOT.

GOV. GREG ABBOTT (R-TX): I'm taking responsibility for the current status of ERCOT. Again, I find what's happened unacceptable.

BERNAL: And saying an investigation is under way.

ABBOTT: We have already begun the process to make sure that events like this never again happen in Texas. And that starts with reforming the agency in charge of electric reliability in Texas, which is ERCOT.

BERNAL: People trying to do all they can to stay warm, even burning a baby crib.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is the only way you can stay warm, because the power's out.

BERNAL: And this mother trying to keep her kids warm in the car.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's horrible. We have been driving around during the day with the heater on in the car just to keep warm.

BERNAL: The water disruptions on top of everything.

MAYOR STEVE ADLER (D-TX), AUSTIN: It is too much to ask of anybody. People are angry and confused and frustrated. And I am too.

BERNAL: The cities of Austin and San Antonio issuing boil-water notices Wednesday evening.

ADLER: This is a dire place. BERNAL: ERCOT saying they were actually only moments away from an even more catastrophic failure.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was seconds and minutes, given the amount of generation that was coming off the system.

BERNAL: At its peak, more than three million people were without power. The vast majority have had their power restored.

ABBOTT: There continue to be approximately 325,000 Texans without power.

BERNAL: Some may be days away from getting it back. And people here want answers now.

RACHEL SIEGAL, TEXAS RESIDENT: I expect a full apology as to how this has been handled. And I expect some sort of solution so that this doesn't happen again.

BERNAL: And in the midst of the chaos, Texas Senator Ted Cruz leaving the state. Cruz and his family were photographed on a flight to Cancun, Mexico. His explanation, his daughters wanted to take a trip, and wanting to be a good dad, he flew down with them, adding: "My team and I will continue using all our resources to keep Texans informed and safe."

(END VIDEOTAPE)

[18:05:04]

BERNAL: And most of the people that we talked to this week have told us that they're looking forward to that investigation. They want to know what happened here and how this happened in the state of Texas.

But before the answers, before they get that investigation, they're having to deal with the problems in front of them. For about 13 million Texans, that problem is water, not just the boil-water notices, but not having any water at all.

Multiple people have now told us that they're collecting the ice, getting the snow from the ground, bringing it inside of their homes, melting it in order to use it later -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Camila Bernal in Dallas for us -- Camila, thank you very, very much.

Let's go to CNN's Severe Weather Center right now.

Our meteorologist Jennifer Gray is joining us.

Jennifer, what's the latest forecast, not just for Texas, but beyond?

JENNIFER GRAY, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Right.

We have another system that's impacting Texas right now, as well as the system that just rolled through Texas is now impacting the entire Eastern Seaboard, bringing even snow to New York City.

So, the next system that we're looking at impacting Texas bringing more snow, more freezing rain to places that have already seen it, places that could still be dealing with a burst of pipes for the coming days, because we still have temperatures below freezing for tonight and many of these areas tomorrow as well.

The current snow depth right now across Texas, Louisiana, Arkansas looks like this. You can see four to six inches, that huge swathe, up to eight inches, and then the bullseye right through Arkansas of about a foot of snow.

We have dealt with some serious cold and broken records across the board, more than 1,000 record low minimums broken, more than 2,500 record low maximums broken, current temperatures right now right at 30 degrees in Dallas, 32 Austin, San Antonio.

Dallas and San Antonio haven't been above freezing since the middle part of last week. And more cold on the way. More than 60 cold record temperatures could be broken in the next day or so.

Here are high temperatures tomorrow. We do start to rebound finally across Texas. But we do have a very -- another frigid night ahead of us tonight. Here's the temperature trend. That cold is going to make its way to the East. We will have very cold temperatures across the Northeast, but temperatures do warm across the Gulf Coast.

Texas should be much warmer in the coming week. Look at that. We're up to mid-60s and 70 degrees by Wednesday and Thursday, just a total 180 here. But look at the radar across the Northeast. This is the system that impacted Texas in the past couple of days. It's now impacting New York City, Boston, bringing heavy snow.

This could catapult New York to be one of the snowiest Februarys on record as well. And you can see all of the rain across the Mid- Atlantic as well and some ice and freezing rain as well, Wolf. So this has just been a mess across the board from the Gulf Coast all the way up.

BLITZER: It certainly has been.

All right, Jennifer Gray, our meteorologist, thank you very much.

Let's get some more on all of this.

Joining us now, the Houston police chief, Art Acevedo.

Chief Acevedo, thank you so much for joining us, especially during these critical days.

I know there's been some progress on restoring power, but clearly the situation where you are is still incredibly dire. How dangerous is this? How many people are still without power, running water? Give us the latest.

ART ACEVEDO, HOUSTON, TEXAS, POLICE CHIEF: Well, thanks, Wolf. Good to be on. Thanks for having me.

But it's still -- we're still not out of the woods. We've got some very cold weather tonight. We have a hard freeze warning tonight to about 9:00 in the morning. We still have folks without electricity, and we have a lot of Houstonians without water.

Now, that water is slowly being restored. My own house, I stopped by real quick to check on my son and check the water. And we actually had a little drip going. So there's hope.

But on the way here, monitored radio traffic, where we have thousands of people lined up for water and for food. And we're on our way now to help manage the crowds. But we're not out of the woods. But we're in a better place today than we were yesterday.

BLITZER: Are you OK? Have had heat in your home?

ACEVEDO: We have been fortunate. We had heat, but we have had no water. And, actually, I have been here most of the time. But we did have a pipe break, but been blessed, being in better shape than a lot of our fellow Houstonians in Texas.

And I don't know about you. My heart's been aching seeing some of these stories. And I hope that the American people that have not been hurt by this storm will remember to help us get our community back on their feet in the upcoming days and weeks.

BLITZER: That's so, so important. All of our hearts are aching, what we see, these pictures of what's going on in Texas right now, including in your city of Houston.

You said that some Houston police officers are actually working 24- hour shifts. I assume you are as well. What type of calls are you responding to? Are you guys stretched too thin?

[18:10:03]

ACEVEDO: We have been stretched thin, too thin for years here. We have not grown as a police department for -- from 5,300 for over 20 years, even though our city continues to explode in population.

But we are all hands-on deck. Everyone's working. Everyone's in uniform. Everyone's been out and about. And not only are we helping to check on people and their welfare, helping with our warming centers, helping distribute water and food.

We're actually fighting crime. And I'm proud of our men and women, that they're leaving their families at home, that many of our homes have been impacted. But they're here working. That's what we do. And we're proud to serve this great community that works with us to help keep them safe.

BLITZER: A quick question before I let you go. I know you have got a lot going on, Chief.

Senator Ted Cruz of Texas, he's now back in Texas, in Houston, after a backlash over his decision to fly to Cancun with his family. You confirmed the Houston police assisted with his departure yesterday. What's your reaction to him trying to take a vacation, when so many of his fellow Texans are struggling?

ACEVEDO: Look, I mean, we're all -- we have all made poor choices, but that's for him to explain. I think it's a little tone-deaf.

And, sometimes, you got to teach your kids the word no. And this probably would have been a good time to tell your kids, no, we're blessed, but we need to wait until we get Texas back on their feet.

But, again, we have all made bad decisions sometimes. And, as a dad, maybe his heart got the best of him.

BLITZER: Yes, he should have consulted with you. Obviously, you would have given him some good advice.

Chief Acevedo, good luck to you. Good luck to everyone in Houston right now.

ACEVEDO: Thank you.

BLITZER: Thanks so much for joining us.

Just ahead: Will Johnson & Johnson's new vaccine wind up being two doses, instead of one? We're going to tell you about the new information we're learning when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:15:37]

BLITZER: We have more breaking news we're following right now on President Biden's Iran policy.

The State Department has just said the United States would -- repeat -- would accept an invitation by the European Union for group talks with Iran.

Let's go to our senior White House correspondent, Phil Mattingly.

Phil, could this be the beginning of a new nuclear deal potentially with Iran? Remember, the Trump administration broke the old nuclear deal that was worked out during the Obama administration.

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Wolf, it's certainly a significant step in that direction.

And we don't know how the Iranians will react up to this point. But the Biden administration, particularly Secretary of State Antony Blinken, making clear the United States is willing to sit down through the lens of the P5-plus-one negotiations, a group that essentially got together permanent members of the U.N. Security Council and helped draft and broker the Iran agreement from back in 2015.

Essentially, this is the first step. This is a step everybody's been waiting for over the course of the last four weeks, where President Biden has made clear the U.S. will get back into compliance with the Iran nuclear deal if the Iranians take the first step and do so themselves.

The U.S. now saying they are willing to sit down, a State Department official also saying that some of the travel restrictions on Iranian diplomats in New York will be lifted as well.

It's not being looked at by State Department officials as a concession, so much as it is a necessity if talks are to reopen. And that obviously is a necessity, given where things stand. Just next week, Wolf, the Iranians are expected to curb more nuclear inspections to their facilities. The U.S. right now taking the first step. It will depend on what Iran does in terms of what happens next but making very clear that they want talks to begin, they want talks to start.

Where those talks will end up, though, still an open question, Wolf.

BLITZER: Yes, an important open question.

As you know, Phil, the White House just unveiled a brand-new sweeping immigration bill that would create a path to citizenship for the millions of undocumented immigrants right now in the United States. But how difficult will it be to get this legislation passed?

MATTINGLY: Yes, there are no shortage of hurdles.

And I think the White House is aware of that. President Biden is aware of that. However, this is delivering on a campaign promise. He wanted immigration reform to be a top-tier agenda item. He laid out on his first day in office what he wanted to see in an immigration reform bill.

And, today, House and Senate Democrats delivered, actually introducing that bill. However, there are no Republican co-sponsors. And while the cornerstone of this legislation is that eight-year pathway to citizenship for the currently 11 million undocumented immigrants in the country, it is sweeping, it is large, by far, if it were signed into law, the biggest changes to immigration law in nearly 30 years.

But without Republican support, particularly in the United States Senate, it doesn't necessarily have a path forward.

One key element missing in terms of at least the sweep of this plan is significant border security. It includes some border security, but not to the scale Republicans have pushed for in past iterations of these negotiations. That would likely have to change.

Another key element here is whether it stays as one large piece of legislation or whether it gets broken apart. President Biden in the CNN town hall acknowledged that that was a possibility, breaking it apart, going piece by piece. Right now, Democrats on Capitol Hill are not pushing for that. They want to try and get as much as they can in a single package.

But, again, Wolf, without Republican support, this doesn't move forward. And we have seen over the course of the last 20 years, 2005, 2013, several times during the Trump administration, immigration efforts get right up to the line and then fall apart.

So, what this is intended for is not to be the final piece of legislation, not to be what ends up on President Biden's desk, but something to start the conversation, to start negotiations to see where things can end up.

The Biden administration, President Biden himself are realists in terms of whether or not this is coming anytime soon. They expect this to take time, but they at least want the negotiations to start to see what they can get -- what they can end up with -- Wolf.

BLITZER: As all of us know, comprehensive immigration reform long overdue. We really need this.

Phil Mattingly, thank you very much for that report.

Joining us now, the chairman of the House Democratic Caucus, Congressman Hakeem Jeffries of New York.

Congressman, thank you so much for joining us.

Let me get your reaction. President Biden has hinted he's actually opened to passing immigration bills piecemeal, in piecemeal form. Is that, from your perspective, the most realistic pathway to getting it done?

REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES (D-NY): Well, I think, as Speaker Pelosi indicated earlier today, we're going to explore our -- all options, with the focus being on fixing our broken immigration system.

Obviously, we want to be able to do it in a bipartisan way, in a way that brings Americans together, anchored in the principles of us as Americans being a nation of immigrants, out of many, one.

[18:20:04]

That's what makes America a great country at the end of the day, the fact that so many people from across the world come here, work hard to lift themselves up, their families and their communities. We want to do immigration reform in a way that grows the economy, strengthens border security, but does it in a smart way, using technology.

And also, Wolf, one of the things that was so impressive about the bill that was introduced earlier today is that it would address the challenges of migration from the Central American, Northern Triangle countries of Guatemala, Honduras, and El Salvador, where a lot of the migration is coming from, rooted in the corruption and the violence and the poverty and the climate disruption that's taken place in those countries.

BLITZER: The immigration bill, as you well know, Congressmen, will face an uphill battle with Republicans.

Just how much will President Biden need to prioritize this to make it a reality? He's got so many other things on his agenda, beginning right now with the COVID pandemic, the emergency relief package. He wants to do a huge infrastructure deal. What do you think?

JEFFRIES: Well, our focus right now is on making sure that we pass the American Rescue Plan, the $1.9 trillion plan that will provide the necessary relief to everyday Americans who have been struggling through this pandemic.

This is a once-in-a-century pandemic, with a lot of pain and suffering and death being experienced by the American people, particularly in communities of color, like those I represent, immigrant communities, parts of Indian country throughout America. But all Americans have suffered in different ways.

And so we want to crush the virus by making sure that everyone can get vaccinated in a safe and effective fashion, provide direct relief to the American people, who have been struggling through food insecurity or unemployment, on the brink of homelessness, and certainly make sure that we increase those direct payment survival checks to $2,000, and ultimately lay the foundation.

That bill is going to get passed, in my view, by mid-March. And that's a good thing.

And then, of course, President Biden has indicated that there are a whole host of other issues that he would like to tackle, comprehensive immigration reform being significant among them.

BLITZER: What about the $15 minimum wage? Is that going to be included in the emergency COVID relief package? As you know, the parliamentarian in the House has to decide whether it can be.

JEFFRIES: Well, I think the decision ultimately is going to be made by the Senate in terms of the reconciliation process and the Byrd Rule.

The speaker and I think the overwhelming majority of House Democrats support the inclusion of a $15 minimum wage as part of the bill that we passed out of the House of Representatives. It's certainly my intention to support that approach.

The notion that the federal minimum wage right now is $7.25 per hour, so that you can work a full week, a full month, a full year of employment, and still essentially live in poverty for a family of four, that's not America, particularly when we are the wealthiest country in the history of the world.

So, I think it's the right thing to do. It does relate and have budget impacts, I believe, but, ultimately, it will fall to the Senate parliamentarian to make the determination as to whether it's compliant with the rules of reconciliation.

BLITZER: And, as I keep pointing out, that $7.25 cent minimum wage, that was passed back in 2009, what, 11, 12 years or so ago, and there's been inflation. It needs to go up.

If this $15 goes up, it'll go up in stages, beginning with $9.50 immediately after it's passed. And, annually, there will be increases, but gradually getting in 2025 to $15 an hour.

So, we will watch it closely. Obviously, this is very important.

Congressman Hakeem Jeffries of New York, as usual, thanks very much.

JEFFRIES: Thank you very much, Wolf.

BLITZER: Just ahead: We're getting new details right now on how the one-dose Johnson & Johnson vaccine may add a second shot.

We will be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:28:38]

BLITZER: We're following all the breaking news on how millions of Texans are suffering through a deadly deep freeze, after days without power.

Tonight, the governor, Greg Abbott, says he just signed a major new disaster declaration and is awaiting approval by President Biden, this as severe winter weather across the country is hampering the COVID-19 vaccine rollout.

The White House is reporting delays in vaccine shipments and deliveries.

CNN's Nick Watt has our report.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOSEPH DIVINCENZO JR., ESSEX COUNTY, NEW JERSEY, EXECUTIVE: We have five sites here in Essex County. Today, they are all closed down.

NICK WATT, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): That's Newark, New Jersey. Similar scene down in Houston, Texas. Every county-run vaccination site is closed.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Vaccine shots will probably start again on Friday.

WATT: More than 2,000 vaccine sites are in areas with power outages, says FEMA, vaccine delivery delays from North Carolina to California.

NATHAN FLETCHER, SAN DIEGO COUNTY, CALIFORNIA, SUPERVISOR: While it might not snow in San Diego, the snow is directly impacting San Diego.

WATT: Because snow has fallen on delivery hubs in Memphis and Louisville, Kentucky.

GOV. CHARLIE BAKER (R-MA): We're currently talking to the National Guard about -- and they will do this -- about going down to Kentucky and Tennessee, which is where this stuff is currently located, and bringing it back.

WATT: The pace of vaccination was picking up before the cold took hold. But average shots in arms every day just took a little dip.

[18:30:04]

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, CHIEF WHITE HOUSE MEDICAL ADVISER ON COVID-19: We're just going to have up for it, as soon as the weather lifts a bit, the ice melts so we can get the trucks out and people out.

WATT: Meantime, average daily COVID-19 case counts down 26 percent in just a week, still high but going down for now.

The broader impact of all we've been through, still going through, drug overdose rates rose sharply when the pandemic hit, according to early CDC data, which also reports that U.S. life expectancy fell a full year first half of 2020, falling even further for Latin X and black Americans.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WATT (on camera): Now CD -- sorry, an FDA committee is going to meet next week to take a look and talk about that one-dose Johnson & Johnson vaccine. The company says that they are also expecting results from trials of that vaccine as a double dose later this year. Of course, all of the vaccine manufacturers are keeping an eye on those variants, figuring out if the variants are going to mean they're going to have to tweak their vaccines. Wolf?

BLITZER: All right, Nick Watt in L.A. for us. Nick, thank you very much.

Let's get some more on all of this. Our Chief Medical Correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta is joining us. Sanjay, you just heard Nick's report that extreme weather is causing serious delays in vaccine shipments. For those who were awaiting their second dose and are being told that that's got to be postponed, even though they were scheduled, will the vaccine -- will less effective if they can't get it on time?

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Not necessarily, Wolf. I mean, I think the way to think about this is that the vaccines, the Moderna and the Pfizer, the two that have been authorized, were studied a very specific way. Give one dose and then wait three or four weeks depending on the vaccine for the second dose. So, we know the data. But it's not to say that, you know, if for some reason the second dose had to go at a slightly different time that it should make a big difference. We just don't have the data to show that because it was trialed a specific way.

You may remember, Wolf, the CDC came out and said a couple weeks ago that even if you wait up to six weeks, 42 days, it should still be okay. And if it's even longer than that doesn't mean you need to restart the series again. So, I mean, get the vaccine as close to the second dose date as possible. But, obviously, problems like this you can probably extend it out without having much of a problem.

BLITZER: I'm sure a lot of our viewers who are waiting for their second dose are happy to hear that.

GUPTA: Yes.

BLITZER: Johnson & Johnson, as you know, they're vaccine has not yet received emergency use authorization here in the United States. It now says it should have results from its two-dose vaccine trial, originally, they said they needed one dose, by the second half of 2021. Could the addition of a second dose offer potentially more protection for this new vaccine?

GUPTA: Yes, I mean, that's the hope, Wolf. And we've been following this all along, the second dose sort of trial. That actually started back in November. So it's been going on for a while. They sort of wanted to have various options. The single dose, for all the reasons we all know, obviously, has a lot of advantages.

But if the first dose of these vaccines sort of primes the immune system, it's the second dose that can sort of boost it. And whether it boosts the immune system in terms of overall strength, antibody neutralizing activity, or in terms of length, so that your protection just lasts longer, either of those could be a good thing.

I think what they got to figure out, Wolf, and I think this is part of the trial is, can we add the second dose, it is incrementally better. Is it better enough to warrant now recommending that for everybody? Did it just improve a little bit, or did it make a significant difference?

You know, other companies are trying the same thing. Moderna's trying a booster, Novavax is talking about a booster. So, I think we're going to hear more and more about that.

BLITZER: As we should, let's hope for the best. Dr. Sanjay Gupta, thank you very, very much.

Just ahead, dozens of Capitol police officers here in the nation's Capitol, are now under investigation and several have been suspended amid a probe into their conduct during the January 6th Capitol Hill insurrection.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:35:00]

BLITZER: Now we're getting new information about the investigation into the alleged role of some, some U.S. Capitol police officers in the January 6th riots. CNN's Whitney Wild is joining us with more on the breaking new story. Whitney, so what are these officers suspected of doing?

WHITNEY WILD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, that's what we don't know. At this point we know that there are six officers who have been suspended with pay. In addition, there were 29 officers who have been placed under investigation. We've asked USCP for more detail on what the department thinks they did and we're waiting to hear back.

This comes after CNN had previously reported that at least ten officers were under investigation for their actions on January 6th. At the time, Ohio Representative Tim Ryan told CNN that two officers had been suspended, one after putting on a make America great again hat and another after taking a selfie with rioters. But, again, we're still learning what these other officers are accused of doing, whether or not the number of officers who have been suspended will increase, at this point though, limited to just 35.

And I think it's important what you say about some officers, because the overwhelming storylines coming out of that day have been that those officers displayed immense heroism and this is just a small fraction of some actions that are being reviewed, Wolf.

[18:40:04]

BLITZER: Yes, a very good point. Whitney, thanks so much for that report.

We're following breaking news. A source now tells CNN that former President Trump has denied a request from Nikki Haley for a sit-down meeting at Mar-a-Lago in Palm Beach, Florida. We're joined by our Chief Political Analyst, Gloria Borger and former Congresswoman Mia Love, she's a CNN Political Commentator.

You know, Gloria, give us some context here, why is Trump giving his former U.S. ambassador to the United Nations the cold shoulder right now?

GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, because she gave an interview to Politico in which she basically trashed him. And, you know, after months of saying, well, you know, you've got to take the good with the bad, she came out and said that the Republican Party has to acknowledge that Donald Trump let them down. She said she was angry about the way Mike Pence was treated and that she said, and let me quote here, that the president -- the former president is going to find himself further and further isolated.

Well, then she decided, and she was probably getting a lot of pushback on what she said, then she decided that she wanted to go and see the former president in Mar-a-Lago and he said, are you kidding me? I'm not going to do this. Because with Donald Trump, as you all know, there isn't any halfway. You either are in or you're out, and I think she's clearly on the out.

BLITZER: Well, that's an important point. You know, Mia, what does it tell you that Nikki Haley is trying to work her way back into Trump's good graces?

MIA LOVE, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, I think, first of all, what she said about Donald Trump is exactly right. I think she realized that the Republican Party needs new leadership. I agree with what she said in terms of Donald Trump letting us down. I also think it's very important for us to realize that the House, the majority of the House was only won by 31,000 votes, if you put them all together. And so, there's a narrow margin there. And she realizes, look, I need to find a way to gain Trump supporters without using Trump.

And I think that going to visit him and probably just having his okay is probably what she hoped for. I think that it's -- I think it's a waste of time. He is -- if you are 100 percent -- if you're not with him 100 percent, I agree with Gloria here, then you are 100 percent out. And if you see what he did to his own Mike Pence, I mean, you can look no further.

BLITZER: Yes, Mike Pence, four years, totally loyal, and all of a sudden, they're apparently not even talking right now.

Gloria, you have some new reporting, important reporting about how the Senate minority leader, Mitch McConnell, actually views his tension with Trump. What are you learning?

BORGER: Well, I think he's feeling right now that the best policy for him and for the Republicans if they want to control the Senate is to ignore the former president. I spoke with a source familiar with McConnell's thinking and he said to me, quote, if the animating question of the Republican Party is that we need more Trump, that's not going to work.

And that is exactly the way Mitch McConnell feels. He's got one goal and that is winning back the majority, but I was also told he is not, quote, going to bend the knee and go over to Mar-a-Lago to talk to the former president. I'm sure he won't be invited, by the way. But he doesn't want to talk to him, and he doesn't want to talk about him, period.

BLITZER: That's important. And, you know Mia, the number two Republican in the house, Steve Scalise, a man you know well, you're a former Republican Congresswoman from Utah, just became the most recent lawmaker to pay the former president a visit down in Palm Beach. Of course, the House minority leader made the same trip, Kevin McCarthy, to Florida first.

As I say, you worked with both of these men. What's your reaction?

LOVE: Right. Again, and both of them are my friends, and I absolutely think the Scalise going down isn't as bad. Although I don't agree with either one of them going to kiss the ring or bend the knee, I just think that Kevin McCarthy is in a position to be the leader of the Republican Party.

I do believe that they have got a bigger challenge ahead of them. Not only are they going to have to face in two years -- in less than two years Democrats coming at them in the House of Representatives during campaigns, but more importantly, they're going to have to worry about Republicans and Trump supporters and Trump himself going after Republicans.

This is a year after you win a presidential race and it's not within your party, it usually swings the other way.

[18:45:03]

I mean, you can look no further than history. This should be a time where Republicans should be in the best position to win the House of Representatives. But if they continue to have someone like Trump play into their campaigns, if they don't find a way to put them away, it's going to be a really rough time for Republicans.

BLITZER: You're almost certainly right. Mia Love, thank you very much.

Gloria Borger, thanks to you as well.

Just ahead, what NASA hopes to learn about the Red Planet after the successful landing of its most sophisticated rover yet.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:50:01]

BLITZER: Pretty amazing stuff. After a journey of nearly 300 million miles, "Perseverance", NASA's most sophisticated rover yet, successfully touched down on the surface of Mars just a short while ago. Watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Touchdown confirmed! "Perseverance" safely on the surface of Mars, ready to begin seeking the sands of past life.

(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: At this point (INAUDIBLE) "Perseverance" is continuing to transmit (INAUDIBLE)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Pretty amazing stuff as I said. For more on this, we're joined by Ken Williford. He's the deputy project scientist for NASA's Mars 2020 mission.

Ken, thank you so much for joining us.

Really an incredible accomplishment. What did that moment feel like for you and your team?

KEN WILLIFORD, DEPUTY PROJECT SCIENTIST, NASA MARS 2020 MISSION: Well, thanks for having me, Wolf. I'm so happy to be here with you all.

And I can feel it again now, just hearing the audio. I was so excited. I've got goosebumps right now. It's really a dream come true.

BLITZER: This rover "Perseverance" will be looking for signs of life on Mars. What sort of big unanswered questions could this mission answer?

WILLIFORD: Yeah, it's hard to find questions bigger than this, you know. We say it often at NASA, you know? We're asking this question: Are we alone?

And it's the kind of scientific work I've been doing for quite a while now. But I feel like I've been doing it indirectly. And here we at the beginning of a mission that really for the first time in quite a long time is tasked very directly with seeking signs of ancient life, you know?

So we want to know, are we alone here on Earth, in a cold dark universe? Or is life common? You know, does it arise whenever the conditions are right, and perhaps even -- even in our own solar system?

BLITZER: Do you think this mission, and it's successful clearly, could put us closer to actually landing humans on Mars?

WILLIFORD: No question about it. A number of the technologies that are part of Mars 2020 are directly related to the future ability to get humans safely to Mars and back.

BLITZER: We just got a tweet from President Biden on this. Let me put it up on the screen and read it and get your reaction, Ken.

Congratulations to NASA and everyone whose hard work made Perseverance's historic landing possible. Today proved once again that with the power of science and American ingenuity, nothing is beyond the realm of possibility.

And you can see Vice President Kamala Harris also posted this on Twitter: Congrats to NASA and all of their partners on their successful mission. Today's historic landing embodies our nation's perseverance-building on past accomplishments and paving the way for future missions.

So, when you hear that from the president of the United States and the vice president of the United States -- Ken, what goes through your mind?

WILLIFORD: I'm just really happy that, you know, we can have a day like today and give folks some good news and do that kind of thing. Come together, you know. This is really a big international effort.

I don't know if you know, but Mars 2020 is, is the beginning of a much larger multi-mission effort called Mars Sample Return. That is a big partnership between NASA and the European Space Agency.

So, this kind of international cooperation, this kind of scientific and engineering and public cooperation, you know, I hope it brings people together. We've all had a tough year, you know. We need all the good news we can get.

And I tell you what, this is -- this is some really, really good news.

So, I encourage, you know, all your viewers to follow along with us and join us, you know. You can go to the website mars.nasa.gov/mars2020. The team has put together a lot of different ways for you to follow along.

So I hope you do join us. A very exciting mission.

BLITZER: Very quickly, we only have a few seconds left, Ken. What's the timeline for humans going to Mars? WILLIFORD: Yeah, I don't know on that. I can tell you that the

timeline for the samples coming back which in a sense is a good technology demonstration of that is early 2030s.

BLITZER: 2030s, all right. So, that's awhile.

All right. Ken Williford, thanks to you and the entire team.

WILLIFORD: Yeah.

BLITZER: We're really grateful to you. Good luck down the road. Appreciate it very much.

WILLIFORD: Hey, thanks, Wolf.

BLITZER: And we'll have more news right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:58:53]

BLITZER: I just checked and so far -- so far over the past year, more than 492,000 Americans -- 492,000 Americans have died from the coronavirus, 492,000, and that's a huge, huge number, but it's so important to put some faces in front of those numbers. I want to share some stories of some special people who died from the coronavirus. It's so, so sad when we take a look at some of these truly wonderful people.

Blanca Stella and Juan Manuel Rodriguez of California, they were both 67 years old. They were high school sweethearts who were married for 48 years. So sadly, they died just three hours apart.

Blanca loved cooking. She loved tending to her rose garden. She loved animals. Juan loved the Beatles, mariachi music, sports and coaching.

But most of all, they loved their four children, their numerous grandchildren, and they loved each other.

Their son Juan, Jr., describes the connection between his parents this way. It wasn't two souls, it was one. May they rest in peace and may their memories be a blessing.

Thanks very much for watching.

"ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT" starts right now.